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G3X Losing traffic

torquen said:
A friend of mine was flying next to me. He was only running a transponder. When the traffic would disappear his plane would still show up but no tail number or anything. Just the diamond.
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I would share that piece of data with Garmin, as it is good troubleshooting data. The loss of the Number implies a short coming with the transmission. The other sysytem kept presenting with the limited data, but garmin did not. This implies some poor error handling code that used an all or nothing approach when deciding to call the input failed and error out the routine.

Larry
 
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lr172 said:
I would share that piece of data with Garmin, as it is good troubleshooting data. The loss of the Number implies a short coming with the transmission. The other sysytem kept presenting with the limited data, but garmin did not. This implies some poor error handling code that used an all or nothing approach when deciding to call the input failed and error out the routine.

Larry
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I just sent over another email with the information from yesterdays flight.

I sure hope this gets fixed. I could see the only way around this is to buy an extremely expensive transponder. Not something I would want to do nor think I should have to do.
 
I just completed two short flights with ground based traffic dropouts on each flight. The Garmin Pilot App. never lost the ground based traffic! TIS-B client was 66.7% and 51% at 5000 ft.
 
torquen said:
I just sent over another email with the information from yesterdays flight.

I sure hope this gets fixed. I could see the only way around this is to buy an extremely expensive transponder. Not something I would want to do nor think I should have to do.
Click to expand...

I don't think it's the Transponder; I recently did a 5 hour flight from Little Rock to Jacksonville FL. and lost my ground link nearly half of the trip. Air to Air was up 100% but TIS B was only 42%. G3X Touch paired with a GTX45R. Latest software on both. It sure looks like it is a G3x issue.
 
Wonderboy said:
I don't think it's the Transponder; I recently did a 5 hour flight from Little Rock to Jacksonville FL. and lost my ground link nearly half of the trip. Air to Air was up 100% but TIS B was only 42%. G3X Touch paired with a GTX45R. Latest software on both. It sure looks like it is a G3x issue.
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So just to be clear, even with your air to air at 100% all your traffic disappears off the g3x?
 
torquen said:
So just to be clear, even with your air to air at 100% all your traffic disappears off the g3x?
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Well, I don't know what I'm not painting. I do know I'm getting drop outs of my ground TIS-B data link for extended periods of time. Air to air is reliable for other aircraft broadcasting ADS-B data. I have not compared a tablet display, running concurrently, like others in this thread.
 
Good Morning,

We will roll out GDU 4XX v9.32 in the coming days. This update will include an update that will address the intermittent "No TIS-B Service" and associated loss of traffic information. Thank you for the feedback provided that assisted us in diagnosing the problem here.

Thanks,

Justin
 
g3xpert said:
Good Morning,

We will roll out GDU 4XX v9.32 in the coming days. This update will include an update that will address the intermittent "No TIS-B Service" and associated loss of traffic information. Thank you for the feedback provided that assisted us in diagnosing the problem here.

Thanks,

Justin
Click to expand...
Justin, thank you for the information! I hope this solves the issue. I’ll install right away once it hits the site.
 
g3xpert said:
Good Morning,

We will roll out GDU 4XX v9.32 in the coming days. This update will include an update that will address the intermittent "No TIS-B Service" and associated loss of traffic information. Thank you for the feedback provided that assisted us in diagnosing the problem here.

Thanks,

Justin
Click to expand...
Thanks for closing out this ticket. Looking forward to renewed confidence in the G3x traffic display.
 
g3xpert said:
Good Morning,

We will roll out GDU 4XX v9.32 in the coming days. This update will include an update that will address the intermittent "No TIS-B Service" and associated loss of traffic information. Thank you for the feedback provided that assisted us in diagnosing the problem here.

Thanks,

Justin
Click to expand...
when will we see this for the 3xx units? I have been providing inpput on this problem for 3 years and a 4xx update does me no good. I also would like to have reliable traffic on my G3X.

Larry
 
Received an email from Garmin today saying the engineers have a fix that will come out in an update. To watch the Garmin update page for the release “mid-year”.
 
lr172 said:
when will we see this for the 3xx units? I have been providing inpput on this problem for 3 years and a 4xx update does me no good. I also would like to have reliable traffic on my G3X.

Larry
Click to expand...
Larry, I would definitely give Garmin a call and inform them to include the 300 series as well. The email I got said the update won’t release until “mid-year” so based off that they should have plenty of time to include all models.
 
I submitted a ticket to the FAA last week with a writeup of the issue. Just received the following response from them.

Thank you for your report. We have confirmed that the indications of low levels of TISB service that you are seeing are due to a software issue in one of the processes in the ground system. The resolution of this issue is underway, but we do not yet have a firm date for deployment of the fix.

This issue is inhibiting the generation of TISB service status messages, which avionics use to identify times TISB service may not be available (when TISB service status messages are not received, avionics will infer that TISB service may not be available).

It is important to note that this issue is not affecting your actual TISB service. You will continue to receive TISB target uplink messages when a TISB target is in your vicinity, even if you are not receiving TISB service status messages.

We will advise you when the software fix is ready to be deployed.
 
AaronG said:
I submitted a ticket to the FAA last week with a writeup of the issue. Just received the following response from them.

Thank you for your report. We have confirmed that the indications of low levels of TISB service that you are seeing are due to a software issue in one of the processes in the ground system. The resolution of this issue is underway, but we do not yet have a firm date for deployment of the fix.

This issue is inhibiting the generation of TISB service status messages, which avionics use to identify times TISB service may not be available (when TISB service status messages are not received, avionics will infer that TISB service may not be available).

It is important to note that this issue is not affecting your actual TISB service. You will continue to receive TISB target uplink messages when a TISB target is in your vicinity, even if you are not receiving TISB service status messages.

We will advise you when the software fix is ready to be deployed.
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A little bit of history repeating 🫤
 
I just checked the G3x update page and 9.32 is out. Hopefully I can get it loaded into my plane and give it a go between the rain.
 
Well I hope the software fix does it, but I would like to offer a couple additional data points just in case there are multiple problems going on. It appears that the G3xperts read this thread, so maybe this will be helpful.

I have a GDL-39 and GTX-23-ES transponder connected to dual GDU-460s. One GDU is RS232 connected to the GDL-39 and the second is Bluetooth connected.

When on the ground, even in my hanger with the door open, I see traffic 24 miles out via ADS-B, and there is never an interruption on the G3X screen or an iPad connected to the GDL-39. However, when in flight I get traffic dropouts on both GDU-460’s anytime I see the TIS-A notification on the traffic screen. It feels like getting TIS-A data interrupts the traffic data from ADSB. During this time I see no traffic on the GDU460’s but a connected iPad will still show traffic.

TIS-A data comes in via the GTX-23-ES transponder, while ADSB and TIS-B comes in over the GDL-39. So an iPad connected to the GDL-39 does not get TIS-A, which would explain why it is not affected during the dropout on the G3X.
 
Jeffblak said:
Well I hope the software fix does it, but I would like to offer a couple additional data points just in case there are multiple problems going on. It appears that the G3xperts read this thread, so maybe this will be helpful.

I have a GDL-39 and GTX-23-ES transponder connected to dual GDU-460s. One GDU is RS232 connected to the GDL-39 and the second is Bluetooth connected.

When on the ground, even in my hanger with the door open, I see traffic 24 miles out via ADS-B, and there is never an interruption on the G3X screen or an iPad connected to the GDL-39. However, when in flight I get traffic dropouts on both GDU-460’s anytime I see the TIS-A notification on the traffic screen. It feels like getting TIS-A data interrupts the traffic data from ADSB. During this time I see no traffic on the GDU460’s but a connected iPad will still show traffic.

TIS-A data comes in via the GTX-23-ES transponder, while ADSB and TIS-B comes in over the GDL-39. So an iPad connected to the GDL-39 does not get TIS-A, which would explain why it is not affected during the dropout on the G3X.
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The G3X system will prefer TIS-A over ADSB data. The solution is to go into the remote xponder configuration and disable TIS-A.
 
mburch said:
This is true only when TIS-B data is not available, which makes sense when you think about how the various traffic services operate.
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Thanks for clarifying Matt! My memory is starting to get foggy on the details since I don't have a bird anymore. I went back into my notes and found this:

"G3X Traffic Priority:

1. GTS 800 Active Traffic System

2. GDL39/39R ADS-B traffic system receiving both air-to-air and TIS-B

3. GTX23ES/GTX330ES TIS-A traffic system receiving TIS-A

4. GDL39/39R ADS-B traffic system receiving only air-to-air"

While there are new products since then, I assume the general concept of priority remains the same?
 
Jeffblak said:
Well I hope the software fix does it, but I would like to offer a couple additional data points just in case there are multiple problems going on. It appears that the G3xperts read this thread, so maybe this will be helpful.

I have a GDL-39 and GTX-23-ES transponder connected to dual GDU-460s. One GDU is RS232 connected to the GDL-39 and the second is Bluetooth connected.

When on the ground, even in my hanger with the door open, I see traffic 24 miles out via ADS-B, and there is never an interruption on the G3X screen or an iPad connected to the GDL-39. However, when in flight I get traffic dropouts on both GDU-460’s anytime I see the TIS-A notification on the traffic screen. It feels like getting TIS-A data interrupts the traffic data from ADSB. During this time I see no traffic on the GDU460’s but a connected iPad will still show traffic.

TIS-A data comes in via the GTX-23-ES transponder, while ADSB and TIS-B comes in over the GDL-39. So an iPad connected to the GDL-39 does not get TIS-A, which would explain why it is not affected during the dropout on the G3X.
Click to expand...
I also have GDL39R with GTX23ES transponder, and I also experienced “many” incidents of traffic dropout. I changed my config to turn off TIS-A on the transponder, and it has eliminated traffic dropout - including a 4 hour trip this weekend. Anecdotal, but a very positive improvement.
 
Thank you for the great responses. I was thinking that turning off TIS-A may solve this but had not tried that yet. I will give it a try and report back. It does seem like TIS-A is taking priority over ADSB / TIS-B rather than combining them. But very little traffic is being shown with TIS-A when this happens.
 
I flew from the Sacramento area to southern CA this past weekend after the new update. I didn’t have any drop outs even going through some remote areas.

Just Incase though, where do you turn off the tis-a at on the 23es remote transponder?
 
torquen said:
I flew from the Sacramento area to southern CA this past weekend after the new update. I didn’t have any drop outs even going through some remote areas.

Just Incase though, where do you turn off the tis-a at on the 23es remote transponder?
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It’s in the config mode on the G3X, go to the remote xponder settings.
 
Wanted to let everyone know that Garmin pulled the 9.32 shortly after I grabbed it off their site. It’s throwing an LRU message. I called and they said they put 9.31 back on the site and the new update should be out shortly that doesn’t have the bug that sets the LRU message.

I flew with it several hrs and didn’t have any issues.
 
yes, I'm a bit late to the party ;)
Still running 9.31 on the 3GX, I too noticed loosing traffic on the GDU470 whilst it was still displayed on the GNX375...
 
torquen said:
Wanted to let everyone know that Garmin pulled the 9.32 shortly after I grabbed it off their site. It’s throwing an LRU message. I called and they said they put 9.31 back on the site and the new update should be out shortly that doesn’t have the bug that sets the LRU message.

I flew with it several hrs and didn’t have any issues.
Click to expand...
Hey, please add scratch pad, it should be quick......
 
I finally got out flying today and I am having the same issue. Traffic will be shown and then disappear. Sometimes a minute or two later, it comes back. It is very distracting. The interesting thing is it was showing up on my ipad with Foreflight connected to the Garmin G3x system and GPS antenna.
 
Flew for a short flight today. I’m still dropping traffic with the updated software 9.32 and my phone or iPad still shows the traffic.
Doesn’t seem to be doing it as often and seems to drop out just after takeoff even though I show traffic while I’m on the ground.
I’m not sure if Garmin has this completely fixed. I’ll wait to send them a message after the update is placed back on their site Incase they have changed anything.
 
The problem that Garmin is working is different than many of us are experiencing. I think whats happening is that the G3X can’t display traffic from more than one device at a time, and it prioritizes a device based on a fixed set of rules. ADSB (GDL-xx) wins when both air to air and TIS-B are being received. But with ADSB air to air only, then TIS-A (from the transponder) takes priority when it’s present. The problem is that TIS-A only includes aircraft with mode A or mode C transponders, which are now very few. So, it appears like all traffic is lost. The option is to disable TIS-A in the transponder if you are running a GDL-xx and have a TIS-A capable transponder like the GTX-23-ES.

This is part of a post by G3xpert back in 2016:

A couple of things to check.

We know you have a GDL39, a GTX 330ES transponder, and a GPS 20A installed with your G3X system, so you actually have two traffic receivers. You receive TIS-A traffic from your GTX330ES and ADS-B traffic/weather from your GDL39.

As you probably know from the pilot guide and our past postings, if both of your traffic receivers are enabled, the G3X system will prioritize them and use one or the other depending on which might be providing the best traffic information.

G3X Traffic Priority
1. GDL39/39R ADS-B traffic system receiving both air-to-air and TIS-B
2. GTX23ES/GTX330ES TIS-A traffic system receiving TIS-A
3. GDL39/39R ADS-B traffic system receiving only air-to-air

You will note that full ADS-B traffic with TIS-B ground uplinks takes priority over GTX330ES TIS-A traffic, but for those probably rare times when you are receiving TIS-A traffic and not TIS-B traffic, the TIS-A traffic takes priority and this traffic does not include Flight ID.

Many of us disable TIS-A traffic on the Mode S transponder (I did this in 2012) because ADS-B traffic is almost always better and we don't like ever seeing the system switch to TIS-A traffic. You might do the same (via the transponder configuration on the GTX330ES) to keep things simple.

Secondly, and probably more importantly, you might want to check your Traffic settings for the Map page. From the MFD map page select Menu, Set Up Map, and then select the Traffic Map Setup page.

From this page you may separately control the map range dependent declutter settings for the traffic symbol and traffic label (Flight ID). The default setting is Auto which will remove the traffic symbol and label at MFD map range settings of 12 nm and above. I personally find this Auto decluttering too aggressive, and change mine from Auto to a fixed 30 nm on both to keep the traffic symbol and label visible on the map even when zooming out quite a bit.

Another tip. The two traffic symbol icons on the upper right of the map which show if you are receiving TIS-B ground uplink services and air-to-air traffic also declutter (are removed) when the traffic indications are removed from the map, so this is a quick and easy way to tell if your map is zoomed out so far that traffic has been removed to decrease map clutter.

Thanks,
Steve
 
Jeffblak said:
The problem that Garmin is working is different than many of us are experiencing. I think whats happening is that the G3X can’t display traffic from more than one device at a time, and it prioritizes a device based on a fixed set of rules. ADSB (GDL-xx) wins when both air to air and TIS-B are being received. But with ADSB air to air only, then TIS-A (from the transponder) takes priority when it’s present. The problem is that TIS-A only includes aircraft with mode A or mode C transponders, which are now very few. So, it appears like all traffic is lost. The option is to disable TIS-A in the transponder if you are running a GDL-xx and have a TIS-A capable transponder like the GTX-23-ES.

This is part of a post by G3xpert back in 2016:

A couple of things to check.

We know you have a GDL39, a GTX 330ES transponder, and a GPS 20A installed with your G3X system, so you actually have two traffic receivers. You receive TIS-A traffic from your GTX330ES and ADS-B traffic/weather from your GDL39.

As you probably know from the pilot guide and our past postings, if both of your traffic receivers are enabled, the G3X system will prioritize them and use one or the other depending on which might be providing the best traffic information.

G3X Traffic Priority
1. GDL39/39R ADS-B traffic system receiving both air-to-air and TIS-B
2. GTX23ES/GTX330ES TIS-A traffic system receiving TIS-A
3. GDL39/39R ADS-B traffic system receiving only air-to-air

You will note that full ADS-B traffic with TIS-B ground uplinks takes priority over GTX330ES TIS-A traffic, but for those probably rare times when you are receiving TIS-A traffic and not TIS-B traffic, the TIS-A traffic takes priority and this traffic does not include Flight ID.

Many of us disable TIS-A traffic on the Mode S transponder (I did this in 2012) because ADS-B traffic is almost always better and we don't like ever seeing the system switch to TIS-A traffic. You might do the same (via the transponder configuration on the GTX330ES) to keep things simple.

Secondly, and probably more importantly, you might want to check your Traffic settings for the Map page. From the MFD map page select Menu, Set Up Map, and then select the Traffic Map Setup page.

From this page you may separately control the map range dependent declutter settings for the traffic symbol and traffic label (Flight ID). The default setting is Auto which will remove the traffic symbol and label at MFD map range settings of 12 nm and above. I personally find this Auto decluttering too aggressive, and change mine from Auto to a fixed 30 nm on both to keep the traffic symbol and label visible on the map even when zooming out quite a bit.

Another tip. The two traffic symbol icons on the upper right of the map which show if you are receiving TIS-B ground uplink services and air-to-air traffic also declutter (are removed) when the traffic indications are removed from the map, so this is a quick and easy way to tell if your map is zoomed out so far that traffic has been removed to decrease map clutter.

Thanks,
Steve
Click to expand...
 
I went in and took the ‘tis-a traffic out of the transponder and with 9.32 software I’m back to ADSB in working 100% of the time on my g3x screen. Flew up to the lower mountains today and never lost traffic one time.

So I would recommend going to the 9.32 and the. Getting rid of tis-a once the 9.32 is back up on Garmins site.
 
Update from Garmin:

"We have a fix for the traffic "drop-off" issue that is supposed to come out in G3X Touch version 9.40. This is a pretty major update package, so I am not sure when it will be released but they are trying for an April time frame. We did see your VAF post and actually I think it helped. We were able to get more data from more customers in the field. So thank you!"

Thank you Garmin and thank you VAF and everyone that posted their experiences related to this!
 
jquayle said:
Update from Garmin:

"We have a fix for the traffic "drop-off" issue that is supposed to come out in G3X Touch version 9.40.
Click to expand...

Not version 9.40 but version 9.33, which is already available:

g3xpert said:
This release includes a few maintenance updates we have made to the display that will improve TIS-B Traffic performance to address a few problems that have been reported over the past few months. We appreciate your patience and effort in assisting us with the resolution for this problem.
Click to expand...
 
Hmm

That email was just this morning (March 20) and 9.33 has been out since Fed 12. Perhaps there’s more to the solution than what was in 9.33?

🤷‍♂️
 
Double checked.

Katie replied "The official engineering ticket still says 9.40 but maybe they found a way to sneak it into 9.33."
I just installed 9.33 this week. Haven't had a chance to test it yet to see if it's resolved in there or not, but even if not - nice to know it's definitely supposed to be in the next release!
 
jquayle said:
Double checked.

Katie replied "The official engineering ticket still says 9.40 but maybe they found a way to sneak it into 9.33."
I just installed 9.33 this week. Haven't had a chance to test it yet to see if it's resolved in there or not, but even if not - nice to know it's definitely supposed to be in the next release!
Click to expand...

I’ve been flying behind 9.33 for a week with the same traffic issues.
 
That goes along with what Katie @ g3xpert said.

Glad to hear it's going to be in the next release. Also kind of excited that 9.40 is supposed to be 'a pretty major update'
Looking forward to what else they've added in there.


JQ
 
I’m really hoping the fix is in 9.40, because I tried 9.33 last weekend with no change to my issue. With Gtx330 disabled, I get air-to-air, but still intermittent ground, even though it shows reception from many ground stations, and I still get the weather. ForeFlight still shows the traffic. I’m really starting to think this is an issue with the FAA software not properly transmitting the TISB service status messages combined with the G3X software’s response to this lack of signal.
 
AaronG said:
I’m really hoping the fix is in 9.40, because I tried 9.33 last weekend with no change to my issue. With Gtx330 disabled, I get air-to-air, but still intermittent ground, even though it shows reception from many ground stations, and I still get the weather. ForeFlight still shows the traffic. I’m really starting to think this is an issue with the FAA software not properly transmitting the TISB service status messages combined with the G3X software’s response to this lack of signal.
Click to expand...
Yes, I upgraded to 9.33 and I have GDU 460 and GDU 470 portraits with a 330ES and a GPS 20A.
Still have ground station traffic drop outs just like always. Hoping 9.40 is the fix.
 
bhester said:
Yes, I upgraded to 9.33 and I have GDU 460 and GDU 470 portraits with a 330ES and a GPS 20A.
Still have ground station traffic drop outs just like always. Hoping 9.40 is the fix.
Click to expand...
Bobby,

For many years the TIS-B client services which provide uplinked TIS-B traffic (mode C only non ADS-B out aircraft in radar contact) in my area was rock solid and the TIS-B client % number on my ADS-B Out reports was nearly always in the 80% to 100% range.

Beginning late in 2023, I saw frequent TIS-B service drop outs at altitudes that would previously have been rock solid. The TIS-B traffic icon on my G3X Touch system (and Aera 760) was showing that this service was coming and going. The TIS-B client % on my ADS-B Out reports has mostly been down in the 30% range since this service interruption started, and sometimes less. Traffic data from both of my traffic receivers (GNX 375 and GDL 52R) were showing the same TIS-B service drop outs in flight.

The ability to see and avoid air-to-air ADS-B Out equipped traffic has always been rock solid and was never affected by these drop outs in TIS-B services.

I recently reported this to the FAA and provided an example recent flight for a lengthy practice approach where the TIS-B client % used to typically be above 80% and was now 26%.

A systems engineer studied the flight, contacted me, and confirmed that this was a known issue with the ground station software and that a new software version had been developed and was being tested. He has requested that initial deployment be in the Kansas City area where I operate most and expects it to be deployed later this Spring. He will reach back out to me when it is available in my area.

I have not had air-to-air traffic problems with G3X Touch V9.33 or previous versions, just the ground station issues which affect only TIS-B traffic which has been an issue for many months for which the G3X Touch software is not responsible.

Steve
 
Longez said:
Bobby,

For many years the TIS-B client services which provide uplinked TIS-B traffic (mode C only non ADS-B out aircraft in radar contact) in my area was rock solid and the TIS-B client % number on my ADS-B Out reports was nearly always in the 80% to 100% range.

Beginning late in 2023, I saw frequent TIS-B service drop outs at altitudes that would previously have been rock solid. The TIS-B traffic icon on my G3X Touch system (and Aera 760) was showing that this service was coming and going. The TIS-B client % on my ADS-B Out reports has mostly been down in the 30% range since this service interruption started, and sometimes less. Traffic data from both of my traffic receivers (GNX 375 and GDL 52R) were showing the same TIS-B service drop outs in flight.

The ability to see and avoid air-to-air ADS-B Out equipped traffic has always been rock solid and was never affected by these drop outs in TIS-B services.

I recently reported this to the FAA and provided an example recent flight for a lengthy practice approach where the TIS-B client % used to typically be above 80% and was now 26%.

A systems engineer studied the flight, contacted me, and confirmed that this was a known issue with the ground station software and that a new software version had been developed and was being tested. He has requested that initial deployment be in the Kansas City area where I operate most and expects it to be deployed later this Spring. He will reach back out to me when it is available in my area.

I have not had air-to-air traffic problems with G3X Touch V9.33 or previous versions, just the ground station issues which affect only TIS-B traffic which has been an issue for many months for which the G3X Touch software is not responsible.

Steve
Click to expand...
This is exactly what I suspected was happening in my area but haven’t had a way to figure it out. I wish there was some type of ADSB service interruption map available. The worst part is that they don’t let us know that their equipment is not performing as it should. So we end up scratching our heads trying to fix problems with our equipment which does not even have problems. Thanks for letting us know!
Keep us updated.
 
I flew yesterday and I am still having the same issue. I say at least 50% of the traffic comes and goes. It is very distracting seeing traffic and then it goes away. You cant ignore it - it showed traffic so you have to keep looking until you see it or turn away and hope they didnt have the same trouble. I hope they can get it fixed.
 
rockwoodrv9 said:
I flew yesterday and I am still having the same issue. I say at least 50% of the traffic comes and goes. It is very distracting seeing traffic and then it goes away. You cant ignore it - it showed traffic so you have to keep looking until you see it or turn away and hope they didnt have the same trouble. I hope they can get it fixed.
Click to expand...
Same here
 
rockwoodrv9 said:
I am still loosing traffic. Any news on an update?
Click to expand...
It’s very annoying. It would drop on the dedicated traffic page and a couple seconds later fall off the map page. I’ve been using my iPad for IFR training only. Did not think it would be necessary for VFR travel with a dual G3X setup but that’s going to change. Lots of traffic leaving the eclipse path today
 
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