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Painting Has Begun!!!!

F

fstringham7a

Well Known Member
Here are a couple of pictures of the start of at least a month of painting my RV7A with the Stewart System Paint......www.stewartsystems.aero

Todays venture was to paint the custom fabricated FG ram air induction nostril and the two custom FG cowl hinge pin covers with Ekofill UV primer/filler. The process calls for first using compressed air source to blow off all the sanding dust and then clean the part with EkoClean/rinse with water/let dry. Then the process calls for using a foam brush to put on the first two coats of the primer filler.......Then using a gun with at least a 1.5 tip to spray two cross coats (total of four coats) over the two foam coats. On the cowl I will spray all six coats. Using the foam brush does creat surface bubbles that must be stroked out. The uv primer/filler must go on dull in shine or one is using to much material. Once dry the parts will be dry sanded with 320 open coat paper in preparation for application of the Stewart System Primer/Sealer White.The UV Primer/Filler is only used on the FG parts.

Tomorrow the cowl will get the above treatment.





Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... painting
 
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RE:Cowl Pin Holes

Continued the process of painting my RV7A today......UV filler Primer to the cowl halves was the project. Great learning experience plus pin holes galore......Called and talked with Dan and he said that the primer filler will not fill, totally, Van's cowl pin holes. So he suggested using a red lacquer glazing putty. He said that this is nomal with FG and should be done once the UV is shot to the cowl. or other FG parts. So I will be off to purchase either Evercoat 403 Red Glazing Putty or USC 32035 Red Lacquer Glazing Putty. Both are one part, quick set time, easy sand, pin hole filler.

Don't ya just love fiber glass / painting...................

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... Painting:eek:
 
that's stewart system. Same thing I'm using, if you use a spray gun it works really good that way also.
 
Yes please keep us posted...I love the ECO friendly thing...when are you shooting some color and are you going HVLP or conventional spray rig??
 
fstringham7a said:
Now the pressure really begins!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Brian, how is your project coming along?

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A ... Painting :eek:
Click to expand...

no pressure, just keep doing like the rest of your project and it'll be outstanding.


my project is ....moving forward. originally I figured I could afford the time and money for a 24month project. 20 months since I drove that first rivet, no way I'll get done in 4 months. but at least I'm under budget. Cutting the canopy next week.
 
RE:Sata

Rick S. said:
Yes please keep us posted...I love the ECO friendly thing...when are you shooting some color and are you going HVLP or conventional spray rig??
Click to expand...

Hi Rick

I will be shooting the color with an HVLP Sata 1.4 tip gun. The primer/fillers are being shoot with a devillbis 1.5 tip. These are the tip sizes called for with the Stewart System paint.

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... Paint :eek:
 
RE:Canopy looks great/Time

hydroguy2 said:
no pressure, just keep doing like the rest of your project and it'll be outstanding.


my project is ....moving forward. originally I figured I could afford the time and money for a 24month project. 20 months since I drove that first rivet, no way I'll get done in 4 months. but at least I'm under budget. Cutting the canopy next week.
Click to expand...

Brian

I took a look at your log pictures. The canopy seems to be coming along nicely. I know what you mean about that time thing. Sept 4, 2004 was the start of my 18 month project....ya right....

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... paint :eek:
 
RE:Cowl post prime sanding plus

Spent the day sanding the top and bottom cowl with 220 grit sand paper. I originally started with the 320 open coat but it didn't sand to dust but rolled off small layers of the uv prime . So I went to the 220 grit and sanded in preparation for the USG Red Lacquer Glaze to fill the pin holes. Used three sizes of plastic and metal putty knifes (spatulas) to apply the glaze. I started with a small pea size glaze and forced it into the pin holes..........maybe I would be done by Christmas......so I found the best method, on most of the cowl, was to place a ribbon of glaze on the tip of the four inch plastic putty and swipe it on the cowl and then do a second and maybe a third swipe to smooth it and completly cover the area.......The glaze really sets up fast.

On the top cowl after the glaze was applied I started sanding with the 320 open coat paper. It did clogg the paper but with a quick shot of air it would come right off the sand paper. The small area I sanded showed the pin holes and other blemishes fillled in. Plus the cowl is as smooth as a .........babies bottom ( is this legal to say):rolleyes:.....in this area sanded

Tomorrow will be sanding and sanding and sanding.......to get ready to shoot the white EckoFill............

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... painting:eek:
 
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RE:Sanding Surprise

Today was a long 8 plus hours sanding marathon to sand off the Red Glaze putty. I found that 80 grit, followed by 220 grit and a final 320 closed coat paper left the cowl very smooth. There were a few pin holes not completly filled. They were very noticable in that they were a dark red color compared to those that were a light pink color from the sanding process. Those will be filled Monday.

Two surprises were noted during this process. First, the 80 grit paper did a great job with very light pressure in taking the majority of the glaze off.....not the surprise...the surprise was that it didn't phase the the UV EkoFill. If I pressed too hard it would leave a very thin scratch that was easily removed with the 220/320 grit paper. It is really tough stuff even after only a couple of days dry time. This shouldn't be a real surprise, to me, because the Stewart System (formally AFS) one part polyurethane that I used for the primer has held up great during the rigors of the build process. The second surprise was a small 6 inch X 3 inch area on the top cowl where I filled the pin holes with Evercoat RAGE GOLD. That area is as smooth as silk with the coat of UV EkoFill............So I should have filled all the flaws and pin holes with RAGE GOLD before shooting the Ekofill. I just followed the directions from Stewart..........they are for cloth specifically (RAG WING)......NOT FG CLOTH. Dan said to use the Red Glaze putty as it would adhere better to the EkoFill once we realized the problem with the Ekofill not filling the big deep FG pin holes. This little gem if I would have been wise as I think I am :eek: and followed my instincts instead of the ?????? directions I would have saved two days........and a very sore arm. Oh well you just got to love EXPERIMENTAL AVIATION BUILDING.:D

Have a great fun filled Labor Day.

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... Painting or shoud I say sanding.........
 
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Stewart AFS

Love your reports. I've been using the Stewart products from the start, really like the "good buddy" support/help from Dan and Marge. Looking forward to your progress reports on the cowl.

Frank did you use the just 1-part poly paint for the primer?

I've been using the AFS primer (both grey and white) in area's I don't intend to have a nice painted surface. I have used both the primer and the 1-part poly on most of the forward cockpit with pretty good results (not wing/fuse quality smoothness, because of my technique).
 
RE:primer/Paint

Bud

Nice to know that there are other builders using the Stewart paint....

During the primer wars of 04 I was really confused about what to do. Prime or not to prime...if I prime what product to use. Read all kinds of reports!!!!!!!

I finally called Paul and Tammy of Aircraft Finishing systems (now Stewart Finishing Systems) to discuss the primer issue. Paul has a ton of experience in the rehab of aircraft especially "Rag Wing" types said that if he were to build a plane he would not use primer alone as protective coat for an airplanes interior parts........With that said and not wanting to start primer War 08.......his reasoning made alot of sense to this old retired chemistry teacher. He then told me the history behind why he converted to a water solvent based paint. Ease of clean up, ease of use, and above all Safety. He suggested I use their one part polyurethane top coat as my primer. He then gave me the drill to follow. Clean the Al parts with a good soap degreaser. (I used their heavy duty cleaner now called Ekoclean Heavy Duty Cleaner). Scotch bright the Al parts using an acid etch solution. (again I used their Acid Ecth which Stewart now has available. Rinse and let dry). Then shoot the one part poly. My results were very mixed as to the quality of my paint job. The reason for this was new thus not much experience to painting, but the biggest problem was my Husky 30 gallon oilless (very noisy) compressor just couldn't maintain constant needed presssure. Now for the editorial comment. I now have an 80 gal Campbell Hausfeld oilled compressor......Does a great job.

I have been watching a good friend rehab an old Cessna 140 and the interior is alclad and just beautiful. So does it make sense to prime????Now I know that you folks that live in high humidity areas have a strong argument to use some protective covering. But please look at the chemistry of what a paint primer does both physically and chemically. I am sure if you do, you like me will use something other than a straight paint primer to cover the interior parts of your plane........Flame suit is now being put on:rolleyes:

In the end if I could start a new I would not paint the alclad parts of the plane. I would paint all none alclad parts. This would save in a little weight, some extra work, alot of extra time, and $$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

Bud, good luck and enjoyment with your project.

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... painting:eek:
 
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RE:problems solved.....

lostpilot28 said:
Hi Frank,
Any updates on your paint?
Click to expand...

Sonny

I have really learned alot this past week about what to do........and WHAT NOT TO DO.

The new 80 gallon compressor really keeps the air coming. Once I dialed in the gun it has done a great job of laying on the primer.

What to do (Fiber Glass): 1. Clean the part with Lacquer Thinner. 2. Give the part a chance to evaporate the thinner. 3. Give the part a light sanding. 4. Blow off the part with a good stream of air. 5. Clean the part with EkoClean.
6. Rinse well !!! 7. Let the part dry (here in the Desert Southwest this is not a problem). 8. Now get to work filling those pin holes and flaws. There are many choices as to what to use to fill the pin hole. resin-hardner/acetone, or red glaze putty, or Evercoat Rag Gold, or.........9. Sand with 120 grit open coat paper and then 320 open coat paper. 10. Blow the part off with a good stream of air. 11. Check real close for pin holes/flaws. Repeat 8 and 9 as necessary. 12. Get prepared to shoot the EkoFill UV primer filler. 13. Once all is ready....paint area ready/gun ready/part clean and dry/part set in a solid jig/begin the process of painting. Lay in 6 cross coats. 14. Let the part dry overnight. 15. The fun begins..... you get to sand the primer with 320 open coat paper. Before sanding the part will feel rough but after sanding it will feel smooth and also bring out and pin holes that are missed. 16. Check the part carefully for any pin holes and flaws. 17. With any luck their won't be any....but....if there are any use some Red glaze putty to fill these in. 18. Sand, carefully, these areas with some 220 open coat followed by 320 open coat paper. 20. Blow the part off with a stream of air and clean with Ekoclean. 21. Let the part dry. 22. Prep for painting the part with White EkoFill. 23. Lay in 4 to 6 cross coats of the white Eckofill. 24. Once the part is dry, sand the part with 320 closed coat paper.

Note (09/12/2008) There is a lot of info about using the single part/stage Red Glaze putty. Do your due diligence before you decide to use this product...............

Here are pictures of where we are at with the pin hole filling and the final white coat drying:





In my next installment I will cover the process of using the 2 part Stewart Polyurethane paint as the finish coat.

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... Painting :eek:
 
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Thanks for the update, Frank...your cowl looks great. If I may ask - are you applying so many coats of primer to act as a filler? I wouldn't think there's a need for that many coats.

Also, you said the paint is a 2-part product...is that correct? I have the DVD video from AFS and it looks like their paint is a single-stage paint.
 
RE:My Hero !!!!

frankh said:
its STILL on the airplane...:)

Frank 1
Click to expand...


Frank1........

My hero....builds a plane/paints the plane/ACRO's the plane, Frank1 your the man.

Some pictuers @ SGU showing Frank's great paint job.







Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... Painting :eek:
 
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lostpilot28 said:
Thanks for the update, Frank...your cowl looks great. If I may ask - are you applying so many coats of primer to act as a filler? I wouldn't think there's a need for that many coats.

Also, you said the paint is a 2-part product...is that correct? I have the DVD video from AFS and it looks like their paint is a single-stage paint.
Click to expand...

Sonny

Thanks for the questions.

Stewart's water base product goes on in many very light mist coats which will fill in some very small blems but the craters in the cowl must be filled before applying the Eckofill UV or Eckofill White. When shooting the 2 part poly the gun is set to a mist setting for the first coat and with each additional coat the fluid control is increased.

Check out their web site for full detail http://www.stewartsystems.aero/default.aspx ....but....Their primers are single stage. They also have a single stage one part polyurethane which I used as a covering in place of primer on the interior parts. Their two part product is for the exterior.

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... paint :eek:
 
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fstringham7a said:
The second surprise was a small 6 inch X 3 inch area on the top cowl where I filled the pin holes with Evercoat RAGE GOLD. That area is as smooth as silk with the coat of UV EkoFill............So I should have filled all the flaws and pin holes with RAGE GOLD before shooting the Ekofill. I just followed the directions from Stewart..........they are for cloth specifically (RAG WING)......NOT FG CLOTH. Dan said to use the Red Glaze putty as it would adhere better to the EkoFill once we realized the problem with the Ekofill not filling the big deep FG pin holes. This little gem if I would have been wise as I think I am :eek: and followed my instincts instead of the ?????? directions I would have saved two days........and a very sore arm. .........
Click to expand...

Frank-
Is this the Evercoat Rage Gold you are talking about, part # FIB112?

http://www.amazon.com/Fibreglass-Ev...77-9231149?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1220813602&sr=8-1

I just got done squeegy-ing an acetone-thinned epoxy coat, per Vans, on the top cowl to get rid of the worst of the pinholes, but there are still a ton more. I'm wondering whether to do one more epoxy coat or go right to the Rage Gold.

Your thread is great, because I've been planning Stewart System as well.

Thanks,
 
alpinelakespilot2000 said:
Frank-
Is this the Evercoat Rage Gold you are talking about, part # FIB112?

http://www.amazon.com/Fibreglass-Ev...77-9231149?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1220813602&sr=8-1

I just got done squeegy-ing an acetone-thinned epoxy coat, per Vans, on the top cowl to get rid of the worst of the pinholes, but there are still a ton more. I'm wondering whether to do one more epoxy coat or go right to the Rage Gold.

Your thread is great, because I've been planning Stewart System as well.

Thanks,
Click to expand...

Steve

The Evercoat you cite is the stuff I have used along with http://www.tcpglobal.com/autobodydepot/uschem.aspx ..... 35035 USC Red Laquer Glaze Putty. Evercoat is a two part filler that set up fast and sands easy. The USC Red Glaze is in a tube and is single stage and sands easy......The only question I have in using them is : will they hold up over time as compared to the tried and true Resin-Hardner/Acetone filler. I have now used all three of them on the FG on my plane. Maybe down the road a few years I can report as to which hold up the best.

I do know Rage Golds/Red Glaze is easy to apply/fills the holes pretty good/dries quickly/and is easy to sand. I know that Resin is easy to apply/but has a long dry time/realitive ease of sanding......

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... Painting
 
Filling the Cowls

Painting has been a subject very close to my heart these last 7 weeks.
Finally finished the 9A, and have had very good comments. Haven't mastered the method of posting a photo, but maybe someday.

We filled the glass parts several ways, and I'll comment on that.
The cowls were done with West Epoxy with West filletmaker (I don't remember the number, but it's brown) mixed in. No acetone. At first I used a razor blade to apply it, then went to a 3" plastic squeegee blade with a lot of pressure. Get as much filler into the epoxy as you can without it getting too thick. Maple syrup thickness would be good (the real stuff)!!. Mix up enough to do about 2 square feet. The filler makes it easier to sand.
On the wheel pants and fairings, I used high build primer first, wet sanded, then used "Icing", which is a very thin professional body filler used only for light fills. Sets up very fast, but I learned how to just put enough hardener to give me about 6 minutes, rather than the 3 minutes you'll have if you put in the recommended amount.
Both methods required a lot of sanding. I used down to 48 wet paper on the epoxy, and down to 220 wet on the icing, which required up to 3 applications per part to get all the pinholes. Found a few areas I missed on the cowls, and the Icing fixed those fast.
Then followed by a DuPont Vari-prime,light wet sanding, and then Icing to get the pinholes I missed.
The gel coated parts just took a coat of high build primer, then wet sanding to prepare for sealer.
I have to say I have at least 80 hours preparing the fiberglass parts for final primer.

I used DuPont Premium Paint system. VariPrime first, then a sealer, color coats (4 colors) then clear. Now we're buffing to make up for the light coats of clear. At least we fly when not buffing!
I'm so happy this is over!!!
Jack
p.s.
spent over 2 K on paint!!
 
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Picture?

dscf00082rt8.jpg
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Hey, we actually did it. Don't know where that stuff about the fish came from!!
Will try to post some more
Jack
my.php
 
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Another try

dscf00092yq6.jpg
[/URL] [/IMG]

Still that dumb fish question, but here's another one.
Jack
dscf00032yz5.jpg
[/URL][/IMG]
 
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RE:Gorgeous!!!!!!!!

Jack

Your info was spot on especially the time element.....:eek:

Your plane is drop dead gorgeous!!!!!!!!!!!:D

I just hope I can even come half as close to this beauty in looks.

You know there is the 1 foot, 3 foot, 30 foot, 300 foot, and 10,000 foot rule. Yours would certianly pass the 1 foot rule.;)

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... Paint
 
Thanks all for the kind words,
Kinda makes all the work seem worth it

Frank...Didn't mean to step on your post...I guess I just got excited when I was able to post some pictures while on your thread.
I'll start a new one if anybody is interested on the painting of N99552
Regards
Jack
 
fstringham7a said:
Steve

The Evercoat you cite is the stuff I have used along with http://www.tcpglobal.com/autobodydepot/uschem.aspx ..... 35035 USC Red Laquer Glaze Putty.
Click to expand...
Frank-
Did you mean 32035? I can't find a 35035 on the page you link. After talking with the Stewarts while working on my rear canopy skirt, I used a tube of Bondo Red Glazing putty for the last few pinholes. I wonder if the stuffy you're using is any different.
 
RE:32035 Red Glaze

alpinelakespilot2000 said:
Frank-
Did you mean 32035? I can't find a 35035 on the page you link. After talking with the Stewarts while working on my rear canopy skirt, I used a tube of Bondo Red Glazing putty for the last few pinholes. I wonder if the stuffy you're using is any different.
Click to expand...

Steve

Yes...it is 32035......can you tell that I do a good job of proofing my writen wurk!!!!!!!!!!:eek:(written work) Let me know if you do compare the two. Would be interested to know the difference.

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... painting
 
glaze

Just a thought I keep having about glazing putty....it's covering an area so small, what are the chances that even if the paint did not adhere to it that well it would come off? I highly doubt it will simply because of the structure of the paint over the surface.

Even if you get some king of particle under the paint while spraying it never comes off. I don't think I'd waste much brain power thinking about whether one brand of glazing putty is better than another unless you plan on covering a large area with it.
 
RE:UV prime fairing/pants

Yesterday I put the final red glaze touches to the gear leg fairing and pants. Figured most if not all of the pin holes were eradicated from the parts...........Ya Right?:eek:



Tomorrow all the parts will be sanded with 320 open coat / blown clean with air / red glaze applied AGAIN to continue the never ending show called "PIN HOLES"...........

Here is a picture of the very technical, highly precise paint jig I used to hold the parts.........1/2 dowels/2X2/compressor pallet...............



It worked great. As I would paint the part I would turn the part 360 degrees using the 2X2/dowel in the pallet as the carousel. Now if I can just come up with a a fixture for the emp parts and the wings...............There are a lot of good ideas in the archives. I will just have to start the search.

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... painting or should I say pin hole hunting!!!!!!!!!
 
Frank 2

Wow that is tachnical..:)

Here is a tip for the control surfaces, which to me were a PITA to paint.

make jigs out of cheap metal shelf brackets and the like. These brackets will allow you to flip over the surfaces DURING paining..You have to use 1/8th welding rod and the like to hold the surfaces from the inside.

So here is the deal. Paint one coat right side up..flip surface over paint one coat. Flip over again and paint second coat...flip back over and allow to dry.

So if you been paying attention you will have one coat on the bottom surface and two on the top...and its drying with the bottom surface UP.

That way any dust will not be on the top surface where everyone and his dog will say..ooh I see you got some dust in your paint!

It takes a while but its worth setting up these jigs and to paint the entire collection of control surfaces in one hit.

Needless to say it takes less time to paint than to set up!

I also did the same with both horizontal stabilzer and wings...Easier to paint horizontal than vertical although your arm will be killing you holding the weight of the gun by the end of the second coat on the wing..Then again I'm a lightweight..:)

Enjoy

Frank 1
 
Pinholes

Frank
If it was me fixing the pinholes you show in your photo I would;
1. Go to a body shop supplier and get a filler known as Icing. It is very thin and as I explained in an earlier post, sets up very fast.
2. Use a plastic squeegee to apply the filler.
3. In about 5 minutes you'll be able to wet sand with about 280 if you use the recommended amount of hardener. I wouldn't go any finer. I used 220, and it worked good. Left a good surface for the final primer or sealer.
4. Should only take 2-3 applications.

Icing comes in a big tube, and is not cheap, but you'll use it all over the plane when you're preparing for final primer and you see a flaw.
When I was mixing I'd only squeeze out an amount about the size of a quarter, and about 1/4 " high. Then only add hardener about the size of grain on rice. That would give me about 5-6 minutes of working time. Once it kicks, it kicks fast.
It sands down real nice, and doesn't seem to shrink.
This product was recommended to me by a professional body person. I'm glad he did.
Hope this helps
Jack
 
RE:pin Hole Filling

Jack

Thanks for the heads up......do you have exact name/product # of the ice filler you used. I do have some Evercoat Metal Glaze blending putty.....I used it on the emp tips. It was very runny, did do the job of filling sratches, and flaws......but very difficult to sand.

Frank

Great ideas for painting fixtures and letting the top cure facing the floor.....

Frank @ 1L8 ..RV7A... Painting
 
Frank
I'll look at the tube at the hangar tomorrow and get all the info for you.
If I remember, it's called Icing. It's about half the thickness of normal final filler.
You'll like the way it sands.
Jack
 
Paint Booth Fixtures

Frank,

Bob Trumpfheller recently posted on Van's First Flight page. He has a build site that has some terrific photos of his paint booth and fixtures. There may be someone with better but his is the best I have seen for home grown.

This will take you to his painting section with great photos:

http://mesawood.info/myrv7a/building/paintprep.htm
 
Glazing putty-Warning

Frank and others,

I highly suggest you don't use the glazing putty that is in the tube, Stanton and others. Basically, anything that is not catalyzed should be avoided.

The reason is that this stuff never really hardens. Visually, it looks hardened. It sands okay. The other main reason is that many paint primers, thinners and paints will react with these.

When I was preparing to paint my plane, my body shop friend and custom painter guided me through the prep process. When he saw the red putty on a couple of pieces of my plane he said it had to all be sanded off. I sanded the putty off and used acetone to remove everything I couldn't sand off.

I personally like Evercoat Feather Fill for pin hole filling. For larger holes and voids I use micro filler and epoxy.
 
RE:Great Points

RV7Guy said:
Frank and others,

I highly suggest you don't use the glazing putty that is in the tube, Stanton and others. Basically, anything that is not catalyzed should be avoided.

The reason is that this stuff never really hardens. Visually, it looks hardened. It sands okay. The other main reason is that many paint primers, thinners and paints will react with these.

When I was preparing to paint my plane, my body shop friend and custom painter guided me through the prep process. When he saw the red putty on a couple of pieces of my plane he said it had to all be sanded off. I sanded the putty off and used acetone to remove everything I couldn't sand off.

I personally like Evercoat Feather Fill for pin hole filling. For larger holes and voids I use micro filler and epoxy.
Click to expand...

Darwin

Thanks for the info. I have really been flying blind...:cool:on this part of the project. As you know there are tons of specific info about air frame fabrication/panel electrical fabrication/and FWF info to keep that engine purring along......but...in the area of primers/fillers/paint types/FG finish materials and technique there are a bunch of conflicting reports.

As an old retired chemistry teacher your analysis and your painter make alot of sense. In the world of chemistry there is a compatibilty factor among materials that just can't be overlooked or ignored especially at ones peril.

With that said Dan Stewart of Stewarts System paint said that this was the filler of choice. The instructions are (after cleaning the FG part throughly )to use UV Ekofill Primer Sealer (polyurethane) give the FG part a light sand/clean and then use the Red Glaze Laquer Putty (in my case USC) as the flaw /pin hole filler. Then sand the red glaze putty/clean and shoot some more UV Ekofill. Do this until the FG part is free of all those nasty flaws/pin holes.

I did a search on the internet among the car auto/body folks and there were as many that swore by as swore at Red Glaze Laquer Putty. So what is the fact........I sure don't know.

I have used resin/hardner/Evercoat Rage Gold and Evercoat Metal glaze (hard to sand)...two part filler/and Red Glaze.

So it looks like I will be the test case on these four to see which if any falls apart. I do know I will go with Dan at Stewarts and just hope after his many years as an aircraft painter...rag wing/FG/metal.....he knows what he is talking about.

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... painting??????with all it uncertianties
 
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Might be okay

Hi Frank,

You might be okay with that paint system. As I noted, many paints will react to the filler. Some many use it because it is very convenient but not realize the ramifications.

Good luck with the project. You are very brave to take this on. Can't wait to see your results.
 
RE:pin hole eradication......

The picture below showes the pin holes prior to using Evercoat Metal Glaze (two part filler) to fill the holes and other flaws...



cleaned the fairing and pants /covered the holes with the filler/let dry/sanded/sanded/sanded...with 320 opencoat paper......cleaned and reshot the parts with UV Ekofill which resulted in this after picture.....



another angle with a better light angle.



Finally a little light at the end of the tunnel. I hope to shoot some paint in the very near future. All of the parts like the cowl that have this done need a coat of Ekofill primer filler white to act as a base coat for the paint.

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... painting or should I say primeing/sanding.......
 
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Frank,
If I had pinholes like your first picture after spraying a first coat of primer, I'd sand it all off and start over.

Think about filling pinholes before you start spraying coatings. I get 99% with epoxy on glass/epoxy before applying anything else. Use what you want, but the idea is to fix the substrate surface, then coat. I think onion layers of unrelated product lines is pretty iffy.

Or consider Milt's rub-in method, which fills pinholes with a quality primer-surfacer, ie, a single product so as to not introduce compatability issues. You might try it with the Ecofill primer-filler you already have. Note that Milt is also sticking to a single manufacturer's product line through color; subsequent coatings per the data sheets are a safe bet.

I'm with Darwin on the red lacquer putty; it is not a major filler. I keep a little tube handy, but it only comes out as a quick fix when I find a pinhole or two, maybe three in the last detail inspection prior to finish painting. It's a crutch, a cheat, something you can smear in a single pinhole, flash off quick, and remove every trace except what is down in the hole. Any of the two-part polyester Evercoat products would be just as good or better. In quantities that small, you could darn near use a dab of river mud.
 
RE:Dan's the man

DanH said:
Frank,
If I had pinholes like your first picture after spraying a first coat of primer, I'd sand it all off and start over.

Think about filling pinholes before you start spraying coatings. I get 99% with epoxy on glass/epoxy before applying anything else. Use what you want, but the idea is to fix the substrate surface, then coat. I think onion layers of unrelated product lines is pretty iffy.

Or consider Milt's rub-in method, which fills pinholes with a quality primer-surfacer, ie, a single product so as to not introduce compatability issues. You might try it with the Ecofill primer-filler you already have. Note that Milt is also sticking to a single manufacturer's product line through color; subsequent coatings per the data sheets are a safe bet.

I'm with Darwin on the red lacquer putty; it is not a major filler. I keep a little tube handy, but it only comes out as a quick fix when I find a pinhole or two, maybe three in the last detail inspection prior to finish painting. It's a crutch, a cheat, something you can smear in a single pinhole, flash off quick, and remove every trace except what is down in the hole. Any of the two-part polyester Evercoat products would be just as good or better. In quantities that small, you could darn near use a dab of river mud.
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Dan

Good points especially knowing you have a wealth of info/experience in this lovely FG stuff.

I would strongly recommend your thread ...... http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=22931&highlight=fiberglass+fabrication ..... as must read to get a great education on FG in general and finish of the FG in particular.

It is part of the Stewart instuctions to sand the surface of the Ekofill Primer filler but unlike their VOC cousin they go on in a very thin light coat and are relitively easy to sand and prepare for that dreaded pin hole eradication process. My main problem in using the Stewart System was doing it the typical way when I started my first foray in to the pin hole paint prep process. Things are going much better now that I have adjusted to Stewart's System. Now, I would argue that using the typical process Resin/Hardner to start with and then sand with further resin/hardner in areas not fixed in the first interation and then use the Stewart UV Eckofill with a light sand will work with the Stewart Sytem and if I were to go back in time that is what I would do. UV Ekofill does give UV protection to the FG so it must not be totally sanded off as one would do in a typical flaw/pin hole/prime fix process. After the UV Eckofill then you shoot the white Ekofill primer filler which act as a base color coat prior to shooting the 2 part water borne Ekopoly paint. The two part paint must have a base coat as it is somewhat translucent.

With that said, I am following the directions of Dan from Stewart's System Water borne paints. Their system does follow a different path than the typical VOC paint materials. In the true spirit of experimentation I will press forward and strongly suggest that others should carefully study all the pit falls (no pun intended) in using the atypical paint system.


Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... painting
 
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RE:Color Coat

Shot the first color coat today using the Stewart System. Like every Boggie Man this build has presented it ended up being a pussy cat. Will not quite a pussy cat but at least was easier than I thought. I also have come to realize that it won't be perfect by Boyd Coddington standards...but will pass the 10 foot rule.

Still along way to go to get this part of the build complete.

Pictures to follow when I get some time.....................:eek:

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... Painting......
 
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thanks for the teaser.....................i'm waiting patiently for the pics.




ok still waiting...:D just kiddin' good luck in the booth.
 
RE: Update.....

RV7Guy said:
Hi Frank,

You might be okay with that paint system. As I noted, many paints will react to the filler. Some many use it because it is very convenient but not realize the ramifications.

Good luck with the project. You are very brave to take this on. Can't wait to see your results.
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Darwin, Dan, and all you other great FG info Providers......

You told me SO!!!!!:eek:

Do not under any circumstance use Red Glaze Putty as filler for the pin holes!!! It didn't work for me. The Eckofil white primer seller did not I repeat DID NOT adhere to the Red Glaze Filler.......But, it did adhere to the other areas where the typical resin/hardner/ micro / Evercoat Rage Gold was used.
So today I got the wonderful opportunity to remover the UV Eckofill and White Eckofill primer seller from the upper and lower cowl. Got most of it off but have abit of clean up left tomorrow.

I can say that the Stewart System Primer/Paint is great to use, easy to clean up, and in the case of the paint leaves a really glossy shine and is real tough......Now if I can just dial in me new Devilbiss gun/my Technique to shoot the paint so the final product is free of the typical flaws given the lack of experience of this painter...............I have two colors on the engine plenum cover with one more to shoot. I hope to have a picture for your critque soon!!!

Frank @ 1L8 ...RV7A... trying to paint....I do know I am good at removing primer and red glaze putty:rolleyes:
 
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