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DeltaHawk Engines at OSH

Tandem46

Tandem46

Well Known Member
Dare I ask? Any news from DeltaHawk this year at OSH? Having been to OSH twice and Sun&Fun multiple times, I've always stopped by the DH tent and asked for updates, but every year I would hear the same thing. Is this year any different?
 
Still the same $70k. :/ But over in one of the Innovations Hangars, there is Engineered Propulsion Systems with their prototype EPS Vision 350. It's the same basic idea of a turbo-diesel. They're starting out with an 8-banger 350hp engine burning just under 20gph at WOT. When I asked, they also supposedly will develop 6 & 4-bangers down the road (with the typical caveat of finding a market and investors). I asked about their timelines, cautioning about not repeating Delta Hawk's mistakes of taking forever. They seem to want to get production going within the next year. Quite a bit overpowered, and they're targeting the bigger Cessnas and Cirruses to start out, but might be a new one to watch and see what develops.

http://www.eps.aero
 
Wait

I've waited on Deltahawk, Mistrial and the Bombardier V-6. I wouldn't hold my breath. Decided to get a Lycoming and go flying.
 
sbalmos said:
Still the same $70k. :/ But over in one of the Innovations Hangars, there is Engineered Propulsion Systems with their prototype EPS Vision 350. It's the same basic idea of a turbo-diesel. They're starting out with an 8-banger 350hp engine burning just under 20gph at WOT. When I asked, they also supposedly will develop 6 & 4-bangers down the road (with the typical caveat of finding a market and investors). I asked about their timelines, cautioning about not repeating Delta Hawk's mistakes of taking forever. They seem to want to get production going within the next year. Quite a bit overpowered, and they're targeting the bigger Cessnas and Cirruses to start out, but might be a new one to watch and see what develops.

http://www.eps.aero
Click to expand...

According to their website, EPS is also targeting a 657 lb wet weight...that's a lot to carry around for only 350 HP. In contrast, a Lycoming TIO-540J rated at the same 350 HP weighs 548 lbs (83% of the diesel weight). No flame intended...it's just really hard to beat a Lyc for power/weight ratio.
 
Weight

Side by side the weight of a Lyc against a diesel the Lyc wins out........ but the lyc has to carry a lot more fuel than a diesel for the same range.

This is one of the points often made by Deltahawk...... but we actually see it in practice with our wam 120, not that the wam weighs as much as a an 0=320. We use about 17 litres so only need to put in 85 litres for 5 hours endurance, thats about 150 lbs of fuel, where the lyc would require about 231 lbs.

So, for any given flight we can operate lighter than a lycoming engined 9.

The weight of a diesel should not put you off as it will be offset by a lighter fuel load......... or if the airframe can take it full fuel and a vastly increased range, time between refuel.

There is a reason why diesels are being used more in cars and being developed for aeroplanes.
 
Steve, I was told by an old-timer, that the super high compression...20:1 or higher, of a diesel engine, loosens prop bolts often, because of the hard licks at combustion.

Any truth to this?

Thanks,
 
I don't know about past experience, but I can assure you that a properly designed bolted interface can handle that sort of very predictable load.

Dave
 
Prop.

Hi Pierre,

I am a great believer in old wisdom but so far no evidence of this on the MT props used.
 
Torque pulsation of diesel engines is a concern, which is why many (but not all) examples are two-stroke. I believe the SMA has (had) a reputation for rattling a few things loose.

Also, compression ratios are coming down. 17:1 is more typical in modern diesel engines and according to a Prof Heywood, who knows a thing or two about engines, somewhere between 15:1 and 16:1 is the optimum for any engine - a compromise between friction and thermal efficiency.
 
The truth is, is ther enough market for some of these other engine company's? It's hard for Continetal and Lycomming to make enough engines to make make a profit, I just wonder.
 
As far as new airplane production numbers go, the last numbers that I looked upnwere 2010. In that year, there were roughly 1800 single engine pistons delivered worldwide. In that same year there were roughly 500 RV completion's. Not much of a prospective market if you have your sights set on new engine development. These are good ideas, but I don't know how they are going to be able to make the business case work.

Tim
 
tjo said:
As far as new airplane production numbers go, the last numbers that I looked upnwere 2010. In that year, there were roughly 1800 single engine pistons delivered worldwide. In that same year there were roughly 500 RV completion's. Not much of a prospective market if you have your sights set on new engine development. These are good ideas, but I don't know how they are going to be able to make the business case work.

Tim
Click to expand...

I suspect the UAV market is a target....for a lot of valid reasons. For m military pas JET file is a must ( or diesel) as both are part of the logistics stream. And turbines don't fit a lot of mission profiles or operational venues...

Let's hope so - the volume worldwide will help drive costs in right direction.

Richard
RV-4 N144KT
 
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