VansAirForceForums  
Home > VansAirForceForums

- POSTING RULES
- Donate yearly (please).
- Advertise in here!

- Today's Posts | Insert Pics

  #171  
Old 03-15-2019, 10:55 AM
Ted RV8 Ted RV8 is offline
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 307
Default Is this applicable?

https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/...privacy-policy
Reply With Quote
  #172  
Old 03-15-2019, 11:22 AM
DanH's Avatar
DanH DanH is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 08A
Posts: 8,203
Default

Not really. You can request that the FAA not release your flight information to outside vendors. Your ADS-B transmissions (1090 or 978) need not be anonymous to request privacy under the policy.

You will remain identifiable by the FAA, any other governmental agency, and by anyone with a smart phone and a cheap radio dongle. For that you'll need a true anonymous mode.
__________________
Dan Horton
RV-8 SS
Barrett IO-390
Reply With Quote
  #173  
Old Yesterday, 07:02 AM
DanH's Avatar
DanH DanH is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 08A
Posts: 8,203
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jliltd View Post
I leave my Mode C transponder in standby until ready to taxi, which I think leaves the GDL 82 in standby during its GPS acquisition and start up. Jim
Got to that question yesterday.

Powered up a GTX-327 transponder in STANDBY, squawk set to 1200, with the GDL-82 unpowered. After a few moments, I applied power to the GDL-82 while monitoring for signal. No ADS-B packets were transmitted with the transponder in STANDBY.

However, subsequently switching the transponder from STANDBY to ALT caused the GDL-82 (with pin 5 grounded, and supposedly anonymous) to momentarily broadcast initial "real ID" packets (true ICAO and N-number) before switching. I only noted the text traffic display. I did not save the packets to a .csv file to look at number of packets or specific content.

Perhaps it is time to hear from our friends at Garmin.

Quote:
Originally Posted by moosepileit View Post
The GDL goes quickly anonymous, from what Dan posted. Today you would have to be at one of the 35 or so major airports that use ASDE-X on the ground and have GBT installations- The FAA's UAT towers.

Or, you would have to be receivable by a GBT anywhere else, on the ground, at power up. Slim chance on average, today.
Maybe, maybe not. An official ADS-B ground installation is not required. Consider we're recording the initial real ID data with a $20 dongle radio receiver coupled to a $15 frequency filter. Any cell tower would do.
__________________
Dan Horton
RV-8 SS
Barrett IO-390
Reply With Quote
  #174  
Old Yesterday, 05:47 PM
Alan Carroll's Avatar
Alan Carroll Alan Carroll is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Posts: 761
Default

FlightAware already has coverage down to the ground at my home base, a small uncontrolled field, apparently through the PiAware network. This seems to be limited to 1090 for now, but looks like 978 could be coming soon (see newsletter linked below).

Welcome to the FlightAware ADS-B newsletter for February 2019!
__________________
Alan Carroll
RV-8 N12AC
Reply With Quote
  #175  
Old Yesterday, 09:23 PM
moosepileit moosepileit is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Floyds Knobs, IN
Posts: 371
Default

FBOs are in on feeding Flightaware. John Q. Public feeds flightaware. My context quoted above is first what the FAA GBT "System" sees from a UAT in Anonymous mode.

Secondary concern is the public side, for now, the public side is 1090-centric. 978 has to get to the info websites via the GBTs and active flight plans. IF Anonymous from GBTs, no one sniffing your UAT startup, no code but 1200- today, you are likely anonymous, with some caveats.

Right?
__________________
RV-6, bought from builder.
O-320, slider, carb, mags, FP
Reply With Quote
  #176  
Old Today, 07:08 AM
Alan Carroll's Avatar
Alan Carroll Alan Carroll is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Posts: 761
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by moosepileit View Post
Secondary concern is the public side, for now, the public side is 1090-centric. 978 has to get to the info websites via the GBTs and active flight plans. IF Anonymous from GBTs, no one sniffing your UAT startup, no code but 1200- today, you are likely anonymous, with some caveats.

Right?
That seems right, with the operative phrase being "for now."

Crowd-sourced 978 monitoring in the future would perhaps not matter, unless the initial identification that is broadcast at startup could be used to label you thereafter?
__________________
Alan Carroll
RV-8 N12AC
Reply With Quote
  #177  
Old Today, 07:41 AM
DanH's Avatar
DanH DanH is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 08A
Posts: 8,203
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by moosepileit View Post
Right?
Absolutely. Today.

https://flightaware.com/adsb/stats/

https://discussions.flightaware.com/...-antenna/45405

https://flightaware.com/commercial/firehose/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Carroll View Post
Crowd-sourced 978 monitoring in the future would perhaps not matter, unless the initial identification that is broadcast at startup could be used to label you thereafter?
Which appears trivial for anyone with a data feed and a vested interest. The initial packets stream real ID, and the receiver location is known, so anonymous packets arriving at the same receiver exactly one second after the ID packets would be an assumptive link with very high probability.
__________________
Dan Horton
RV-8 SS
Barrett IO-390

Last edited by DanH : Today at 07:53 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #178  
Old Today, 08:11 AM
moosepileit moosepileit is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Floyds Knobs, IN
Posts: 371
Question

Big picture, for at least Garmin UATs in line with Mode C transponders, one would hope the logic could suppress transmitting anything before the self-assigned ICAO code was generated. (Edit to add, assumes pin 5 is switched to ground at power up).

It smells like the UAT first looks for BOTH 1200 code and WAAS GPS position, but squirts your real ID for 4 seconds as it crunches the self-assignment formula of lat/long/gps time.

4 seconds is a long time in many regards.

Anyone have a 200W dummy load for an antenna selector switch?
__________________
RV-6, bought from builder.
O-320, slider, carb, mags, FP

Last edited by moosepileit : Today at 08:16 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #179  
Old Today, 10:02 AM
DanH's Avatar
DanH DanH is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 08A
Posts: 8,203
Default

We bought UAT units marketed to us as being anonymous, not "Switches to anonymous after a short period", or "Anonymous if no one is listening".

Anonymous was the manufacturer's representation. It's what we have a right to expect. I prefer to believe the people involved adhere to a high standard, so I'll be looking for a software update, not a workaround.
__________________
Dan Horton
RV-8 SS
Barrett IO-390
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:57 AM.


The VAFForums come to you courtesy Delta Romeo, LLC. By viewing and participating in them you agree to build your plane using standardized methods and practices and to fly it safely and in accordance with the laws governing the country you are located in.