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Tip: Mounting the tail light

F

flyvans.com

Well Known Member
Hi,

found a convenient way to mount the whelen combination taillight/strobe to the bottom rudder fairing...
space is pretty limited and installation of nutplates almost impossible. also, i did not intend to remove the complete fairing, should there be a wire/bulb change eventually required...

looking around the shop for ideas, i found that piano hinge eyelets can be tapped for #4 machine screws, which come with the taillight. so instead of glassing/gluing the default nut, i cut 2 eyelets from a piano hinge, tapped them and cut the "vane" side of the eyelet to fit in the narrow space in the rudder fairing. made the large hole for the light and matchdrilled the position for the screws. then removed the light, reinstalled the screw with the eyelet as a "nutplate" on the backside, the "vane" being caught in the narrow ridge above and below where the taillight will sit. used some hot glue to hold the eyelets in place, then removed the screws, slid in the taillight and reattached the screws. el-cheapo nutplate so to speak ;-)

enjoy building,

regards, bernie
www.flyvans.com
 
Sounds pretty inventive!

A thinking experimenting group we have here on the forum.

I cheated, I used the mini one legger nutplates MS21071L04 for the rudder bottom. Although I have not mounted the acual light itself yet.
 
I just mounted mine a few days ago. Didn't have the nut plates that would fit, so this is what I did, seems to be quite strong.

Drilled the big hole for the light and to have better access to the inside of the fairing. Used the light ring to mark for the screw holes and drilled them slightly oversize. Mixed 5 minute epoxy and spread a light coat on the fairing to hold the nuts in place temporarily. Using the light ring, for a template put the screws in and snug them down. (before installing the screws, put a little WD-40 on the threads). Now thouroughly cover the nuts and surrounding area with epoxy. They are there to stay.

After about 10 minutes I removed the screws, and after thourough cureing I chased the nut threads with a tap to clear out any remaining epoxy. Done deal...

Larry
 
Here is another idea. I riveted two mini #6 nutplates to an aluminum doubler I created. Then I blind riveted the doubler to the bottom rudder fairing. A little micro/epoxy mix to smooth it out and viola!

rudder021wf3.jpg


rudder022yr4.jpg


rudder023uy2.jpg
 
weathers said:
Here is another idea. I riveted two mini #6 nutplates to an aluminum doubler I created. Then I blind riveted the doubler to the bottom rudder fairing. A little micro/epoxy mix to smooth it out and viola!
Click to expand...

I like this way a lot.
 
tail strobe

I screwed around trying to find a good method to mount the tail strobe, but finally just roughly followed the vans directions and filled the fairing up with small wet fiberglass strands where the screws hold. At the time I really didn't like the idea but just couldn't figure out another way to do it. I finally drilled and tapped the epoxy thinking it was not going to work. When I screwed it all together it worked great! Way stronger than I thought it would be and no hint of the threads pulling out, probably works so good b/c the little screws are so long.

On another note, I found this same strobe/light broken after about only 60 hours. The strobe tube glass was literally broken out, ouch. I attribute this to not having a rudder lock in place, which also can't be good for the rudder structure. I really couldn't find a rudder lock I liked, didn't want something that you could inadvertently take off with, much prefered a fool-(pilot)-proof design. In the end I found a compromise, but I would just warn people of this danger since the A500 is something like $130+ snaps you would rather spend on something else.
 
Different technique

This seems to be the definitive thread on installing the Whelen rear navlight/strobe in the lower rudder tip so I would like to add a slightly different technique for those who might look this up in the archives down the track. I get so much from the archives that I feel motivated to give something back.

When they get to this little project many builders simply fix the light fitting by drilling and tapping into the fibreglass rudder tip....but sooner or later they tend to find the threads strip. Others try to epoxy the nut inside the tip but that can present its own alignment and security problems.

My approach was to fabricate an interface plate from 1/8" aluminium bar. It's a couple of hours work but then you can be assured it will work flawlessly forever.

I used the Whelen light as a template to fabricate the plate. I drilled and tapped 2 threads into the 1/8" plate to accomodate the Whelan #4 stainless screws. The 1/8" plate is thick enough to accomodate the threads without needing a platenut on the rear. I then fixed the plate to the composite rudder tip using 1/8" countersunk pop rivets. The attached pix show the technique. You can left click on the pix to enlarge them. You can see that I have etched and alodined the plate ready for final painting.







For archive: rudder tip whelen nav light navlight strobe strobelight
 
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No, no, no! You are all wrong. ;)

Just kiding there.

I simply epoxied (w/ flox) the nuts that came with the light into the rudder bottom. No problems at all.
 
N941WR said:
No, no, no! You are all wrong. ;)

Just kiding there.

I simply epoxied (w/ flox) the nuts that came with the light into the rudder bottom. No problems at all.
Click to expand...

Yep, I notice that Dan Checkoway did the same....he used 5 minute epoxy. Certainly the lightest and fastest way to go. If one of the nuts comes loose however (and they have been known to do exactly that) it means drilling out all the pop rivets in the rudder tip in order to get it off to affect a repair.

I note that some builders just fill up inside the light recess with a microfibre mix and then drill and tap straight into the composite. I'd certainly have reservations about that.

I want to stop building when I start flying.
 
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Lots of fiberglass stuff has been arriving in the mail the last few days. Cool. Too bad the weather is too. :mad:

Anyway, I'm interested in the design where people have made a small doubler and then riveted and/or glassed it in.

When folks glass this doubler in, are they running the fabric into the hole for the light... curling it around to the opposite site? And how many layers?
 
I epoxy the nuts that hold the tail light on just on the inside of the fiberglass horn. No problem so far on any. Makes for easy removal.
 
I was thinking of doing that but I've got a weird situation inside my tip. The fiberglass (as sent) is a freakin' mess in there. It's not like I can lay the nut flat on a surface and just epoxy it...there's a layer of fiberglass (or two) in there that looks like it slipped or something during cure and ... well... it's just a mess.

That's why I'm going to plan B..
 
Take a dremel tool and grind it out and the e poxy will fill any voids that you remove there is not much stress back there.
 
It's down at that little point...it's virtually imposible to get a dremel in there. I actually like the doubler plate idea...I just need to see some examples of what people are talking about when they say glass it over. It makes sense to me what they're talking about, but I'm trying to get a good grasp of the lingo and maybe there's various flavors of glassing over this particular part.
 
Bob Collins said:
It's down at that little point...it's virtually imposible to get a dremel in there. I actually like the doubler plate idea...I just need to see some examples of what people are talking about when they say glass it over. It makes sense to me what they're talking about, but I'm trying to get a good grasp of the lingo and maybe there's various flavors of glassing over this particular part.
Click to expand...

Bob, you really don't need to do any glassing at all. Just make the doubler plate and fasten it on with countersunk pop rivets. See post #9 on this thread. I used 6 rivets....it isn't coming off in a million years.

Incidentally I initially had the same problem as you....no way to get a reasonable surface inside the cone to seat the screws and get them properly aligned. Eventually gave up and went with the doubler plate, and glad I did.
 
Bob Collins said:
No significant chance of those pop rivets pulling through?
Click to expand...


That tail light has a mass that is three tenths of a poofteenth...and I have 6 x 1/8" rivets holding it. Probably overkill. And I used long rivets so they pulled up into a nice big ball.

If you have any reservations perhaps you could instal little individual washers at the rear of each rivet. Alternatively you could use some epoxy microfibre mix between the fairing and the doubler. Either way I doubt it's life or death stuff.

Actually I just went out to my workshop and tried to wrench the tail light off. The Whelen light mechanism is going to rip apart before that gusset plate comes off.
 
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Here's Another Way

I thought about all the great ideas on this thread, but in the end decided to do this my way...

1. Drill mounting holes in the rudder bottom fairing to #30
2. Install a couple of LP4-3 blind rivets, using 5-minute epoxy for added strength and to help keep the rivet from rotating
3. Punch out the rivet mandrels
4. Drill the holes in the rivets to #43 for 4-40 screws
5. Tap the holes in the rivets with a 4-40 tap
6. Mount the strobe/tail light using 4-40 screws supplied

This is a very simple, cheap, lightweight solution that seems to work very well.:cool:





 
I created a mounting plate from .040 aluminum and tack-glued the nuts that came with the nav light to it with cyanoacrylate. When it was time for the plate to be attached to the fairing, I waxed the screws and screwed them into the nuts just protruding. I used HySol with flox to glue the plate on.

Initially, I broke the light cover when I assembled the light. It turns out that the supplied gasket is too thick and screwing the cover down to meet the mounting plate shattered the cover (so I know the mounting plate can handle more stress than the cover...). I fabricated a new gasket from thinner material and it is now secure and snug.
 
Sparky said:
I thought about all the great ideas on this thread, but in the end decided to do this my way...

1. Drill mounting holes in the rudder bottom fairing to #30
2. Install a couple of LP4-3 blind rivets, using 5-minute epoxy for added strength and to help keep the rivet from rotating
3. Punch out the rivet mandrels
4. Drill the holes in the rivets to #43 for 4-40 screws
5. Tap the holes in the rivets with a 4-40 tap
6. Mount the strobe/tail light using 4-40 screws supplied

This is a very simple, cheap, lightweight solution that seems to work very well.:cool:





Click to expand...

Sparky,
Well Done!
After years of tail light abuse on rough fields and lousy mounting practices (epoxy, flox, blind nuts, and so forth,) your rivet and tap method is the best I have seen. I tried that this weekend and I have never had my light more secure. I did not use epoxy to hold it. I did use a backing washer to take up space of the baffel type rivet. I really like it!:D
Simple. fast, easy to replace rivets if need be.
 
Sometimes a simple, effective solution like this comes along. Brilliant! I used Tee nuts from my old R/C days, but this is better.

Well done!

Vern
 
Thanks, Kahuna and Vernon for the compliments. I got the idea for using blind rivets when I was installing the standard Van's static ports in the fuselage.:D
 
Thats what I used on several RV's. They dont hold up on tail draggers on grass strips. They are a pain to install.
 
Same as above

I did the same. Epoxied the nut on with flox. Doesnt look nearly as elegant as the other solutions, but it holds on tight.
 
Sparky said:
I thought about all the great ideas on this thread, but in the end decided to do this my way...


Wish I had seen this last week! I riveted nutplates to an aluminum plate in turn riveted on the back of the rudder. Why use only two parts like you did when you can use 9 to accomplish the same job with more weight? Doh...

Great idea!

Carl Raichle
RV 9A
the last bits and pieces before the wings go on permanently.
Click to expand...
 
Not exactly trouble free...

I bookmarked this site a while ago until I needed to mount the tail strobe and this sure seemed like a great idea at the time. One of the rivets went in fine and tapped fine. The other spun during tapping, even though it was epoxied with 5 minute epoxy, and it was a PITA to remove. I was dumb enough to try it again. In the end, I had to drill out 4 LP4-3 rivets before giving up on these and going with a cherrymax rivet. That held while tapping no problem, even without epoxy. YMMV.
 
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