Van's Air Force
Don't miss anything! Register now for full access to the definitive RV support community.
Rivet call out too long?
- Thread starter shiney
- Start date
The correct rivet length should be 1.5 times the diameter sticking out past the material before driving. A 1/8" rivet (AD4) should have 3/16".shiney said:On the W818 Aileron assembly (pushrod) the plans ask for AN470AD4-12 rivets but these look way too long to me! is this correct? I tried one and if it is correct how the !!!!!! do I stop these suckers from bending over during squeezing??
Thanks fellas
Shiney
captainron
Well Known Member
Use 11's
Use 11's. They are within .008" of the length required for 1.5x dia. in this application. You'll be fine.
Use 11's. They are within .008" of the length required for 1.5x dia. in this application. You'll be fine.
Last edited:
RV7Factory
Chief Obfuscation Officer
Clamp the pushrods in a vise and shoot them. I found it much easier that way. Just my $.02.shiney said:
GAHco
Well Known Member
shiney said:On the W818 Aileron assembly (pushrod) the plans ask for AN470AD4-12 rivets but these look way too long to me! is this correct? I tried one and if it is correct how the !!!!!! do I stop these suckers from bending over during squeezing??
Thanks fellas
Shiney
We stock the Monel Rivets MS20615-4M10, 11, 12 in pkgs of 25.
http://www.gen-aircraft-hardware.com/new_items.asp
In the certified world an aluminum rivet holding two steel parts together would not be accepted, especially in a control system.
GAHco
Well Known Member
My opinion
Welding or Monel Rivets, assuming that ether one is done properly, are better than the aluminum rivets the plans call out.
(although there are literally thousands flying around with aluminum rivets)
Doing both would be totally unnecessary and not be an improvement.
Welding after aluminum installing rivets would be detrimental to the rivets.
For huge amounts of input see
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=8358
shiney said:Thanks guys,
I'm thinking that as I'm likely to want to do some aeros (albeit light stuff) I'd rather go for the welding option than rivets. Has anyone done both for belt and braces?
Welding or Monel Rivets, assuming that ether one is done properly, are better than the aluminum rivets the plans call out.
(although there are literally thousands flying around with aluminum rivets)
Doing both would be totally unnecessary and not be an improvement.
Welding after aluminum installing rivets would be detrimental to the rivets.
For huge amounts of input see
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=8358
Captain Avgas
Well Known Member
Mel said:
That formula does not work for very long rivets. All "bucked" rivets fatten up inside the material being joined and this reduces the rivet metal available for forming the shop head. For nominal material thicknesses this "loss" of rivet metal is so marginal as to be insignificant
However when the total amount of material being joined is very thick (and hence the rivet is long) the loss of rivet metal can be so great that even a rivet that complies with the 1.5 rule will not have sufficient metal to form a complying head.
Last edited:
GAHco
Well Known Member
Very true
very true I have seen situations in other planes where the tubing and the end fitting (AN490 or similar)have even more free air space in the middle and to comply with a service bulletin or AD it was necessary to take one end off and inspect the interior condition of the tubing.
Sometimes the rivets had bent in the middle, off to the side, and the only way to get the end fitting off was to carefully grind of the shop head and drill off the manufactured head, then drill into the rivet from both ends until you could get it to break free.
The important part is that the rivet is a shear pin and as long as it expands to be tight in the hole, and have a sufficient shop head to keep it from working out, you are good to go.
BTW. I have never seen any end fitting put in with only one rivet, it is always at least two.
Captain Avgas said:
very true I have seen situations in other planes where the tubing and the end fitting (AN490 or similar)have even more free air space in the middle and to comply with a service bulletin or AD it was necessary to take one end off and inspect the interior condition of the tubing.
Sometimes the rivets had bent in the middle, off to the side, and the only way to get the end fitting off was to carefully grind of the shop head and drill off the manufactured head, then drill into the rivet from both ends until you could get it to break free.
The important part is that the rivet is a shear pin and as long as it expands to be tight in the hole, and have a sufficient shop head to keep it from working out, you are good to go.
BTW. I have never seen any end fitting put in with only one rivet, it is always at least two.
cytoxin
Well Known Member
put the tube in a padded vise
then use a hand squeezer to carefully squeeze the rivets as you manhandle the squeezer and they will drive just fine. yes you can go down a size and some have filled the tube with epoxy to prevent loosing material in the tube i did not. these are really easy once you get one to go correctly..tube in vise both hands on the squeezer.
then use a hand squeezer to carefully squeeze the rivets as you manhandle the squeezer and they will drive just fine. yes you can go down a size and some have filled the tube with epoxy to prevent loosing material in the tube i did not. these are really easy once you get one to go correctly..tube in vise both hands on the squeezer.
you're never alone!
you're never alone when you've got your vans family around (thats how I feel all the time). Many thanks for the ideas and guidance. Yet another mile stone passed with this posting, it's my first time I've stimulated TWO pages of replies!
Cheers
Shiney
you're never alone when you've got your vans family around (thats how I feel all the time). Many thanks for the ideas and guidance. Yet another mile stone passed with this posting, it's my first time I've stimulated TWO pages of replies!
Cheers
Shiney
chris mitchell
Well Known Member
I had just this problem. This is the link to the thread:
http://tinyurl.com/yqgqmn
I got fed up with it, remade the rods and welded the fittings in place. Looks really neat and tidy, and as paulr says, no chance of interference with the rear spar.
If I was going to rivet the ends, I'd just hammer them (hammer, anvil), not squeeze them.
Chris
http://tinyurl.com/yqgqmn
I got fed up with it, remade the rods and welded the fittings in place. Looks really neat and tidy, and as paulr says, no chance of interference with the rear spar.
If I was going to rivet the ends, I'd just hammer them (hammer, anvil), not squeeze them.
Chris
