Comparison of LED strobe / rear position lights

Through an odd set of circumstances, I ended up with two of the new all LED rear position/strobe lights intended to replace the ubiquitous Whelen A500 used on the rudder fairing of our RVs - a PosiStrobeXP from Aveo Engineering and a Suntail from AeroLEDs. Since I have both of these units, I thought I would do a little direct comparison of them for your enjoyment. You can get information on both of these lights from their websites:

http://www.aveoaviationlights.com/

and

http://www.aeroleds.com/

Suntail on the left, PosiStrobe on the right.



A few disclaimers: I don’t claim that my testing methods are particularly valid. I don’t have a certified and calibrated lab so my results are probably worth what you paid for them. For background on my test setup, methodologies, and my obsession with this topic, see THIS thread. The only thing I can say is that I am testing both units the same way with the same test setup. Also, I have no affiliation with either of these two companies - I'm just an RV-7 builder who wants to use LED lights on his plane!

Basically, all I am trying to do with the tests is to get a warm fuzzy that these lights are probably compliant with the FARs and are quiet enough electrically to use on our planes. I do not expect to measure the light output to the nearest 0.25 candela! To give me that warm fuzzy, I am looking for something north of 20 candela on axis for the position light component and at least 500-600 peak candela on axis for the anti-collision. If you go look at the FAR for the anti-collision lights, it requires a minimum of 400 effective candela for the worst case coverage angles. But if you go dig through the math of how the effective intensity is calculated, it’s obvious that your peak intensity must be significantly higher. 500-600 seems to be a reasonable minimum.


So what were my results? Here are the light intensity measurements all taken on axis at a distance of 12”:

PosiStrobeXP

Position Light Only: 29fc ~= 29cd

Strobe Only: N/A

Strobe + Position Light: 265fc peak ~= 265cd peak


Suntail

Position Light Only: 30fc ~= 30cd

Strobe Only: 596fc peak ~= 596cd peak

Strobe + Position Light: 625fc peak ~= 625cd peak

Note: The PosiStrobeXP runs the position light anytime the strobe is on so I was unable to get a “strobe only” measurement for it.




The electrical noise test is a little more subjective. I used my Icom A24 handheld radio for these tests rather than digging out my Icom A210 and antenna like I did the last time around.

Results:

The PosiStrobeXP does generate some noise that is picked up on the A24. It appeared quiet at a distance of about 3.5 feet but you could “hear” the strobe as you got the antenna closer until it essentially blanked out the reception with the antenna next to the light or the wires feeding it.

The Suntail was absolutely dead quiet everywhere as far as I could tell. I could even lay the A24 antenna on the light or the wires feeding it and there was no noise at all.


FWIW

Great

I have been talking to Nat at AeroLED and you basically confirmed what he has been telling me. It's what I'm planning to put in my 7a. Thanks for the test.

Peter Richmond

Great job, Dan!

Thanks for the comparison -- your results make me glad I ordered one of the Suntails for my -10 earlier in the week!

-- Chris

Now if we can get AeroLeds to produce a version of the Suntail without the position light, perhaps that will drop the price some more to use as wing tip strobes.

I have been waiting for Aveo to come out with their embedded wing tip lights. Glad I waited - RF noise on Aveo products is a non starter for me. I'm going to wait for OSH before I do anything. The AeroLED products do look promising.

Thanks Dan...

....I'm glad you held out during the long discussions on your previous measurement thread.

It's now showing results....

Noise

flickroll said:

I have been waiting for Aveo to come out with their embedded wing tip lights. Glad I waited - RF noise on Aveo products is a non starter for me. I'm going to wait for OSH before I do anything. The AeroLED products do look promising.

Click to expand...

In all fairness, the radio antenna did have to get pretty close to the light before it became a problem. What surprised me a bit was that when I tested the original, lower powered, PosiStrobe back in December, it appeared to be totally quiet electrically although at that time I was doing the test with an A210 panel mount instead of a handheld.

Addicted!

az_gila said:

....I'm glad you held out during the long discussions on your previous measurement thread.

It's now showing results....

Click to expand...

I guess I just can't let it go!

Dan, do you know the street pricing of both the AeroLED and the Aveo combo tail position light/strobe? The AeroLED tail unit is 395 , I wonder if the Aveo unit is similarly priced. One thing I do not like about the Aveo unit that you reported on is the inability to run the strobe by itself.

Pricing

flickroll said:

Dan, do you know the street pricing of both the AeroLED and the Aveo combo tail position light/strobe? The AeroLED tail unit is 395 , I wonder if the Aveo unit is similarly priced. One thing I do not like about the Aveo unit that you reported on is the inability to run the strobe by itself.

Click to expand...

Aircraft Spruce has the Aveo PosiStrobeXP for $306.00. I think Aveo has other sales outlets around the country but you'd have to get with them on prices.

Yeah, their both pretty expensive! But this is new stuff. It eventually comes down.

SunTail arrived today

The SunTail I ordered from AeroLEDs a couple of weeks ago arrived today. It's a very attractive unit, I must say! I like the aluminum casing, which the instructions indicate is also the heat sink. (Where is the heat sink for the PosiStrobe?) It's obvious that it will mount easily to the tail light adapter ring I bought from Cleaveland.

Being unable to resist temptation, I promptly hooked it up to a 12V supply I had in the workshop (for the amateur radio equipment) and ... WOW! This thing is BRIGHT! The position LEDs are outboard of the strobe LEDs and as Dan posted earlier, each function operates independently. After accidentally nearly blinding my wife ("Hi, honey, look at this!"), I was convinced to put it away until I have more airplane to install it in.

I must say, it's love at first sight, however!

-- Chris

DISCLAIMER: I am not affiliated in any way whatsoever with AERO LEDS. This post is about my experience with one of their products, and is based on my observations of the product. I have not done scientific testing of the unit and this post is based soley on my observations.

I received and installed a Suntail today on the rudder fairing of my -8. Now I'm waiting on the Pulsar NS90 (combination position light and strobe - 90 deg coverage) for installation in my wing tips to complete my strobe/nav light installation; they should be here in a couple of weeks. And I'll be using Duckworks HID wing tip lights for wig wag recognition - that will be a LOT of light in the wing tips, and with a low power consumption. I bought the Suntail direct from AERO LEDS and they offered a 15% discount (same as they'll offer at Osh). So the $395 list price was about $340 delivered. Not inexpensive, but it seems to be a very well engineered product. The base of the unit is made from machined aluminum (and is the unit heatsink) and is of high quality, and the lens appears to be polycarbonate of equal quality to the aluminum base. Nate at AERO LEDS told me the unit is hermetically sealed and moisture cannot intrude into the unit. The unit fits perfectly on the adapter that I bought from Cleaveland tools:

http://www.cleavelandtoolstore.com/prodinfo.asp?number=RVTLR

When I totally rewired my -8 last fall/this winter I decided I would make use of the new LED nav/strobe technology. These devices save as much weight as they do power consumption. I ran 18 ga. wire for the nav lights and 18 ga. for the strobes. Probably could have run 20 ga. and been OK. I'm pretty anal about weight - WHY didn't I run 20??

After the Suntail was installed and I flipped the switches for the nav and strobe, I was amazed by the light output from this LED system. The white nav light output of the Suntail seems to be about the same as the tail light on a Whelen A600 combo unit. The strobe appears much brighter than the Whelen Xenon strobe unit. The Suntail needs no power pack and is very light weight. And just as importantly, the Suntail does not produce any noise that I could detect in the radio/intercom system using a Bose X headset. I am impressed by the products and the folks at AERO LEDS too. I have spent in total close to an hour talking to Nate about their products and the engineering behind them. He'll spend as much time as you need, answering any question you might have. The products are impressive and the company is as well.

Again, just my opinion.

Confused?

Are you saying that in your testing of the sriobes/position light combo, you found the Aero to be almost 3 times as bright as the Aveo?
If so, I find it hard to believe that there is so much difference between the two brightness levels.
And if it is indeed true, the purchase decision would seem pretty easy.

I just call it like I see it . . . . .

DJR said:

Are you saying that in your testing of the sriobes/position light combo, you found the Aero to be almost 3 times as bright as the Aveo?
If so, I find it hard to believe that there is so much difference between the two brightness levels.
And if it is indeed true, the purchase decision would seem pretty easy.

Click to expand...

2.36 times actually

Using LED Nav/Strobe lights that meet the technical requirements of the FARs has been a goal (obsession?) of mine for a while. I was interested enough in the topic to do a good deal of studying about it and bought a light meter for the express purpose of measuring these things (my own home brew or commercial). If you are interested, you can take a look at
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=36856
where I went through measuring the original AVEO Posistrobe. As I said in my first post to this thread, I am not a certified lab and my measurements of the strobe are only of the peak intensity, not the effective intensity specified in the FAR. The peak is a good indicator however because if you work through the math for calculating the effective intensity, it becomes obvious that the peak has to be significantly higher than the FAR requirement. If the peak reading doesn't meet the spec, the effective reading certainly won't!

My only purpose for doing these measurements is for a reality check on the vendors claims. When I see a peak measurement of over 600 cd on the strobe and work through the math, I feel pretty good about believing the manufacturer when they say it is compliant. When I measure one where the PEAK isn't even at the FAR level (400 cd), I have to wonder about the validity of their claims . . . . . . . .

You can probably guess which ones I've bought for my plane

Checking

Hi Dan,

You might want to check with Aveo on the most current model. I believe (but could be wrong) that they said they just went to a new LED.

I have a hard time buying that much difference. Both are very bright. At Osh I wanted to compare the both with my eyes and not some numbers on paper. Both Aveo and Aero were very bright and much better than current strobes. Both are winners in my book.

What I observed as a difference was that the Aero strobe was somewhat muted as compared to Aveo. The best analogy would be comparing a frosted light bulb to a clear bulb. This could have been the interior lighting and other factors. Just an observation and not meant to portray anything negative. Again, both were excellent in intensity.

I had mentioned earlier that I leaning toward the Aveo, mainly because of the landing/taxi light product. However, I'll see if their communications capabilities improve over the next week.

Does anyone know if Aero is coming out with a tip mounted landing light assembly?

Wouldn't suprise me . . . .

RV7Guy said:

You might want to check with Aveo on the most current model. I believe (but could be wrong) that they said they just went to a new LED.

Click to expand...

Could be, I just tested the one I had at the time.

RV7Guy said:

Does anyone know if Aero is coming out with a tip mounted landing light assembly?

Click to expand...

I can't speak for AeroLEDs but I think their Microsun would work well for that. It's small enough to fit and has light output greater than their original 1600. I haven't heard anything about a unit similar to AVEO's