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  #31  
Old 02-16-2017, 05:05 AM
BillL BillL is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central IL
Posts: 3,870
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rv7charlie View Post
Uhhh, I'm glad you didn't damage anything.

Hard to know for sure how you were doing this, without actually seeing it. But it sounds like you were using a steel tool, and you were driving it with a rivet gun. It also sounds like the tool was placed against the bulkhead, which sounds like it may have been driving against the bend of the flange (in the 'corner') instead of out at the dimple.

Is that correct?
Nope - radially outward along the axis of the rivets. The rivets were bridged with a countersunk piece of .063 thick 6061. The bridge got pounded pretty good, only the small one was used. It nicely conformed to the hammer head. Trust me, if it was going to move, it would have. The plastic shoe was placed against the sub panel.

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Last edited by BillL : 02-18-2017 at 04:11 PM.
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  #32  
Old 02-22-2017, 07:00 PM
nilberg nilberg is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Katy, TX
Posts: 108
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OK. I have been messing around with the fit and am ready to start the drilling for the canopy frame. I plan to use temporary pop rivets to keep things in reasonable position.

1: C-614, basically committing to the width
2: WD-716G attach tabs
3: The hinge

The question is how much of the skin should be (temporary) riveted and should the sub-structure (sub-panel and ribs) be fully riveted to get the best results.
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  #33  
Old 02-23-2017, 06:02 AM
BillL BillL is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central IL
Posts: 3,870
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nilberg View Post
OK. I have been messing around with the fit and am ready to start the drilling for the canopy frame. I plan to use temporary pop rivets to keep things in reasonable position.

1: C-614, basically committing to the width
2: WD-716G attach tabs
3: The hinge

The question is how much of the skin should be (temporary) riveted and should the sub-structure (sub-panel and ribs) be fully riveted to get the best results.
I think the subframe should be riveted in as it is beginning of the canopy fit. If the F771 is mounted, and perfectly aligned at the longerons, then clamped with cleo clamps or 4-40 screws for the -4 rivets. I did this and the stagger still appeared on mine. Even with all this there are no guarantees.

I still think (at this time) that the only for sure way to properly fit and complete the canopy frame is after the 771 is riveted on. Alternatively, if the canopy frame is completed and fits perfectly with the plexi installed, then make a precise template of the front contour matched to the inside of the skin. Then, as the 771 is installed use that to match the contour. Make sure it has a good immovable datum to position it relative tot he longhorns. That would at least allow the 771 assembly to be adjusted or replaced in the installation stage.

Good luck - it will take a few years to play out.
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  #34  
Old 02-25-2017, 12:35 PM
nilberg nilberg is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Katy, TX
Posts: 108
Default This just got worse

As I was moving along with the canopy frame drilling, I was marking the 1/4 hinge location with a marker on the tab. Good news: I got very consistent location. Bad news, it was always too close to the edge and also different forklift and right.

I was 99% sure I needed to add some material (by welding), so I took the risk of use a bushing (1/4 outer, #40 inner) to mark the location. As expected, the edge distance on the left is almost 0:


Right side is OK, not centered but similar to other builders:


My options are:

1. Welding on more material - It has been done before
2. New frame and skin - But the hole might end up and the same location
3. New ribs and hinge block - basically move the hole in the sub-panel structure

I will see what vans says, but what do you guys think ?

Last edited by nilberg : 02-25-2017 at 03:35 PM. Reason: fixing photo links
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  #35  
Old 02-25-2017, 02:22 PM
BillL BillL is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central IL
Posts: 3,870
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Sorry, No pictures for me. Make sure the permissions is "all who have the link"

I recently had everything set correctly, posted and got the dreaded gray (-). Trashed the links, logged off and then back into google photo, reposted the same way and it worked. I had to use my wife iPad as a guest viewer to go back and forth to find the issue. I could see them but not others.

I wonder why the holes are so far back? Are all the clecos in the F771 skin? Every single one?
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  #36  
Old 02-25-2017, 04:03 PM
nilberg nilberg is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Katy, TX
Posts: 108
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I had all clecos in and sub structure partially riveted. I know things normally moves around and I actually re-marked several time and always ended at the same spot.

I have seen some builders end up with spacers on the frame ribs, that would move the tabs further back, but not by 3/16 which is what I need.

I seen other builders with the exact same problem, also on left side. They ended up welding the holes up and weld on extra material. That is what the builders are told by vans as well. It's probably what I end up doing, as the frame is $300 + shipping.

It is strange that some small improvements is not done. It would be simple to have the rear tube actually follow the skin and maybe even have oversized tabs that could be reduced, leaving 3/16 around the bushing.
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  #37  
Old 02-25-2017, 04:16 PM
BillL BillL is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central IL
Posts: 3,870
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nilberg View Post
I had all clecos in and sub structure partially riveted. I know things normally moves around and I actually re-marked several time and always ended at the same spot.

I have seen some builders end up with spacers on the frame ribs, that would move the tabs further back, but not by 3/16 which is what I need.

I seen other builders with the exact same problem, also on left side. They ended up welding the holes up and weld on extra material. That is what the builders are told by vans as well. It's probably what I end up doing, as the frame is $300 + shipping.

It is strange that some small improvements is not done. It would be simple to have the rear tube actually follow the skin and maybe even have oversized tabs that could be reduced, leaving 3/16 around the bushing.
Actually, I am having a hard time remembering, but do faintly recall putting one in the vice and bending the end with a hammer (hand sledge?). Not sure if I dreamed about it or did it. Sorry. I had a lot of designing dreams about this part of the project.

Scott (rvbuilder2002) has welded these before.
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  #38  
Old 02-26-2017, 03:03 PM
goldbar goldbar is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: slc, UT
Posts: 29
Default Woops

I'll be in town till Wednesday if you want to come see mine.

Brad Smith[/quote]

HyBrad,
Somehow I missed this post of yours, sent a pmail yesterday, would love to fake you up on this offer.
kelly
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