Van's Air Force
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New Cheaper Tracker
- Thread starter VHS
- Start date
Posting Photos
Pat Hatch offered to post the photo, and I apologize if you had to join the Micro-Trak Yahoo group just to see the picture. The unit is not frequency agile, since there is only one frequency widely used in America ( And the rest of the world combined does not buy as many APRS trackers as we do!) Making a single channel unit allows me to make it smaller and cheaper. In fact, there are no user controls or adjustments, no pots, no switches. ( although I did leave a place on the board to add a configuration-select switch if you are motivated to do so.
Allen
VHS
Pat Hatch offered to post the photo, and I apologize if you had to join the Micro-Trak Yahoo group just to see the picture. The unit is not frequency agile, since there is only one frequency widely used in America ( And the rest of the world combined does not buy as many APRS trackers as we do!) Making a single channel unit allows me to make it smaller and cheaper. In fact, there are no user controls or adjustments, no pots, no switches. ( although I did leave a place on the board to add a configuration-select switch if you are motivated to do so.
Allen
VHS
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
Cheap Transmitter
Sam,
You are correct sir. The only thing in the cigarette lighter is a fuse, but it also helps to keep people from applying reverse polarity voltage, which will toast this unit quickly. The voltage regulators are in the box. If you slice the plug off, just remember that red is positive! The actual input plug to the box is a 6 pin mini DIN connector.
Allen
VHS
Sam,
You are correct sir. The only thing in the cigarette lighter is a fuse, but it also helps to keep people from applying reverse polarity voltage, which will toast this unit quickly. The voltage regulators are in the box. If you slice the plug off, just remember that red is positive! The actual input plug to the box is a 6 pin mini DIN connector.
Allen
VHS
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
Test flew LORAN/APRS antenna today...
I mounted the new CI-122SP LORAN antenna on the belly as shown below and it ended up being about 74" from the COM 1 antenna on the left in the photo. Clearance off the ground from the tip was about 5". I ended up shortening the antenna about 3.5 inches, still might be a little long, but I don't think it's going to make any difference at 10 watts!
Bob Mills graciously offered to monitor my flight in real time, so I called him on the phone as I was taxiing out and we were conversing for the whole flight. I was at 2,000' for most of the flight and pretty much tracked the same as I had on the first flight, which Bob had posted in the thread that preceded this one. I really can't tell any difference between this antenna and the CI-122 COM antenna that I was borrowing from my COM 2. So I guess we can pronounce the LORAN antennae a success as APRS alternatives!
Here's my ground track:
And here a photo of the antenna installation relative to the two COM antennae.
I'm still getting feedback from the tracker on COM 1, but only on the ground, and not as often as before. I did not notice any interference in flight at all, so that's an improvement. What I am getting is not really that objectionable, actually. It kind of serves as an indicator that the tracker is working as you taxi out.
Thanks to Bob for giving me real-time feedback as I was flying! A plug here for the Zulu headset: reception was perfect throughout the flight using the Bluetooth feature of the headset.
In conclusion, if you're thinking about APRS at all, grab one of these LORAN antennae off of eBay for about $10 while you can still get them. They come in two varieties, bent whip or straight. It would be interesting to compare the two, obviously the straight will probably have a little better performance, but does it matter?
I mounted the new CI-122SP LORAN antenna on the belly as shown below and it ended up being about 74" from the COM 1 antenna on the left in the photo. Clearance off the ground from the tip was about 5". I ended up shortening the antenna about 3.5 inches, still might be a little long, but I don't think it's going to make any difference at 10 watts!
Bob Mills graciously offered to monitor my flight in real time, so I called him on the phone as I was taxiing out and we were conversing for the whole flight. I was at 2,000' for most of the flight and pretty much tracked the same as I had on the first flight, which Bob had posted in the thread that preceded this one. I really can't tell any difference between this antenna and the CI-122 COM antenna that I was borrowing from my COM 2. So I guess we can pronounce the LORAN antennae a success as APRS alternatives!
Here's my ground track:
And here a photo of the antenna installation relative to the two COM antennae.
I'm still getting feedback from the tracker on COM 1, but only on the ground, and not as often as before. I did not notice any interference in flight at all, so that's an improvement. What I am getting is not really that objectionable, actually. It kind of serves as an indicator that the tracker is working as you taxi out.
Thanks to Bob for giving me real-time feedback as I was flying! A plug here for the Zulu headset: reception was perfect throughout the flight using the Bluetooth feature of the headset.
In conclusion, if you're thinking about APRS at all, grab one of these LORAN antennae off of eBay for about $10 while you can still get them. They come in two varieties, bent whip or straight. It would be interesting to compare the two, obviously the straight will probably have a little better performance, but does it matter?
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Pat,
Glad to hear that it worked well. I looked at your track on aprs.fi and saw that you primarily hit one digi and an I-gate about 10 miles north of you. It looks like there are not a lot of digis out there? I did not see any evidence though that the antenna had anything other than good omnidirectional patterns. My kudos to whoever came up with using the LORAN antennas as VHF transmitters. You have done your Nation a great service!
Allen
VHS
Glad to hear that it worked well. I looked at your track on aprs.fi and saw that you primarily hit one digi and an I-gate about 10 miles north of you. It looks like there are not a lot of digis out there? I did not see any evidence though that the antenna had anything other than good omnidirectional patterns. My kudos to whoever came up with using the LORAN antennas as VHF transmitters. You have done your Nation a great service!
Allen
VHS
Internal GPS
Jim,
The GPS is not built in. The dongle with the DB-9 allows direct plug in of a 4800 Baud GPS, but Byonics has a chip that can accept 4800 or 9600 baud input ( NMEA only, no proprietary Garmin data or other works of satan!) If/whn you order one, just make sure that we send you the dual baud rate chip. The DB-9 can also be used with a null modem adapter ( 6.00 from Byonics) and the TT3 configuration software (free to download from the Byonics website) in case you want to make changes to the configuration. The defaults we use for SmartBeaconing are similar, but not identical, to what Sam recommends in the the sticky on that subject. I can hardly wait until one of you guys test flies this new unit! ( Electronic geek parental pride)
Allen
VHS
Jim,
The GPS is not built in. The dongle with the DB-9 allows direct plug in of a 4800 Baud GPS, but Byonics has a chip that can accept 4800 or 9600 baud input ( NMEA only, no proprietary Garmin data or other works of satan!) If/whn you order one, just make sure that we send you the dual baud rate chip. The DB-9 can also be used with a null modem adapter ( 6.00 from Byonics) and the TT3 configuration software (free to download from the Byonics website) in case you want to make changes to the configuration. The defaults we use for SmartBeaconing are similar, but not identical, to what Sam recommends in the the sticky on that subject. I can hardly wait until one of you guys test flies this new unit! ( Electronic geek parental pride)
Allen
VHS
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
Sam,
I thought you had forsaken the ways of the Byonics products and switched over to our evil competitor? If you want one, just say the word and I wil ship it out as soon as I have assembled units! Your article in Kitplanes alone generated so many new hams you are entitled to a manufacturer kickback! Just send me an E-mail with your shipping address. ([email protected])
Allen
I thought you had forsaken the ways of the Byonics products and switched over to our evil competitor? If you want one, just say the word and I wil ship it out as soon as I have assembled units! Your article in Kitplanes alone generated so many new hams you are entitled to a manufacturer kickback! Just send me an E-mail with your shipping address. ([email protected])
Allen
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
petehowell
Well Known Member
That was me!
Allen - I am the troublemaker in the group! I run the OT2 and a Yaesu mobile, cuz I just had to have the ability to email my buddies from 10K feet. I still highly recommend the Microtraks to everyone. They are simple, reliable, lightweight, and the work great in the wingtip or the fuse.
Plus the maker is one of us!
Sorry I defected - I still use a MT300 to test antennas - and one of these new ones is going in the car when the twins start driving!
Allen - I am the troublemaker in the group! I run the OT2 and a Yaesu mobile, cuz I just had to have the ability to email my buddies from 10K feet. I still highly recommend the Microtraks to everyone. They are simple, reliable, lightweight, and the work great in the wingtip or the fuse.
Plus the maker is one of us!
Sorry I defected - I still use a MT300 to test antennas - and one of these new ones is going in the car when the twins start driving!
rvmills
Well Known Member
Allen,
Just to clarify, from the first post the MT-RTG will come as shown in the picture, but will also include a GPS (like the Byonics GPS2) and a magnet mount antenna...is that correct?
And the DB-9 dongle is pretty much the same thang as the DB-9 on the MT-8000FA, right (from your second post, its where the GPS2 or other GPS will connect, and where config changes can be made)
Nice small all-in-one package! I'm thinking like Pete...good portable car-to-plane set-up! Good luck in sales of the new product!
Pat, I had fun watching your flight, and have another test run of the CI-122SP to post on as well (as you know from watching today). I'm gonna copy and paste your post and reply to it in the Loran thread, just to let Allen's new product thread run.
Cheers,
Bob
Mike S
Senior Curmudgeon
http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=27773
Good primer on the subject.
Lots of additional info in the "APRS Tracking" forum.
Expert advice please.
I have a non-used Archer com antenna in my wing tip. It is attached to a rg-400 cable that used to run to my #2 com. Is it possible to use the comm antenna for aprs? Seems as if performance may be compromised due to freq differences, but maybe someone know the correct answer. Maybe a proper j pole antenna would be better. They do not seem hard to make or even purchase one from the Howell factory, if it is still in business.
Allen, I like the new product and will be watching the Byonics web site.
Thanks, David
I have a non-used Archer com antenna in my wing tip. It is attached to a rg-400 cable that used to run to my #2 com. Is it possible to use the comm antenna for aprs? Seems as if performance may be compromised due to freq differences, but maybe someone know the correct answer. Maybe a proper j pole antenna would be better. They do not seem hard to make or even purchase one from the Howell factory, if it is still in business.
Allen, I like the new product and will be watching the Byonics web site.
Thanks, David
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
I have a non-used Archer com antenna in my wing tip. It is attached to a rg-400 cable that used to run to my #2 com. Is it possible to use the comm antenna for aprs? Seems as if performance may be compromised due to freq differences, but maybe someone know the correct answer. Maybe a proper j pole antenna would be better. They do not seem hard to make or even purchase one from the Howell factory, if it is still in business.
Allen, I like the new product and will be watching the Byonics web site.
Thanks, David
David,
Since the Archer is already installed and ready to go, I would certainly give it a try. I suspect it will work quite well since our APRS trackers are airborne and are very forgiving of gross antenna sins.
Let us know how it goes--the Archer might be another good antenna option.
Archer Antennas
I had never seen an Archer antenna and went to their website to check them out. Very strange animals! I don't think there is much risk in trying one with a transmitter on 144.390.
Sam, Keep your eyes open for a Priority Mail envelope coming your way.
Allen
VHS
I had never seen an Archer antenna and went to their website to check them out. Very strange animals! I don't think there is much risk in trying one with a transmitter on 144.390.
Sam, Keep your eyes open for a Priority Mail envelope coming your way.
Allen
VHS
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
Allen,
The Archer wingtip com antenna's reputation is kinda spotty since it is difficult to get much in the way of vertical orientation in the confines of the wingtip. However, the horizontally polarized nav antenna works very nicely (I have one).
But.........the j-pole shouldn't work well in a wingtip, either, so the Archer might be pretty good. Nothing like brute force to get our little BB's to an iGate.
I'll be sitting by the mailbox.
Low Cost Transmitter
Byon has the ad for the new unit on the Byonics webpage, and you can see a photo and download the manual if interested.
http://www.byonics.com/microtrak/mt-rtg.php
73,
Allen
VHS
Byon has the ad for the new unit on the Byonics webpage, and you can see a photo and download the manual if interested.
http://www.byonics.com/microtrak/mt-rtg.php
73,
Allen
VHS
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
No excuses now
I think this little tracker is going to put to bed the excuses like "I don't want to have to mess with geek stuff and figuring out how to set up a tracker".
Send Byonics some money, make sure you have passed the simple Tech exam, find a place in the plane for the tracker and antenna, plug it in, and fly.
Not sure how to make it any simpler...........
I think the MT-RTG bundle will become the default aviation tracker.
I think this little tracker is going to put to bed the excuses like "I don't want to have to mess with geek stuff and figuring out how to set up a tracker".
Send Byonics some money, make sure you have passed the simple Tech exam, find a place in the plane for the tracker and antenna, plug it in, and fly.
Not sure how to make it any simpler...........
I think the MT-RTG bundle will become the default aviation tracker.
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Hard wiring
I am planning to hard wire the device to an open cb in the panel and use an on/off rocker switch. Other than being careful with polarity anyone see a problem? Also the magnet in the gps2 antenna may become a problem. The intent is to mount the gps antenna adjacent to my 496 XM antenna on the behind the seat brace(RV7). Will fasten the antennas with velcro.
Got to get the plane back together and take that test. I will try the Archer first.
David
I am planning to hard wire the device to an open cb in the panel and use an on/off rocker switch. Other than being careful with polarity anyone see a problem? Also the magnet in the gps2 antenna may become a problem. The intent is to mount the gps antenna adjacent to my 496 XM antenna on the behind the seat brace(RV7). Will fasten the antennas with velcro.
Got to get the plane back together and take that test. I will try the Archer first.
David
Simplest system possible-various rambling thoughts
Sam and Odlee,
I hope you are right, and that every experimental finds these things cheaop and easy enough to add. It seems that transmitting antennas are always going to be a big issue with you guys, but this is about as plug and play as I can make it! The GPS does not require a ground plane, so its perfectly happy with velco or double stick tape. The tracker itself is light weight enough where it could also be mounted with double stick tape or velcro, although it has screw mounting tabs. The GPS 2 has an LED in it, and some people find it comforting to see the solid light, to know their GPS is both powered and locked on. I am going to ask Byon to change the default Smart Beaconing parameters to the ones you suggest in the sticky. They are pretty close right now anyway.
I think the next step in APRS for aircraft will be giving you the ability to do bidirectional tracking, allowing you to see the positions of other stations on your GPS, and send text messages. I understand that size and expense are major factors. I am thinking about a design that would look a lot like my MT-AIO , but would be a 10 Watt transceiver. ( I built a few of these and beta tester prototypes and people loved them!) I am thinking about using a PDA running Windows Mobile to wirelessly link to the transceiver to display maps and APRS stations, as well as sending text messages.The tracker could be mounted out of sight, and the PDA could be turned on when you want to see what others are doing, or send e-mails or text messages. ( They don't have a no texting while flying rule yet do they?)
Allen
Sam and Odlee,
I hope you are right, and that every experimental finds these things cheaop and easy enough to add. It seems that transmitting antennas are always going to be a big issue with you guys, but this is about as plug and play as I can make it! The GPS does not require a ground plane, so its perfectly happy with velco or double stick tape. The tracker itself is light weight enough where it could also be mounted with double stick tape or velcro, although it has screw mounting tabs. The GPS 2 has an LED in it, and some people find it comforting to see the solid light, to know their GPS is both powered and locked on. I am going to ask Byon to change the default Smart Beaconing parameters to the ones you suggest in the sticky. They are pretty close right now anyway.
I think the next step in APRS for aircraft will be giving you the ability to do bidirectional tracking, allowing you to see the positions of other stations on your GPS, and send text messages. I understand that size and expense are major factors. I am thinking about a design that would look a lot like my MT-AIO , but would be a 10 Watt transceiver. ( I built a few of these and beta tester prototypes and people loved them!) I am thinking about using a PDA running Windows Mobile to wirelessly link to the transceiver to display maps and APRS stations, as well as sending text messages.The tracker could be mounted out of sight, and the PDA could be turned on when you want to see what others are doing, or send e-mails or text messages. ( They don't have a no texting while flying rule yet do they?)
Allen
n18pf
Well Known Member
I pulled the magnet out of the GPS2 so I could mount it up on the glare shield next to my compass. Glued velcro to the bottom and it works great. I've got the antenna in the same place running up the canopy (tip-up). Actually the "antenna" is just a piece of 0.041 safety wire mounted in a BNC connector. So far I've been happy with the coverage I get in the local area.
Low Cost Tracker
Byonics takes the orders and ships the products, I just sit around my office thinking profound thoughts and burning myself with my soldering iron...
Byonics is in Las Vegas Nevada, and I am in Napa, California.
Byon does not have the MT-RTG's in his hands yet, but I know we have pre-sold at least a few units, and I am guessing that he will have the first production unit tomorrow.
Why do you want to sell your AIO?
Allen
VHS
Byonics takes the orders and ships the products, I just sit around my office thinking profound thoughts and burning myself with my soldering iron...
Byonics is in Las Vegas Nevada, and I am in Napa, California.
Byon does not have the MT-RTG's in his hands yet, but I know we have pre-sold at least a few units, and I am guessing that he will have the first production unit tomorrow.
Why do you want to sell your AIO?
Allen
VHS
Link to Tracker
Here it is! http://www.byonics.com/microtrak/mt-rtg.php
I know a bunch of people have ordered them for EA's, but I am hoping that someone here will let us know how it works for you.
Allen
VHS
Here it is! http://www.byonics.com/microtrak/mt-rtg.php
I know a bunch of people have ordered them for EA's, but I am hoping that someone here will let us know how it works for you.
Allen
VHS
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
MSFT-1
Well Known Member
dumb questions
What is the url of the website to see someone's track?
Is there any ability to limit who can see your track?
Is there any historical data and is it searchable/downloadable etc.?
Is there coverage in remote areas / mountain regions?
Canada and the Caribbean?
SPOT has the ability to send basic "I'm OK messages". Does this have anything like that? I would love to be able to send SMS messages while I am flying.
thanks.
What is the url of the website to see someone's track?
Is there any ability to limit who can see your track?
Is there any historical data and is it searchable/downloadable etc.?
Is there coverage in remote areas / mountain regions?
Canada and the Caribbean?
SPOT has the ability to send basic "I'm OK messages". Does this have anything like that? I would love to be able to send SMS messages while I am flying.
thanks.
deej
Well Known Member
Aw, no fair, I thought I ordered the first one!
Mine shipped yesterday, should be here soon.
-Dj
deej
Well Known Member
I use http://aprs.fi/ but there are several sites available to view the data.
No.
Sorta. On the aprs.fi website, you can review the data over the past 24 hours. Since the data is public, you could possibly capture it yourself to maintain a historical archive.
The coverage is pretty good, but not everywhere. If you are using it in an airplane, you have the best antenna location in the world (high), so you have a good chance of hitting a digi.
I'm not sure. Canada, yes, but not sure about the Carribean.
Yes, you can do this. It takes a more advanced unit than the MT-RTG, but you can setup something. I believe Sam has some information about this. If you use the TT4 unit, you can even do two way messaging.
http://www.byonics.com/microtrak/mt-tt4.php
-Dj
APRS Capabilities
Q: What is the url of the website to see someone's track?
A: Go to aprs.fi and enter the call sign of the tracker
Q: Is there any ability to limit who can see your track?
A: No, but you can use a "tactical" call sign and a misleading Icon ( you could make your aircraft a sailboat for instance) as long as you enter your actual FCC call sign in the comment field to keep the transmission legal.
Q:Is there any historical data and is it searchable/downloadable etc.?
A: The Raw data is archived in a number of areas but don't count on anything but recent info.
Q: Is there coverage in remote areas / mountain regions?
A: Maybe. At Altitude, you might hit digipeaters from hundreds of miles away, in Canyons, not so much.
Q: Canada and the Caribbean?
A: Canada uses our frequency (144.390) and has good coverage over most of the Country. I am not sure how to answer your question about the Caribbean. Other Countries have different frequencies, or no APRS at all.
Q:SPOT has the ability to send basic "I'm OK messages". Does this have anything like that? I would love to be able to send SMS messages while I am flying.
A: This unit (The MT-RTG) is a "dumb" tracker, but you can send E-mail via the APRS Network if you are in range of a digipeater, which will port your message over to an "I-Gate" or internet gateway. You need a transceiver to do this. We sell a product called the MT-TT4 to do this, and OpenTrac has a similar product ( without a built in radio) to do this as well. Of course, with either of these, you can also see the position of other APRS stations on your display GPS.
Allen
VHS
www.byonics.com
Q: What is the url of the website to see someone's track?
A: Go to aprs.fi and enter the call sign of the tracker
Q: Is there any ability to limit who can see your track?
A: No, but you can use a "tactical" call sign and a misleading Icon ( you could make your aircraft a sailboat for instance) as long as you enter your actual FCC call sign in the comment field to keep the transmission legal.
Q:Is there any historical data and is it searchable/downloadable etc.?
A: The Raw data is archived in a number of areas but don't count on anything but recent info.
Q: Is there coverage in remote areas / mountain regions?
A: Maybe. At Altitude, you might hit digipeaters from hundreds of miles away, in Canyons, not so much.
Q: Canada and the Caribbean?
A: Canada uses our frequency (144.390) and has good coverage over most of the Country. I am not sure how to answer your question about the Caribbean. Other Countries have different frequencies, or no APRS at all.
Q:SPOT has the ability to send basic "I'm OK messages". Does this have anything like that? I would love to be able to send SMS messages while I am flying.
A: This unit (The MT-RTG) is a "dumb" tracker, but you can send E-mail via the APRS Network if you are in range of a digipeater, which will port your message over to an "I-Gate" or internet gateway. You need a transceiver to do this. We sell a product called the MT-TT4 to do this, and OpenTrac has a similar product ( without a built in radio) to do this as well. Of course, with either of these, you can also see the position of other APRS stations on your display GPS.
Allen
VHS
www.byonics.com
APRS
Do any of you guys that are buying the latest and greatest APRS, have a Micro-trak 300 that you might want to get rid of? The reason I ask is, I have a J-3 Cub on floats that I fly, and it doesn't have an electrical system. According to the Micro-Trak 300 manual, the 300 and the GPS will run on a 9 volt battery. That would work great in the Cub.
My e-mail address is mtamm at screenworksinc.net
Thanks
Mike T.
Do any of you guys that are buying the latest and greatest APRS, have a Micro-trak 300 that you might want to get rid of? The reason I ask is, I have a J-3 Cub on floats that I fly, and it doesn't have an electrical system. According to the Micro-Trak 300 manual, the 300 and the GPS will run on a 9 volt battery. That would work great in the Cub.
My e-mail address is mtamm at screenworksinc.net
Thanks
Mike T.
