VansAirForceForums  
Home > VansAirForceForums

- POSTING RULES
- Donate yearly (please).
- Advertise in here!

- Today's Posts | Insert Pics

  #1  
Old 10-26-2016, 08:13 PM
1bigdog 1bigdog is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Markham, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 154
Default Winter battery

What are people using for cold weather batteries?
I'm looking for feedback from those who fly in winter from unheated hangars or tiedown, and start at -10c or lower. The engine will be an IO-320.

Even though I may be able to warm the engine sometimes I'll be at remote fields occasionally where warm up may not be an option.

I ask because I've seen all the positive feedback about the pc680 but find it difficult to believe with a CCA of only 170 it can start a cold soaked IO-320.

Thanks to all the cold weather warriors.

Michael B.
__________________
Michael B.
C-FWMB (reserved)
College Fund Contributor
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-26-2016, 08:45 PM
JimWoo50 JimWoo50 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Chicago sw suburbs
Posts: 371
Default Preheat

Helps a lot. My plane is hangared in the Chicago area. Sometimes it's pretty cold in the hangar so I use a 150watt stick on sump heater for an hour or so and the pc680 has started it easily every time. Am continually impressed by the battery; five years flying plus two years while I was building and still going strong. Sump heater is a Kat model from Amazon.
__________________
Jim Woolard C56
N9855J RV-6 Donated 2017
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-26-2016, 09:06 PM
Vlad's Avatar
Vlad Vlad is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: NJ
Posts: 7,499
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1bigdog View Post
What are people using for cold weather batteries?
I'm looking for feedback from those who fly in winter from unheated hangars or tiedown, and start at -10c or lower. The engine will be an IO-320.

Even though I may be able to warm the engine sometimes I'll be at remote fields occasionally where warm up may not be an option.

I ask because I've seen all the positive feedback about the pc680 but find it difficult to believe with a CCA of only 170 it can start a cold soaked IO-320.

Thanks to all the cold weather warriors.

Michael B.
Good question Michael. I am parked in the open and I fly all year around. Preheating the engine and the battery is the only option. If you have access to electricity it's very easy. I use a propane heater. Once I was stuck in the cold for two days not in the boonies by a civilization but without my propane preheater. Before start I put a water warmer over the battery then quickly poured two quarts of hot oil (probably was around 180F or so). Started but you don't want to hear the clacket and whine of cold engine parts. It's not only awful sound it's damaging for the motor too. Preheat good. Always.


__________________
Where is N666BK?

Не имей сто рублей, а имей сто друзей.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-26-2016, 09:11 PM
flyboy1963's Avatar
flyboy1963 flyboy1963 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Lake Country, B.C. Canada
Posts: 2,354
Default another option

much as the 680 is used by nearly everyone, I wanted a new battery, and more crank than the Concorde RG-25.
the PC925 drops right in, with room to spare, mounted on it's side.
about twice the crank of the smaller one, and same weight as the concorde, so no need to redo your w&B..... like all those other 680 guys! ;-)

....mine cranks pretty well down to freezing, don't fly when colder.
__________________
Perry Y.
RV-9a - SOLD!....
kinda missing it!
Lake Country, BC

....paid up til Nov. 2018
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-27-2016, 06:24 AM
Finger Lakes RVer's Avatar
Finger Lakes RVer Finger Lakes RVer is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Seneca Falls, NY
Posts: 37
Default

Battery Tender Jr. works for me. If you have power.
__________________
John Balbierer
1998 RV-6, N30JB
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-27-2016, 09:47 AM
Rupester Rupester is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Mahomet, Illinois
Posts: 2,195
Default

I use a Reiff preheat system with a PC680 in an unheated hangar. Yes, it gets COLD here in the dead of winter. Starting has never been a problem .... not once.
__________________
Terry Ruprecht
RV-9A Tip-up; IO-320 D2A
S. James cowl/plenum
(Dues paid thru Nov '18)
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-27-2016, 10:35 AM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
Posts: 3,279
Default

I have Powersonic battery (same specs at the PC680). Last winter I was outside on the ramp and never had a problem starting (attempts were down to about 30*). I use an oil pan heater to bring up the oil and engine temps, but it often is not doing much to warm the battery.

Larry
__________________
N64LR
RV-6A / IO-320, Flying as of 8/2015
RV-10 in progress
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-27-2016, 02:05 PM
Canadian_JOY Canadian_JOY is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,777
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1bigdog View Post
What are people using for cold weather batteries?
I'm looking for feedback from those who fly in winter from unheated hangars or tiedown, and start at -10c or lower. The engine will be an IO-320.

Even though I may be able to warm the engine sometimes I'll be at remote fields occasionally where warm up may not be an option.

I ask because I've seen all the positive feedback about the pc680 but find it difficult to believe with a CCA of only 170 it can start a cold soaked IO-320.

Thanks to all the cold weather warriors.

Michael B.
Michael - much of what has been said above is very good advice. Probably the very best of it is the admonishment against starting a cold-soaked engine. There is absolutely no excuse that justifies starting a cold-soaked engine, other than maybe that you had to start the airplane to move it to avoid an impending cataclysmic natural disaster.

There are MANY different kinds of pre-heaters available, ranging from the cadillac of them all, the all-electric Reiff sump and cylinder band heaters, to the very most basic "put a fire under the engine" techniques. If you're thinking you're going to operate away from electrical power, that's still no excuse not to pre-heat the engine. We live in the age of very power-dense battery packs. It doesn't take much forethought to come up with a means of producing heat, and a means of circulating that heat into the engine bay. For instance, a hangar neighbor uses a pair of the piezo-electric ignition propane torches blowing into a galvanized "chimney" that routes the heat into the engine bay. Beneath this is a 12VDC fan, powered by a battery pack about the size of two cigarette packs. This works a charm.

The other key item is an insulated engine cover. Talk to John at Aero Covers in Orillia - he has covers made using Thinsulate so they are not so bulky and heavy. A good engine cover will keep an engine warm for several hours, and will significantly reduce the Btu input required to get an engine up to temperature when pre-heating.

Lastly, the PC680 has proven itself to be a pretty darned good battery. Its CCA rating seems to be very conservative. Be very cautious in following any advice about battery tenders etc (and read the threads here on Odyssey battery failures). Some folks have had very poor results with battery tenders and similar always-on-chargers. The joy of the Odyssey is that it holds a charge very well. The PC680 in our "daily flyer" was installed quite some time ago (2008?) and has NEVER had an external charger connected to it. It also has never shown any hesitation to crank, even at -20C OAT's (my personal safety limit for flying). But of course, at -20C, you can bet your insulated booties that I'm preheating very thoroughly!
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-27-2016, 04:16 PM
sblack sblack is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Montreal
Posts: 1,279
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lr172 View Post
I have Powersonic battery (same specs at the PC680).

Larry
do you know the number of that battery off hand?
__________________
Scott Black
RV 4, with an engine...and other stuff
VAF dues 2016
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-29-2016, 07:35 AM
1bigdog 1bigdog is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Markham, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 154
Default thanks

ok, I've got it. Cold soak start bad. PC 680 good. I'll still look at the other options being mentioned.

Greatly appreciate all the insight. I suspect the comment about the CCA being conservative must be somewhat true because an IO-320, even with low compression, cranking at -20c is very impressive.

And thanks for the creative insights. I'll try to avoid setting a slow smouldering fire under the cowl in remote locations.

Cheers.

Michael B.
__________________
Michael B.
C-FWMB (reserved)
College Fund Contributor
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:14 AM.


The VAFForums come to you courtesy Delta Romeo, LLC. By viewing and participating in them you agree to build your plane using standardized methods and practices and to fly it safely and in accordance with the laws governing the country you are located in.