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  #21  
Old 06-26-2018, 07:51 AM
Bavafa Bavafa is online now
 
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I have practically no oil canning in this area but still have a bit of concern considering how large of an area it is without stiffener. I have spoken to VANs to get their feedback and they thought if there is no oil canning present I can leave it alone. But if I was going to deal with it, the easiest is to glue (proseal) either angle (AA3-025) or J-channel strip to in the middle and tie it to the bulkhead as others have said. No riveting to the skin will be required.

I am still contemplating adding sections of the J-channel and glue them to the skin and rivet the ends to the bulkhead.
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  #22  
Old 06-26-2018, 09:41 AM
Tom Martin Tom Martin is offline
 
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At this point folks should just contact Van's for further guidance or information. If you are building move on to the wings and leave the aft fuse alone until the fix is announced. I would not add any extra stiffeners at this time.
Things like this are the reason I like to fly a plane for a year before paint. The"fix", when announced, will be much easier do on an unpainted plane, especially if you have some cracks already.
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  #23  
Old 06-26-2018, 01:18 PM
rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Martin View Post
We have had some issues with the stiffeners in the flying RV14 that I built. Mel is correct that cracks may occur at the end of stiffeners that are not attached to the adjacent bulkhead. I first encountered this years ago when a friend installed stiffeners on the bottom of a RV6 to stop oil canning. After a short while cracks occurred on the bottom of the fuse. The same thing has happened on the RV14



This has occurred in the aft fuselage in ours, in two locations and is not the only aircraft that has experienced this. We passed this information on to Vans a few months ago and have been waiting for the engineers to come up with a fix.

This picture shows where they are on the lower aft fuselage. The cracks were stop drilled and you see safety wire sticking through just for reference as to where they are. The aircraft continues to fly, with no further cracks.

A fix will likely be some sort of bracket that will tie the stiffener to the bulkhead.


This issue is a top priority engineering dept project that will be getting attention very soon.
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  #24  
Old 06-26-2018, 05:27 PM
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czechsix czechsix is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bavafa View Post
I have spoken to VANs to get their feedback and they thought if there is no oil canning present I can leave it alone. But if I was going to deal with it, the easiest is to glue (proseal) either angle (AA3-025) or J-channel strip to in the middle and tie it to the bulkhead as others have said. No riveting to the skin will be required.
Just to be clear, are you saying Vans specifically approved of prosealing in additional sections of angle or J-channel to address the oil canning on the lower fuselage sides? It has been my impression from others who have discussed with Vans that they have discouraged doing such mods...
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  #25  
Old 06-26-2018, 08:34 PM
TASEsq TASEsq is offline
 
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Hi gents,

Other than finding out things like this on the forums, is there any other way to keep abreast of these issues?

Would this be something Van's would issue a SB for?

It would be a shame to build through something like this without realizing, only to have to go back later. Is there any sort of list of these issues one needs to keep in mind when going through the kits?
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  #26  
Old 06-26-2018, 11:29 PM
Bavafa Bavafa is online now
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by czechsix View Post
Just to be clear, are you saying Vans specifically approved of prosealing in additional sections of angle or J-channel to address the oil canning on the lower fuselage sides? It has been my impression from others who have discussed with Vans that they have discouraged doing such mods...
I am not sure if I can say "approve" if meant something in writing but certainly in my conversation and seeking advise on the issue, they express no concern in doing the method that I described which it was their recommendation. They did say that if no oil canning is present I should leave it alone but if there is oil canning, the option to fix it is to add a stiffener (AA3-025 or J-channel) that is bonded to the skin and tied to the bulkhead.
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  #27  
Old 06-26-2018, 11:45 PM
rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TASEsq View Post
Hi gents,

Other than finding out things like this on the forums, is there any other way to keep abreast of these issues?

Would this be something Van's would issue a SB for?

It would be a shame to build through something like this without realizing, only to have to go back later. Is there any sort of list of these issues one needs to keep in mind when going through the kits?
Builders should be regularly checking the support section of Van's web site related to the model they are building.
For the RV-14 it is located HERE
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  #28  
Old 07-05-2018, 10:14 PM
Steve E Steve E is offline
 
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Default Oil Canning

To the forum:
Below is the reply I received from Mitch Lock on April 28, 2018 after I had multiple communications with the engineering department at Van's starting December 17, 2017:

"Steve,

As promised I went to engineering this morning to discuss this situation. Yes, they are aware of it as both of our factory aircraft here have the same issue. Engineering’s conclusion is that it is not a safety-of-flight issue. It is an area that needs redesign to tie the stiffener into the bulkhead. They are discussing various fixes but have yet to come up with a final solution. Once completed, there will be a service bulletin issued.

Tom showed me pictures IIRC and since the cracks have been stop drilled there should be no further issue for you.

Best regards,

Mitchell Lock"
President
Van’s Aircraft, Inc.
14401 Keil Rd. NE
Aurora, OR 97002
503.678.6545
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  #29  
Old 07-06-2018, 07:21 AM
TASEsq TASEsq is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002 View Post
Builders should be regularly checking the support section of Van's web site related to the model they are building.
For the RV-14 it is located HERE
Thanks Scott
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  #30  
Old 07-06-2018, 09:32 AM
EXTAAFLY EXTAAFLY is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve E View Post
To the forum:
Below is the reply I received from Mitch Lock on April 28, 2018 after I had multiple communications with the engineering department at Van's starting December 17, 2017:

"Steve,

As promised I went to engineering this morning to discuss this situation. Yes, they are aware of it as both of our factory aircraft here have the same issue. Engineering’s conclusion is that it is not a safety-of-flight issue. It is an area that needs redesign to tie the stiffener into the bulkhead. They are discussing various fixes but have yet to come up with a final solution. Once completed, there will be a service bulletin issued.

Tom showed me pictures IIRC and since the cracks have been stop drilled there should be no further issue for you.

Best regards,

Mitchell Lock"
President
Van’s Aircraft, Inc.
14401 Keil Rd. NE
Aurora, OR 97002
503.678.6545

Am I the only one that is concerned and a bit disappointed by this revelation?

You spend upwards of nearly $50K on a kit, and it develops skin cracks in the first 100 hours. Since it's not safety of flight, they seem to be okay with the situation, but are working a fix? I'm sorry, skin cracks in the first 100 hours of a NEW airplane, from this customers stand point. . . is a problem.

The kit manufacturer has known about it as the factory demonstrators have both experienced this problem. When, and for how long? I would probably be a little more understanding if this was only happening to builder airplanes due to the ametuer nature and skill set of the home builder. The factory airplanes were built by very skillful multi time builders. The demonstrator has been in the field for nearly 5 years.

Why hasn't the fix been figured out before now? 30 some plus airplanes completed and at least one that we know of has cracks. That airplane was built by a multi time builder as well. What is there in the way of tail kits sold? Must be pushing 500 by now. We now see an email from the company president that dates back to April. . . they're on it? Like a fellow builder just said to me, "don't they have a few aeronautical engineers working around that place?"

If this has been a known problem for some time, and it has had a "high priority" to get it fixed, what is taking so long? Maybe the fix isn't as easy as they were praying it would be. . . I'm at a point where I would like to get this handled now. Not after a 100 hours and cracks in the skin that will live there forever.

Issuing a service bulletin? That would indicate to me that they will come up with a fix, you'll need to comply. . . and they will be more than happy to SELL you the parts to fix THEIR engineering problem. That doesn't even begin to take in to account the man hours. . . waiting. . .
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