General Questions

[SteelMike]

Umm... So I know everyone hates a newbie, but I've got some general questions. If you'll suffer a newbie like myself, I'd really appreciate it. I'm pretty close to pulling the trigger on a -7 and need some start up questions. Some of these are way down the line, but for now, it's just curiosity's sake...

1. Engines: Could they make this more confusing? I'm thinking 360-something-or-the-other. But what is the difference between IO, O, A1A, B2B, Horizonally induced vs. Vertically induced. Huh?!? Check out Lycoming's site herehere and see the 500 different versions of the 360. What's the difference between all those models?

2. Tools. Got it. Avery tool kits with the 3x gun... But what about power tools. Air compressor (duh), bench grinder, drill press, dremel, band saw? What else?

3. Dan C's website makes this fantastic point about QB vs. Slow Build - that if you don't build it yourself, are you comfortable maintaining it? Can anyone weigh in on this? All things being equal, I'd probably go QB even in spite of the cost difference, but this point makes me a little wary of not doing all the work myself just so I know the airframe that much better.

Oh, and I don't even know where to start on avionics. Is there a good resource out there to learn what's available? All the acronyms and model types/part numbers just looks like gobledy-gook to me.

Many thanks for entertaining this newb's questions..
mb

[AntiGravity]

Hi Mike,

we were all newbies once, and some of us still are! Me? I'm really, really, REALLY stuggling to get my head around the electrical and wiring. I just don't get it; I'm makingheadway though, by thinking of just one part of the circuit at a time.

Anyway, to your questions.

1. Engine; can't help too much there I'm afraid, but I can tell you that you don't need to give it much thought up front. I'm 2½ years into a slow build -8 and the main fuse structure is done. I only needed to consider the engine when I ordered the finish kit and had to specify the engine mount & cowl. You can afford to research that more later.

2. Tools. Yep, the Avery kit is good. Over the build I now have more than double the recommended 2/32" and 1/8" clecos and 1/2" and 1" cleco sidegrips. Also have a DRDT-2 dimpler which is way better than the Avery C-frame. Love my pneumatic squeezer and 90 deg air drill too (not the Avery 90 deg adapter, but a whole other drill). I've managed to get away without a band saw, though occasionally I wish I had one. Air compressor, drill press, bench grinder, dremel. Yep, yep, yep and yep. I don't have much else in the way of power tools. Oh, I have a couple of cordless drill/screwdrivers which come in useful occasionally.

3. I went slow build, though it was mostly a money question. I'm glad I did; I've done plenty of modifications that would have been a whole lot trickier in QB. I confess to not building my own tanks. I had Evans Aviation do them for me with the flop tubes and capacitive senders. Once I'd got as far with the wings that I needed the tanks I was pretty confident I could have down them after all. Ah well...

4. Avionics? OH MY GOD!! What a minefield. Good luck with that. There is lots of personal opinion out there so check the specs/features/price and make up your own mind. My latest (revision 6?) plan is AFS Advanced Deck, Garmin 495 GPS, Garmin SL30, Garmin GTX330, PMA-9000EX with some 2¼" backup guages (airspeed, altimeter, VSI, turn/slip).

Don't worry about much of this stuff. I'm not yet a pilot, or an aircraft engineer for that matter, and frankly the learning curve has sometimes been, shall we say, steep! But you tackle it one small part at a time and gradually understanding builds and it begins to fall into place. Its a wild ride and a great adventure. Come on board! :-)

[leeschaumberg]

Mike
You are not a newbie any more! May not have read every thing but not a newbie. Now that you have riveted some of your brains out your getting there.
1. Engines - They can make or break you. I'm a lover of big engines but you don't have to run them at full tilt. The web has spec sheets on standard Lycoming engines and a goggle of rebuilt engines. There is an old saying that goes - what turns the shaft usally gets it! For a model how about an IO390. This is an IO360 bored out. Same size and weight of the IO360. Over the IO320 it is only about an inch wider and costs only 1000 dollars more. Many times if you find an engine to buy it's because no body else wants to. Dyafocal 1 vs 2 is an example. Fell free to ask first. After you learn some more about engines you'll find you need to know more.
PS I have only dyno run engines from less than 1 hp to ones that had more than 5000 hp. Gasoline , diesel , gaseous fuel , 2 strokes , 4 strokes , turbocharged , and intercooled.
Knowledge is power and power is money.
More on 2-4 later

[RickWoodall]

Hey Mike.
I was similar to you not that long ago. Not a pilot and not a builder. Both have changed and i have learned lots and got my wings. Been a pile of learning but loved it all.
Here is my opinion for what its worth.
Tools, call avery, tell em what you are building and get the full kit they suggest. They will suggest the extra cleco's the pneumatic squeezer etc. Over the build you may need a few more drill bits, maybe another cut off wheel, and a few cheap things that i would just get at harbour freight or home depot. Cheap drill press, bench grinder, die grinder and band saw can all be borrowed for the times you use them or bought for $500 total, your choice. I went with the basic dimpler and have never had an issue, or wished i spent the extra.
Engine, i started dreaming of an egg suburu cause they looked great and made sense. Almost bought a new one from a divorce on Ebay. WOW, as i learned and read and talked to builders i saw the errors of my ways. I will due to my limited knowledge on this go tried and true and use one the the very well respected builders and the engine vans recommends for my plane io 320. Mattituck or Aerosport will answer any questions. It is confusing, mags, pmags, laser, blah blah. You have lots of time to learn this. Smart folks here will help you with any questions.
Dan c, Smitty, Mike Schipper, jeffs rv, etc etc all have incredible build logs that if you spend a few afternoons looking ahead on your build...you will learn a ton and speed up the build as you see what comes together and how.
Quick build or slow. Well, i am more interested in flying and i have a great wife and two kids. I decided i would rather be out the extra money and have extra time with my family, or be finished a year or more earlier...i went qb and would do it again in a minute.
Avionics etc. Here is my humble opinion. Engine, avionics, lights and interiors are changing fast. I am on my finish kit, and have not made any decisions. I am getting close and will order the prop, fwf and engine at osh. The issue is that i love the new stuff and as an example Dynon, AFS and MGL have incredible tech at pretty fair prices. Folks that have the avionics 3 years before they fly, paid way more and dont have state of the art. Get building and enjoy learning and watching advances before you pull the trigger. I know whatever i go with will be outdated too, but, if i can get an excellent led light package that looks great, uses less juice and lasts way longer than the standard vans package that has been used forever and is still crazy expensive...that is what works for me.
Get building and enjoy. Lots to learn and lots to spend.

[Bob Collins]

Mike
This might be helpful.

[pierre smith]

......hate newbies...we love 'em! Mike, you really, really need to go find an active EAA chapter, hang out with the guys, look at any kind of project and make friends there. You'll see and learn more about engine choices, rivetting, avionics and wiring than you can imagine. Oh, and join EAA since their monthly magazine has a ton of good info about any aspect you have a question about.

Again, welcome,

[flion]

and at 14 years into the project I still feel like a noob on some things. Ron Wanttaja has written a couple of great intro books, Kitplane Construction and Aircraft Ownership that will help get you started. Also, get hold of the complete set of Tony Bingelis books; you'll find info on tools, techniques, and even about choosing an engine. Engine choice and avionics are probably the most difficult and individual decisions you'll make; no two aircraft are exactly alike. You can start by deciding what kind of flying you want to do and what equipment you like to work with. No use building a glass panel if you prefer steam gauges, and so on ...

One last thing. The best way to get advice from this or any forum is to start out by saying "I'm thinking of trying it this way ..." You'll be flooded with replies telling you why you shouldn't and testimonials on why your idea is the greatest. Not that we're an opinionated bunch ...

[SteelMike]

Awesome. Thanks guys. I'm actually on my way to the EAA local chapter meeting in about an hour. We'll see what I find.

[frankh]

But I like the 2X gun...As its the only one I've used but it has plaenty of driving power.

I personally think there is plenty of experience to be gained on a QB kit...about 1000hours to be honest!

Frank

[Jeff R]

Eventually, this stuff will start to sink in. Don't get overwhelmed - take things a step at a time and it will soon start to make sense.