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  #21  
Old 03-05-2017, 09:24 AM
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engineerofsorts engineerofsorts is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 292
Default Capacitor loacation

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaleB View Post
I second that, and I hope your wife enjoyed her lunch! Looking forward to getting mine installed. I'll also be installing a good sized electrolytic filter capacitor, which for some reason was not part of the original installation on the RV-12.
I believe it has been pointed out earlier that the cap is buried in the switch block. However, the recommended voltage and capacitance for the SH regulator is higher than that in the RV-12, but the world won't come to an end if you stick with the existing cap.
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  #22  
Old 03-05-2017, 09:25 AM
John-G John-G is online now
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaleB View Post
I second that, and I hope your wife enjoyed her lunch! Looking forward to getting mine installed. I'll also be installing a good sized electrolytic filter capacitor, which for some reason was not part of the original installation on the RV-12.
Dale - Actually, there is a filter capacitor on the RV-12 .... it is a 22,000 MFD capacitor rated at 25 volts residing inside the AV-50001 Switch and Fuse Module. If additional capacitance is needed, it can be added by attaching the capacitor to P156. The positive end of the capacitor would go on P156 (output of the regulator) and the negative end of the capacitor would be tied to ground.

Total capacitance for capacitors in parallel are added. So with the 22,000 MFD already in the AV-50001 module on the P156 circuit ... if the recommended capacitor size from Silent Hektik is, say, 33,000 MFD ... then it will only require adding an additional capacitor of 10,000 MFD rated at 25 volts anywhere on the P156 wire to get you in the ballpark.

If this install will be firewall froward, I would suggest purchasing a capacitor that is automotive rated because it will have a higher temperature rating and be better suited for the higher temperatures under the cowl.

Happy building,
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  #23  
Old 03-05-2017, 09:51 AM
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DaleB DaleB is offline
 
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Location: Omaha, NE (KMLE)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John-G View Post
Dale - Actually, there is a filter capacitor on the RV-12 .... it is a 22,000 MFD capacitor rated at 25 volts residing inside the AV-50001 Switch and Fuse Module.
Well, by golly, so there is. And yes, I'm quite well aware of how capacitors work. Well, I have this nice new capacitor I'll probably just swap in during the condition inspection. 33,000 F, 35V, 105 C temperature rating. A little extra margin is almost never a bad thing.
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  #24  
Old 03-05-2017, 02:08 PM
funflying funflying is offline
 
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Location: arvada, co
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Default Plug and play

I guess I hoped the SH regulator was a direct swap for the Ducati VR. I would appreciate a little more direction on the install of the additional capacitor. It sounds like some did the install with no change to Vans wiring and others are including an additional capacitor, and this protects the circuit?

I am not as savvy as Dale or John in the previous posts with the electrical requirements and with so much done by Vans/Stein on the 12 I appreciated this. Thanks for any additional insight.
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Last edited by funflying : 03-05-2017 at 03:39 PM.
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  #25  
Old 03-06-2017, 07:22 AM
John-G John-G is online now
 
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Location: Northeast Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by funflying View Post
I guess I hoped the SH regulator was a direct swap for the Ducati VR. I would appreciate a little more direction on the install of the additional capacitor.
Patrick - The SH regulator IS a direct drop-in replacement for the Ducati regulator. Many have not changed or added an extra filter capacitor and have had no issues what so ever.

But you know how it can be with us builders who tweak things ... if Silent Hektik recommends a certain filter capacitor value, we try to comply. Truth be told, if you just replaced the Ducati regulator with the SH and did nothing more, you would likely be fine with the 22,000 MFD capacitor Van's has already supplied.

Real world ... upping the filter capacitor value or adding an additional capacitor to get to the value SH suggests will likely only provide a tiny bit better regulation from where it is now. Bottom line if you don't feel comfortable playing with the wiring ... don't ... you will be fine.

I'm moving my regulator away from the #4 exhaust pipe and the outflow from the coolant radiator but still keeping it firewall forward .... so will likely add an additional capacitor because I will need to extend the wiring harness, so adding an additional capacitor will be easy to incorporate while building the extension wiring harness.

As for how to attach the capacitor should you decide to go that way, there are many ways you could do it. One example would be to make a short extension wire that plugs into the connector for the regulator ... the other end of the wire you can use a connector like the one in the following photo to make a Y for the capacitor's positive lead. Use connectors designed for 12 gauge wire on the extension not 14 gauge as shown in the photo.
http://www.steinair.com/product/14-1...e-faston-14-2/
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  #26  
Old 03-06-2017, 08:13 AM
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DaleB DaleB is offline
 
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Yep. What John said. I'd forgotten about the filter cap on the fuse board. Swapping it for a 33,000 F or adding a parallel capacitor is probably not necessary. If you do, adding one with the terminal to which he provided the link would be adequate.

I'm sure a "real" EE will correct me if I'm off when I say this, but in many cases the value of a filter capacitor specified for a voltage regulator or power supply is a matter of the designer's preference rather than a specific calculated value. In many cases it's simply "more is better", or what the designer has on hand or perhaps what's used in another product (one less part number to inventory). In a situation like this, the difference between a 22K and 33K capacitor in the overall circuit would be pretty small indeed. If I had remembered about the one on the fuse board, I'd more than likely not have bothered ordering another one.

I have a new, larger filter cap ready to install... but it will probably wait until I have the plane torn apart anyway for the condition inspection. The regulator will get installed as soon as I get to the hangar to do it, because my Ducati regulator was putting out 13.1 Volts and a whine in the headsets on the last few flights.
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  #27  
Old 03-06-2017, 08:43 AM
funflying funflying is offline
 
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Default Thanks

John & Dale thanks for your input on this matter. Currently my original Ducati, is in the original firewall location, but I am watching its performance. Lately my battery voltage has stayed in the 13.6 neighborhood and amps come up fine with RPMs. This is my standard charging performance for the last couple years.

I have a backup Ducati, John Deere, and now the SH, but don't want to change out the Ducati because I have a replacement on the shelf. Thanks again guys and looking forward to better flying weather coming (lots of crazy winds these days in the Denver front range).
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  #28  
Old 03-07-2017, 01:44 PM
Jolly Jolly is offline
 
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Location: San Francisco, CA
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Since I did my cooling mod on the VR that was suggested in the Rotax class my VR temps have not broken 149F. I think it's between 140-149F. I think the VR failure is now a thing in my past.
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  #29  
Old 03-07-2017, 06:44 PM
E. D. Eliot E. D. Eliot is offline
 
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Default Details please

Brad - Care to share some of the details of your successful install? Any info would help a lot of us. Thanks.
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  #30  
Old 03-11-2017, 05:04 AM
todehnal todehnal is offline
 
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Location: Kentucky Lakes area in KY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jolly View Post
Since I did my cooling mod on the VR that was suggested in the Rotax class my VR temps have not broken 149F. I think it's between 140-149F. I think the VR failure is now a thing in my past.
Hey Brad, what is the cooling mod that was suggested in your Rotax class? There have been several thoughts with a better way to keep these VRs cool, and I am curious about the one that you are using.

Thanks...............Tom
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