What's new
Van's Air Force

Don't miss anything! Register now for full access to the definitive RV support community.

Quality of build / best practices

RV6_flyer

Well Known Member
Benefactor
One of my friends that is a serious RV Flyer that wants a new RV instead of upgrading his RV sent me this photo of an RV he was looking at purchasing.



Click on Thumbnail to enlarge.

This one simple photo brings up lots of questions about the build quality of this aircraft.

Yes this one photo makes me question what will be found when looking at everything on this airplane especially stuff that I cannot see.

Had less than $1 USD been spent of three (3) additional parts used in assembly of this aircraft build, I would feel a lot better about what is going to be found looking over the rest of the aircraft. I would not expect to find something like this on an RV that is trying to be sold at very high price.

Seeing this one photo, I told the prospective buyer to run don't walk away from the airplane at the price the seller was asking.
 
Locknuts on pushrod and washer under cotter pin are missing.
Stewart Willoughby, 6 panel.
 
Okay, i'll admit ignorance... I don't see an issue here... What am I missing?

Yeah, I'm missing something here too. Perhaps an extra set of screws/nutplates on the trim actuator cover? Maybe? But not having the plans on-hand or knowing what model I'm looking at, perhaps this is per print?

On second glance, perhaps jam nuts on the thread rod, and a washer on the clevis pin?

Edit, got beat...
 
The shaft on the trim motor/tab is missing the stop nuts.

lol I got beat too.
 
- Not build according Vans plan.
- Ricet spacing and how the rivet are set on the tab attachmet.
- Missing washer by the cotter pin.
- Paint on plastic parts ... solvent may be affect the strengh of it (just dont paint it)
- Looks not used at all ... rod will scuff on skin (bad design by Vans).
- Two holes in the rudder skin!?
 
Last edited:
Locknuts on pushrod and washer under cotter pin are missing.
Stewart Willoughby, 6 panel.

Interestingly the plans do not show a locknut on the pushrod end.

The aft two screws are too far aft. Perhaps one of the platenut rivet holes was used as the screw hole?

The location of the removable panel is a little inboard of standard and the trim tab horn is different, showing that this probably was a later modification to an early kit adding the trim removable panel.

Is it an early -6 model?

Added - Vans plans drawings are not really complete in this area. Does a normal kit buyer get these instructions from Ray Allen for the servo installation?

http://www.rayallencompany.com/RACmedia/instructionsT2andT3.pdf

Yes, two washers and a lock nut are needed at the clevis end, however if the builder simply looked at Vans drawing 5PP I can see how those parts would get overlooked.

Yes the painter got carried away, but I saw a RV-10 done by a good shop that painted the baffle material attached to the lower cowl inlet. Painters like to paint everything. :)
 
Last edited:
The odd spaced rivets on the pivot attached to the trim tab, and the pivot is not tight to the trim tab. The last, lower on the picture, screw is miss aligned to the dimple in the trim servo cover.

The rivet thing would be the one that turned me off, but the combination says to look closer at other areas.

edit-this trim servo is located farther inboard than my 7. I has a foot on both sides of the pivot lever riveted to the trim tab. Is this all wrong or is it a different design on other RV models?
 
Last edited:
...

edit-this trim servo is located farther inboard than my 7. I has a foot on both sides of the pivot lever riveted to the trim tab. Is this all wrong or is it a different design on other RV models?

That probably started with the Pre-Punched versions of the tail kits.

I still think this is a -6 that was built before the pre-punched (PP) stuff came out.

The original trim tab horn was completely different. Stolen pic of a early RV-6 after a minor repair -

P5161459.jpg


You will notice this horn location puts the control rod/cable further inboard than the current designs.


I also think instant rejection is a bit harsh, but a full detailed inspection of the rest of the aircraft would be warranted.
 
Last edited:
This seems like the place to post my question. I am not a builder but am looking to purchase a 7A or 6A. I have thousands of hours in certified airplanes but am new to Experimentals. How does one identify a quality build? When I find the airplane I think I want I will definitely have a pre buy by a multiple RV builder but I would like some advice on what I should be looking at before I make an offer contingent upon a successful pre buy inspection.
Thank you for any advice you can offer to this RV soon to be owner.
 
This seems like the place to post my question. I am not a builder but am looking to purchase a 7A or 6A. I have thousands of hours in certified airplanes but am new to Experimentals. How does one identify a quality build? When I find the airplane I think I want I will definitely have a pre buy by a multiple RV builder but I would like some advice on what I should be looking at before I make an offer contingent upon a successful pre buy inspection.
Thank you for any advice you can offer to this RV soon to be owner.

An EXPERIMENTAL does not need to meet the build standards or techniques that are used on Certificated airplanes.

A good EXPERIMENTAL build will meet the build standards and techniques used on a Certificated airplane.

Attention to details is important. Some builders just build without attention to detail. What is the BEST way to do something is important. IMHO, the cheapest way of doing something may be the best but sometimes it may be the worst.
 
Entire airplane is likely to need time and labor-intensive cut-and-buff if the rest of the paint surface is like what we're seeing here. Rejection warranted.



:D
 
Entire airplane is likely to need time and labor-intensive cut-and-buff if the rest of the paint surface is like what we're seeing here. Rejection warranted.

:D

Nah, poor paint is simply a cost negotiating issue, and the picture is of a lower surface. We don't know what the rest looks like.

A thick, smooth pretty paint job also has the ability to cover up a lot of sins...:)
 
Not on the plans, but in the servo manufacturer's instructions - see post #8

http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showpost.php?p=1195506&postcount=8

That's interesting Gil.

Vans drawings for the manual trim cable (which is what I have) also omit a jam nut, without any other manufacturer instructions to override vans drawings.

The drawings in the Ray Allen instructions only appear to show one jam nut (not one on both ends of the pushrod)--not sure I would be comfortable basing my installation on these instructions alone.

Finally, I'm still curious what purpose a jam nut against a nylon clevis serves. It couldn't be torqued anyway.

Might have to recheck with vans. I'm pretty sure I did during the initial build but couldn't find any documentation confirming that.
 
Last edited:
That's interesting Gil.
......

Finally, I'm still curious what purpose a jam nut against a nylon clevis serves. It couldn't be torqued anyway.

.....

Perhaps the whole nylon clevis acts like the nylon insert portion in a lock nut and is tight enough on the threads to prevent rotation?
 
If that rod is more than halfway into both clevises, the assembly can't come apart anyway without taking one end off a horn.,
 
If that rod is more than halfway into both clevises, the assembly can't come apart anyway without taking one end off a horn.,

There should be TWO jam nuts regardless of how much thread is inside. Lack of the two jam nuts shows poor workmanship build quality. This rod is just like all of the push pull tubes located inside the aircraft.
 
Trim

I just went from cable to Ray Allen trim in my RV6 and the kit came with 2 jam nuts also if rod is cut to full threads on both ends no way to come out. Ray tested ends with four turns in each clevis and it held 400lb.I would be more concerned if elevator was balanced.
Bob
 
There should be TWO jam nuts regardless of how much thread is inside. Lack of the two jam nuts shows poor workmanship build quality. This rod is just like all of the push pull tubes located inside the aircraft.

Per plans, one jam nut is used for all push pull tubes, on each end, not two. I have one jam nut preventing the clevis from rotating, which I believe is correct.

Obviously, there are other issues with this particular build, like not having any jam nut and lack of the washer to protect the clevis, among the other things.

Good post and it prompted be to check my assembly. Don't want to becoming infamous on VAF, and certainly don't want to be accused of poor workmanship and build quality! But mostly, just want to be safe.
 
Im not commenting on the other items that have been mentioned but I just re-installed my RA trim today. Looking at the plans, it only shows one jam nut on the bar. I can sure see not having that one nut on could easily cause a problem, but not sure why a second one would be necessary - especially since the plans do not show it.

http://www.rayallencompany.com/RACmedia/instructionsT2andT3.pdf
 
Last edited:
Nuts

Just so everyone knows talked to RA and they said one jam nut on each clevis is correct just installed Vans kit for RV6 in elevator from manual trim to electric servo had to add about ounce of lead shot in epoxy back to weight.The plans are showing typical end.
Bob
 
Back
Top