Van's Air Force
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Fly first or Paint first
- Thread starter hydroguy2
- Start date
douglassmt
Well Known Member
Where
Brian -
Where are you having your painting done? I'm making progress on my -10, just received FWF kit but haven't ordered engine yet. Will be needing paint this year, I hope. I still mean to come see you.
Brian -
Where are you having your painting done? I'm making progress on my -10, just received FWF kit but haven't ordered engine yet. Will be needing paint this year, I hope. I still mean to come see you.
hydroguy2
Well Known Member
Hey Bryan,
I working with a local autobody shop here in Townsend, I've been friends with Corky for close to 20yrs. I was planning on spraying it at my house, but knew I wanted a nicer job than I was capable of. So I managed to work out an arrangement to work in his shop. He's painted ~18 planes and is thinking of selling the autoshop and opening an aircraft paintshop. Don't know what it's going to cost, but after yesterdays Masterpiece I'm glad I went this route.
Come on over for the 4th of July Fly-in, I should have all the pieces at the airport doing final assembly.
I working with a local autobody shop here in Townsend, I've been friends with Corky for close to 20yrs. I was planning on spraying it at my house, but knew I wanted a nicer job than I was capable of. So I managed to work out an arrangement to work in his shop. He's painted ~18 planes and is thinking of selling the autoshop and opening an aircraft paintshop. Don't know what it's going to cost, but after yesterdays Masterpiece I'm glad I went this route.
Come on over for the 4th of July Fly-in, I should have all the pieces at the airport doing final assembly.
AirbusPilot
Well Known Member
Paint First
Once your airplanes is flying you will not want to park the airplane in a paint shop for a couple of month
Once your airplanes is flying you will not want to park the airplane in a paint shop for a couple of month
Wayne Gillispie
Well Known Member
Paint first for my -10
Build it, paint it and keep flying it. I don't want to have to come back later and work on fairings, wheel pants or clean bugs/oil/dirt off before painting. Fiberglass parts should be protected from sunlight, fuel, oil and water.
Build it, paint it and keep flying it. I don't want to have to come back later and work on fairings, wheel pants or clean bugs/oil/dirt off before painting. Fiberglass parts should be protected from sunlight, fuel, oil and water.
Rick6a
Well Known Member
It depends...
No matter what you decide, there are advantages and disadvantages inherent with either choice. No doubt, painting first is very attractive because many of the steps required to produce a high quality paint job are/or can be greatly simplified, especially if the wings are painted separately. The downside to the "paint first" option is IF flight testing reveals flaws and then the airframe requires tweaking. Suddenly that high dollar, high quality paint job may have to be redone in part. If the plane was professionally painted, now you've got rescheduling problems with the paint shop to work out in addition to extra and unanticipated downtime to deal with. The need to readjust the horizontal stabilizer immediately comes to mind. Chances are this will not happen to you but it does happen. Imagine the extra rework now involved, most notably reworking the fiberglass empennage fairing. Other more subtle problems can be revealed during Phase One. Lower cowl hinges and rivets that tie into the firewall seem to generate a good share of reported problems. Maybe the cowl is starting to discolor because of excessive heat and you need to add more heat shielding. Maybe initial flight tests reveal the need or desire to install a wedge or tab on the rudder to keep the ball centered in cruise flight. This is very common yet many builders insist their RV does not need rudder trim at all. Good on them but I suggest one only has to take a leisurely stroll up and down the many rows of RV's parked at AirVenture and observe firsthand just how many RV's in attendance do in fact sport a rudder trim of one sort or another and you can usually tell right away if it was installed before or after paint. In my case, a wheel pant intersection fairing started to separate and the noise it generated in flight was enough to know I had a problem. Since my plane was unpainted, its repair was very quick and easy to accomplish. If the plane had been painted beforehand, a lot of costly rework to strip and prep the surfaces including repainting was going to be required. If I were a painter...which I am not....I might go ahead and paint first. I don't really care about extra work as long as I am the one doing the labor. When I am paying for somebody else's labor, that becomes an entirely different matter.
The point is, try as we might, people are not perfect and despite my best efforts as a conscientious builder, I fell short when originally bonding the intersection fairings to the wheel pants. That particular lesson was learned at minimum cost in time and material. Fact is, I was flying again 2 days later.
So where do you sit? Are you going to paint the airframe or is someone else going to paint it for you? Do you feel comfortable the things I described will not happen to you? If you feel immune to unanticipated defects rearing their ugly heads, "paint first" if not, "fly first."
No matter what you decide, there are advantages and disadvantages inherent with either choice. No doubt, painting first is very attractive because many of the steps required to produce a high quality paint job are/or can be greatly simplified, especially if the wings are painted separately. The downside to the "paint first" option is IF flight testing reveals flaws and then the airframe requires tweaking. Suddenly that high dollar, high quality paint job may have to be redone in part. If the plane was professionally painted, now you've got rescheduling problems with the paint shop to work out in addition to extra and unanticipated downtime to deal with. The need to readjust the horizontal stabilizer immediately comes to mind. Chances are this will not happen to you but it does happen. Imagine the extra rework now involved, most notably reworking the fiberglass empennage fairing. Other more subtle problems can be revealed during Phase One. Lower cowl hinges and rivets that tie into the firewall seem to generate a good share of reported problems. Maybe the cowl is starting to discolor because of excessive heat and you need to add more heat shielding. Maybe initial flight tests reveal the need or desire to install a wedge or tab on the rudder to keep the ball centered in cruise flight. This is very common yet many builders insist their RV does not need rudder trim at all. Good on them but I suggest one only has to take a leisurely stroll up and down the many rows of RV's parked at AirVenture and observe firsthand just how many RV's in attendance do in fact sport a rudder trim of one sort or another and you can usually tell right away if it was installed before or after paint. In my case, a wheel pant intersection fairing started to separate and the noise it generated in flight was enough to know I had a problem. Since my plane was unpainted, its repair was very quick and easy to accomplish. If the plane had been painted beforehand, a lot of costly rework to strip and prep the surfaces including repainting was going to be required. If I were a painter...which I am not....I might go ahead and paint first. I don't really care about extra work as long as I am the one doing the labor. When I am paying for somebody else's labor, that becomes an entirely different matter.
The point is, try as we might, people are not perfect and despite my best efforts as a conscientious builder, I fell short when originally bonding the intersection fairings to the wheel pants. That particular lesson was learned at minimum cost in time and material. Fact is, I was flying again 2 days later.
So where do you sit? Are you going to paint the airframe or is someone else going to paint it for you? Do you feel comfortable the things I described will not happen to you? If you feel immune to unanticipated defects rearing their ugly heads, "paint first" if not, "fly first."
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Who is painting it
I think it comes down to who is going to paint it. If you are going to have an aircraft paint shop do it ,then it wouldn't seem to make much difference.
If you or a friend is going to paint it, then it is much easier to get a good job if it is all apart. That is my route, no budget for expensive paint jobs.
I also agree with Mel, it is easier to get the airplane clean if there are no bugs and oil to start with.
I think it comes down to who is going to paint it. If you are going to have an aircraft paint shop do it ,then it wouldn't seem to make much difference.
If you or a friend is going to paint it, then it is much easier to get a good job if it is all apart. That is my route, no budget for expensive paint jobs.
I also agree with Mel, it is easier to get the airplane clean if there are no bugs and oil to start with.
L.Adamson
Well Known Member
In many cases, the plane just stays un-painted, and fly's year after year in a semi-ugly state. It looks good to the owner/builder though...........because they always can imagine the final finish in their minds. To everyone else.........it's just,,,,, undone.
Painting is a lot of work, or a lot of expense............your choice. But to think a plane is nearly complete, when not painted.......don't. You either kick in and get it done to start with, or just figure months of downtime and possible buckets of dollars for someone else to do it.
Happily, the majority of RV's need little in the way of tweaking after paint. They are a proven aircraft in regards to flying ability. With a quality paint job (as in quality paint), the cowl can be removed plenty of times without scratching. Besides, it will still have to be removed plenty of times whether painting now or in the future.
Just keep the paint "numbers" for the future. Usually, those wheel pants or a bit of the cowl is going to need some touch up, at sometime in the future. You can almost count on the wheel pants needing it.
L.Adamson --- RV6A
Painting is a lot of work, or a lot of expense............your choice. But to think a plane is nearly complete, when not painted.......don't. You either kick in and get it done to start with, or just figure months of downtime and possible buckets of dollars for someone else to do it.
Happily, the majority of RV's need little in the way of tweaking after paint. They are a proven aircraft in regards to flying ability. With a quality paint job (as in quality paint), the cowl can be removed plenty of times without scratching. Besides, it will still have to be removed plenty of times whether painting now or in the future.
Just keep the paint "numbers" for the future. Usually, those wheel pants or a bit of the cowl is going to need some touch up, at sometime in the future. You can almost count on the wheel pants needing it.
L.Adamson --- RV6A
flatspin
Member
danielhv
Well Known Member
Interesting conversation... my initial thought was to fly then paint... I really dont think I could do a good job painting the plane myself. I have never been good with drawing straight lines much less good looking curvy ones. I have a paint scheme in mind, but I personally think it would be way out of my league. Who knows... I've got plenty of time to decide.
cropdusterengineer
Active Member
Not quite....... Here, they are assembled completely painted. Also, when I built a house, I painted it THEN moved in!
CDE
I vote for 'Paint It First" also
I just wouldn't want to have to take it apart after a few hours of flying.
Also---------
You can tell a guy who is scared to fly his plane by the elaborate paint scheme. He would rather paint than fly.
How else would we get to see pretty airplanes??
flame-on
I just wouldn't want to have to take it apart after a few hours of flying.
Also---------
You can tell a guy who is scared to fly his plane by the elaborate paint scheme. He would rather paint than fly.
How else would we get to see pretty airplanes??
flame-on
Me personally from a logic stand point, I say fly first. There will inevitably be adjustments that need to be made, panels opened and closed, cowling removals and reinstallations, possibly control surface removal. Get the plane straight and true, then when it's mechanically correct, make it pretty. You don't want the added stress of worrying about taking care of your new paint job while trying to make adjustments.
dhall_polo
Well Known Member
who's painting?
I can see the logic of painting first if you're painting it yourself. If you're going to hire a paint shop, it seems there's benefit to flying naked. You get most of the kinks worked out before putting it in the shop. I was glad to not worry about paint as I took the cowling and wheel pants off as I resolved issues with brakes and such.
You can also work the timing. I finished my plane just as flying season kicked in. I flew the heck out of it, and put it in the shop around thanksgiving, when weather and wife usually don't want me flying so much anyway. Sure, I missed my plane, but it was a small blip in time.
For those doing the build in a pay-as-you-go fashion, that sure is a lot of flying time you can enjoy while saving the $$$ for the paintshop.
I can see the logic of painting first if you're painting it yourself. If you're going to hire a paint shop, it seems there's benefit to flying naked. You get most of the kinks worked out before putting it in the shop. I was glad to not worry about paint as I took the cowling and wheel pants off as I resolved issues with brakes and such.
You can also work the timing. I finished my plane just as flying season kicked in. I flew the heck out of it, and put it in the shop around thanksgiving, when weather and wife usually don't want me flying so much anyway. Sure, I missed my plane, but it was a small blip in time.
For those doing the build in a pay-as-you-go fashion, that sure is a lot of flying time you can enjoy while saving the $$$ for the paintshop.
SHORTRV7
Well Known Member
Takes much longer, but worth it
I personally vote to paint first even though it might take 6 months to a year to get it in the air. As parts are completed, paint them. I accually was in the paint process for the entire build. Now guess what? I am flying all of the time and don't have to stop at all!!!.
Don
I personally vote to paint first even though it might take 6 months to a year to get it in the air. As parts are completed, paint them. I accually was in the paint process for the entire build. Now guess what? I am flying all of the time and don't have to stop at all!!!.
Don
Bill Palmer
Well Known Member
Third Option
Here’s a third possible option: Prime/Seal, Fly, Paint
1. Prep aluminum and fiberglass surfaces (Fill, Clean, Etch and/or Roughen, Clean Again).
2. Prime with a good 2-part epoxy primer: PPG DP48 system (or equivalent) plus reducer.
3. Immediately Seal Primer with House of Kolor SG-100 Intercoat Clear (or equivalent). Prevents oil, fuel, etc. from penetrating into the primer surface.
4. Assemble, Fly, and then Mod or Fix as required. Then, when you’re ready to “commit” to your final paint job . . .
5. Thoroughly Clean Surface.
6. Buff with 800 grit or higher (roughen the intercoat).
7. Paint.
Pros:
Easy to mod or fix the aircraft’s surface during or after the flight test period, but before final painting. (For various mods and fixes, just clean, re-prime, and seal the area with SG-100)
Do-it-yourself prep, prime, and seal process removes most of the labor costs from the painting process. Also, priming and sealing is easier than the final painting process which requires more skill/experience.
Looks better than just bare aluminum with primed fiberglass surfaces. In fact, the result looks great!
To paint, just clean, rough-up, mask, and shoot. The downtime is less than for a full prep, prime, and paint. (Personal Opinion: Hire a professional painter!)
Cons:
In most cases, the primer and clear intercoat are not UV-resistant, so although the plane looks great, it’s not the equivalent of a “permanent” paint job. The plane should be kept out of the sunlight most of the time (. . . a hangar plane; not a ramp plane). The plane should be painted within a year or two (. . . that’s my guess, anyway; maybe some of the pros can help us here).
Unless you want to remove the wings and empennage, you’re committed to a paint job with the aircraft fully assembled (except for the control surfaces, cowling, wheel pants, etc. that are relatively easy to remove/replace).
Other? (I’m sure there are more Cons; I just can’t think of any more right now.)
Food for Thought, Anyway!
Bill Palmer
Here’s a third possible option: Prime/Seal, Fly, Paint
1. Prep aluminum and fiberglass surfaces (Fill, Clean, Etch and/or Roughen, Clean Again).
2. Prime with a good 2-part epoxy primer: PPG DP48 system (or equivalent) plus reducer.
3. Immediately Seal Primer with House of Kolor SG-100 Intercoat Clear (or equivalent). Prevents oil, fuel, etc. from penetrating into the primer surface.
4. Assemble, Fly, and then Mod or Fix as required. Then, when you’re ready to “commit” to your final paint job . . .
5. Thoroughly Clean Surface.
6. Buff with 800 grit or higher (roughen the intercoat).
7. Paint.
Pros:
Easy to mod or fix the aircraft’s surface during or after the flight test period, but before final painting. (For various mods and fixes, just clean, re-prime, and seal the area with SG-100)
Do-it-yourself prep, prime, and seal process removes most of the labor costs from the painting process. Also, priming and sealing is easier than the final painting process which requires more skill/experience.
Looks better than just bare aluminum with primed fiberglass surfaces. In fact, the result looks great!
To paint, just clean, rough-up, mask, and shoot. The downtime is less than for a full prep, prime, and paint. (Personal Opinion: Hire a professional painter!)
Cons:
In most cases, the primer and clear intercoat are not UV-resistant, so although the plane looks great, it’s not the equivalent of a “permanent” paint job. The plane should be kept out of the sunlight most of the time (. . . a hangar plane; not a ramp plane). The plane should be painted within a year or two (. . . that’s my guess, anyway; maybe some of the pros can help us here).
Unless you want to remove the wings and empennage, you’re committed to a paint job with the aircraft fully assembled (except for the control surfaces, cowling, wheel pants, etc. that are relatively easy to remove/replace).
Other? (I’m sure there are more Cons; I just can’t think of any more right now.)
Food for Thought, Anyway!
Bill Palmer
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We have been back and forth, back and forth over this.
However, this week, we made a decision !
Create a paint booth in our shop and paint it before flight.
If we fly before paint we could be in the air this month, however, when do you rip it apart to paint ?
Dan C took this route and I am sure his is still silver............
There is something about a painted, new airplane on it's first flight that really finishes off a project.
However, this week, we made a decision !
Create a paint booth in our shop and paint it before flight.
If we fly before paint we could be in the air this month, however, when do you rip it apart to paint ?
Dan C took this route and I am sure his is still silver............
There is something about a painted, new airplane on it's first flight that really finishes off a project.
Paul Thomas
Well Known Member
I'm currently working on an RV10 and wish it hadn't been painted yet; simple problems became complicated because it has a first class paint job.
flytoboat
Well Known Member
Such as?
Could you give us some examples of the problems you had that became an issue with the paint job?
Thanks
Could you give us some examples of the problems you had that became an issue with the paint job?
Thanks
There are several potential problems here:
1. HOK product over PPG product. Likely will cause no problems, but...?
2. HOK Intercoat is soft and doesn't hold up to solvents well at all. Fuel spills, lubes, rocks, etc. will mess it up good.
3. Intercoat will cure and will not form chemical bond with topcoat. Sanding will provide mechanical bond, but this is inferior. Also, 800 grit is pretty fine for this application.
Bottom line is that the amount of work required to get the intercoat paint-ready is significant. By the time it's over with, it'll be like painting the plane twice.
Bill Palmer
Well Known Member
Third Option Comments
Steve,
Actually, the third option process was recommended to me by a professional paint supplier and shop. I tried it, and the process works fine as far as I can tell. In my experience, you are clearly wrong relative to your points 1 and 2. I've beat-up some of the parts I primed and sealed, and the resulting surface is extremely durable. Also, I wiped oil and fuel on them as a test, and the surface cleans up without a trace of contaminant. The surface still looks fine and is well-sealed. After all, House of Kolor sells SG-100 as an INTERLOCKING clearcoat, so it is designed to not have problems relative to your points 1, 2, and 3.
For your point 3, I admit that I’m relying on the shop's professional opinion, since I haven't painted yet. The shop said that they use this process quite often, and it works great. They showed me a sample of their work (a custom car) that was painted well after being primed and sealed using this process, and the car looked fantastic. They said that the paint adheres well and the finished surface is extremely durable, as it should be.
I suppose if you're concerned about the intercoat from an adhesion standpoint, you could sand it off completely, sanding into the original primer coat, and then add some more primer before painting. This would involve mainly a rougher grit initial sanding rather than just the fine sanding the shop recommended. I don’t see a tremendous amount of extra work involved if this is what a builder wants to do.
I don't agree that it's like painting twice. If you can get beyond the major, initial prep and the base primer phases, you've cut out a lot of the subsequent labor.
Well, anyway, since you and I seem to be in complete disagreement, I would recommend that those builders who are considering this third option try it on a seat, panel, or something else removable. This is what I did, and the excellent results convinced me to pursue this third option with my RV.
My motivation for the original post was to provide an option which appears to work fine and was recommended to me by a professional paint supplier/shop to specifically solve the Paint First or Paint Later dilemma.
Bill Palmer
Steve,
Actually, the third option process was recommended to me by a professional paint supplier and shop. I tried it, and the process works fine as far as I can tell. In my experience, you are clearly wrong relative to your points 1 and 2. I've beat-up some of the parts I primed and sealed, and the resulting surface is extremely durable. Also, I wiped oil and fuel on them as a test, and the surface cleans up without a trace of contaminant. The surface still looks fine and is well-sealed. After all, House of Kolor sells SG-100 as an INTERLOCKING clearcoat, so it is designed to not have problems relative to your points 1, 2, and 3.
For your point 3, I admit that I’m relying on the shop's professional opinion, since I haven't painted yet. The shop said that they use this process quite often, and it works great. They showed me a sample of their work (a custom car) that was painted well after being primed and sealed using this process, and the car looked fantastic. They said that the paint adheres well and the finished surface is extremely durable, as it should be.
I suppose if you're concerned about the intercoat from an adhesion standpoint, you could sand it off completely, sanding into the original primer coat, and then add some more primer before painting. This would involve mainly a rougher grit initial sanding rather than just the fine sanding the shop recommended. I don’t see a tremendous amount of extra work involved if this is what a builder wants to do.
I don't agree that it's like painting twice. If you can get beyond the major, initial prep and the base primer phases, you've cut out a lot of the subsequent labor.
Well, anyway, since you and I seem to be in complete disagreement, I would recommend that those builders who are considering this third option try it on a seat, panel, or something else removable. This is what I did, and the excellent results convinced me to pursue this third option with my RV.
My motivation for the original post was to provide an option which appears to work fine and was recommended to me by a professional paint supplier/shop to specifically solve the Paint First or Paint Later dilemma.
Bill Palmer
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L.Adamson
Well Known Member
Not really! It's not completely like painting twice, but close to it!
If you're going to the trouble of putting on a primer base, in which you would want to go to the hassle of eliminating dust, and over spray......
Then why not just get on with the process and use a primer that flashes, and allows the first coat in 15 minutes or so. Why go to all this trouble, only to have to sand all the primer down again.... as well as fuel and oil stains?
The "adjustment" argument, just doesn't pan out with RV's. You'll be pulling off various parts over the years for maintenance and inspections. So why not just get it done and over with......now?
L.Adamson --- RV6A
I'm not a professional painter, but have done quite a few cars, motorcycles, one plane, bicycles, etc. usually with HOK products. I have gathered a fair amount of info over the years from books, tech sheets, painters, suppliers, and, most importantly, experience. Of these sources, paint jobbers have been the least reliable, and I now pretty much disregard what they say.
What I can tell you for sure is that SG100 is DESIGNED as a temporary clear to be used while taping graphics and such. It dries very quickly and thus allows multiple layers of graphics to be applied. The idea is that once this is done, it gets sprayed with a proper catalyzed topcoat, typically within a day or so. I'm certainly not saying that your suggested method will fail, only that it is second best to a wet on wet application. Allowing SG100 to sit for years and then scuffing will not provide the bond that a traditional application would offer.
Regarding solvents, SG100 will not stand up to solvents nearly as well as catalyzed clear. I have never tested it with gasoline, but I have found that urethane reducer wrecks it pretty quick.
Finally, the idea that sanding a coat or two of intercoat clear off of an entire airplane is no big deal could not be further from the truth. Anybody who has ever color sanded an entire vehicle knows the hours required to remove just the orange peel, let alone the entire film.
I certainly mean no disrespect, but I am speaking as someone who over the years has suffered from well-meaning, but inaccurate, paint advice. The best advice I can offer anybody who wants to paint is to go with the manufacturers' recommendations regarding sanding grit, flash times, compatibility, etc.
What I can tell you for sure is that SG100 is DESIGNED as a temporary clear to be used while taping graphics and such. It dries very quickly and thus allows multiple layers of graphics to be applied. The idea is that once this is done, it gets sprayed with a proper catalyzed topcoat, typically within a day or so. I'm certainly not saying that your suggested method will fail, only that it is second best to a wet on wet application. Allowing SG100 to sit for years and then scuffing will not provide the bond that a traditional application would offer.
Regarding solvents, SG100 will not stand up to solvents nearly as well as catalyzed clear. I have never tested it with gasoline, but I have found that urethane reducer wrecks it pretty quick.
Finally, the idea that sanding a coat or two of intercoat clear off of an entire airplane is no big deal could not be further from the truth. Anybody who has ever color sanded an entire vehicle knows the hours required to remove just the orange peel, let alone the entire film.
I certainly mean no disrespect, but I am speaking as someone who over the years has suffered from well-meaning, but inaccurate, paint advice. The best advice I can offer anybody who wants to paint is to go with the manufacturers' recommendations regarding sanding grit, flash times, compatibility, etc.
Paul Thomas
Well Known Member
All our problems could have been solved if they had assembled the airplane before paint; none of the are related to first flight since that has yet to happen.
-We had to make a custom alternator bracket because there was not enough clearance.
-We moved the elevators back because we did not have enough clearance
-I damaged a part (bent edge & damaged the paint) when the aileron screw got in the way of the flaps.
-...
Another thing to consider is some paint shops want the plane assembled (of
course you need to remove the control surfaces and canopy). But both of my
RV's were painted before flight. I did assemble them completely before
paint (no nuts on the bolts, and dummy spar bolts) so as to complete
all the fairings and rig all the controls and insure proper gaps in the cowling
for paint. Then disassembled for paint (wings off). The painting process
is simplified this way. One thing also to consider is trim lines that cross
parts that have been removed and that requires some extra planning.
Most RV's fly pretty good right out of the box and at most a rudder trim
tab might have to be added and/or an Aileron trailing edge banged or squeezed.
With care you can remove the cowling dozens of times without scratching the
paint (still try and do that!)
The advantage to the way we did it, was everything was ready at assembly.
Just installed the bolts (with nuts this time) and she was ready to fly.
The current Chino Paint Scheme era finds those planes with that scheme
are still unpainted several years later.....no thanks. I like the original
Chino idea best, which was paint!
course you need to remove the control surfaces and canopy). But both of my
RV's were painted before flight. I did assemble them completely before
paint (no nuts on the bolts, and dummy spar bolts) so as to complete
all the fairings and rig all the controls and insure proper gaps in the cowling
for paint. Then disassembled for paint (wings off). The painting process
is simplified this way. One thing also to consider is trim lines that cross
parts that have been removed and that requires some extra planning.
Most RV's fly pretty good right out of the box and at most a rudder trim
tab might have to be added and/or an Aileron trailing edge banged or squeezed.
With care you can remove the cowling dozens of times without scratching the
paint (still try and do that!)
The advantage to the way we did it, was everything was ready at assembly.
Just installed the bolts (with nuts this time
) and she was ready to fly.The current Chino Paint Scheme era finds those planes with that scheme
are still unpainted several years later.....no thanks. I like the original
Chino idea best, which was paint!
N8RV
Well Known Member
Having flown about 100 hours on Smokey now, and having been reluctant to land anywhere before it was painted, I now have an opinion. Maybe this has already been addressed on this thread (I only scanned the comments, sorry), but if I had it to do over ...
I'd fly first THEN paint. Glad I did it the way I did.
The biggest reason for me is that I've had to remove the cowling several times in the first 100 hours. The fit was so tight that removing it by myself has always been challenging. Having flown it for a year now, it's MUCH easier to get the cowling back on because the baffle seals have set and the piano hinges are more worn. It's no big deal to pull the cowling now.
HOWEVER, I have also banged up the paint a bit, even being careful. It's just a lot of acreage to manhandle alone, and there are too many things to watch while replacing the cowling to keep from scratching things. It's heartbreaking to see the scratches and nicks appear, but that's life. If I'm having trouble preventing dings now, after the cowling is easier to place, I can't imagine how much more damage would likely occur if I'd painted it first and THEN struggled with it during the first 100 hours.
Just my observation. Your mileage may vary.
I'd fly first THEN paint. Glad I did it the way I did.
The biggest reason for me is that I've had to remove the cowling several times in the first 100 hours. The fit was so tight that removing it by myself has always been challenging. Having flown it for a year now, it's MUCH easier to get the cowling back on because the baffle seals have set and the piano hinges are more worn. It's no big deal to pull the cowling now.
HOWEVER, I have also banged up the paint a bit, even being careful. It's just a lot of acreage to manhandle alone, and there are too many things to watch while replacing the cowling to keep from scratching things. It's heartbreaking to see the scratches and nicks appear, but that's life. If I'm having trouble preventing dings now, after the cowling is easier to place, I can't imagine how much more damage would likely occur if I'd painted it first and THEN struggled with it during the first 100 hours.
Just my observation. Your mileage may vary.
L.Adamson
Well Known Member
No................there is NOT that much tweaking....
We hear about so many flights.........in which the plane fly's straight & true.
And why is that? It's because the design is proven.
No matter what, eventually the cowl and other removable inspection parts will come off time after time, for inspections, condition inspections, oil changes etc. A good paint job holds up rather well. I've been around too many RV's in the last 16 years to know this as fact.
IMO----------If you're financially not able to fly it off to some painter, within a short period of time, then bite the bullet and convert part of your work area into a paint booth..........and get it done. It's a big time consuming job, and the plane will never be done, or look it's best without paint. Some of the RV's go for year after year without paint, because it's simply a big pain to do afterwards.
Never the less, I've seen far too many RVs that were painted before the trial flight, and don't end up any worse for wear...........after a few years of removing this and that, in the normal course of maintenance.
Your plane will most likely get a ding here and there...........no matter what.
L.Adamson --- RV6A
i think there is a real value in flying first, and setting up for painting in the winter if possible with heated paint booth. your flight time will most likely be very low compared to summer depending on your weather patterns, might as well devote a month of downtime to getting it painted and taking the extra summer time for flying
2 & a half cents
It's surely fun to see the differing "world views" and justification on this- well actually on the entire DR site.
I'm finishing a fly first/paint WAY WAY later 4.
I found a flyer several years ago. It was cool to to see the unpainted completion before buying, but thats another topic-
If one decides to fly first, just don't fly it 600 hours and 10 years before finally panting. What. A. Mess.
BP
It's surely fun to see the differing "world views" and justification on this- well actually on the entire DR site.
I'm finishing a fly first/paint WAY WAY later 4.
I found a flyer several years ago. It was cool to to see the unpainted completion before buying, but thats another topic-
If one decides to fly first, just don't fly it 600 hours and 10 years before finally panting. What. A. Mess.
BP
