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  #1  
Old 09-12-2018, 12:32 PM
13brv3's Avatar
13brv3 13brv3 is offline
 
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Location: Tellico Plains, TN
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Default auto plug recommendation?- older Electroair inition noise?

Greetings,

The -3B I purchased has an older (purple) Electroair ignition, and I've been trying to eliminate some radio noise. I've been struggling with this for months now, and what I've determined is that it is RF noise that's broadcast, not wiring related. I can use a handheld radio and hear the noise, and moving the radio closer to the engine (reaching from the cockpit) makes the noise more pronounced. Turning off power to the EIS ignition 100% stops the noise.

It would appear that the high voltage ignition RF noise is not being suppresses, and that leaves the coils, wires, and plugs as obvious suspects.

The wires were the first thing replaced. The original wires were blue Taylor Spiro Pro 8mm silicone wires, with a special spring type insert for the plug end. First I cut the wires off an inch, and reterminated them, but that didn't help. Next I tried to order new wires, but bad timing (OSH) and the fact that the wires were out of stock was a problem. Eventually I ordered a universal wire set from Taylor, using the same 8mm Spiro Pro wire. Those were installed with the old plug spring fittings, but it didn't correct the noise issue.

The UREM37BY plugs had 160 hrs on them according to the logs, and looked OK, but I replaced them with new plugs gapped to .032". No change.

The plane used to have two of these EIS units, but a previous owner changed the left side back to a mag, though they left the unit bolted to the firewall. I had removed the unit, and I was able to use those coils to replace the ones on the working unit. Sadly, still no fix.

Electroair has a newer red set of wires, and a brand new adapter that converts the aircraft plug into a normal spark plug tower to eliminate the fiddly spring adapter. I'm waiting for confirmation that those are actually better suppression wires, and hoping they're in stock.

Has anyone else had this much trouble getting rid of ignition noise? I've had Lightspeed ignitions on two previous RV's, and never had any radio noise, so this is really getting frustrating.

Thanks,
Rusty (measuring RPM by the popping on the radio)
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RV-8, SN-80587, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-10751, rotary engine, built, flown, sold
RV-8, SN-82470, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-11351, purchased (yes it's cheating)
A&P - 2018 dues paid

Last edited by 13brv3 : 09-17-2018 at 03:13 PM.
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  #2  
Old 09-12-2018, 01:36 PM
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rocketbob rocketbob is offline
 
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Default

https://www.eham.net/ehamforum/smf/i...c=56385.5;wap2

Worth a try.
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Bob Japundza CFI A&PIA
N55BC RV-6 borrowed, flying
N678X F1 Rocket, under const.
N244BJ RV-6 "victim of SNF tornado" 1200+ hrs, rebuilding
N8155F C150 flying
N7925P PA-24-250 Comanche, restoring
Not a thing I own is stock.
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  #3  
Old 09-12-2018, 02:12 PM
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13brv3 13brv3 is offline
 
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Thanks, but I think I have it isolated well enough. I'm mostly curious if anyone has had to go to different wires or plugs to eliminate similar noise from their EIS. If anyone saw an improvement going from the older blue wires to the newer red wires, that would be nice to hear as well.

It seems odd that mag wires are shielded, but other spark plug wires are not. Is that to allow non-resistor plugs maybe?

Fortunately, the noise doesn't make the radio unusable, but it's an annoyance that I've put off for too long.

Cheers,
Rusty
__________________
RV-8, SN-80587, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-10751, rotary engine, built, flown, sold
RV-8, SN-82470, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-11351, purchased (yes it's cheating)
A&P - 2018 dues paid
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  #4  
Old 09-12-2018, 02:33 PM
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rocketbob rocketbob is offline
 
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I was referring to the bottom comment in the link where the guy switched to magnecor racing wires which he claims totally solved his noise problem.

Lightspeed ignitions are CDI and don't have near the voltage peaks an inductive ignition does. I was good friends with the original designer of the Lightspeed before he passed away a few years ago and discussed this at length with him.
__________________
Bob Japundza CFI A&PIA
N55BC RV-6 borrowed, flying
N678X F1 Rocket, under const.
N244BJ RV-6 "victim of SNF tornado" 1200+ hrs, rebuilding
N8155F C150 flying
N7925P PA-24-250 Comanche, restoring
Not a thing I own is stock.
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  #5  
Old 09-12-2018, 03:04 PM
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13brv3 13brv3 is offline
 
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Location: Tellico Plains, TN
Posts: 537
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocketbob View Post
I was referring to the bottom comment in the link where the guy switched to magnecor racing wires which he claims totally solved his noise problem.
My apologies. I got bogged down in all the RF sniffer talk and gave up before getting to the good part. The Magnecor CN wires do sound nice. For all I know, that might be the new red wires that Electroair offers. Still waiting to hear from them.

Thanks,
Rusty
__________________
RV-8, SN-80587, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-10751, rotary engine, built, flown, sold
RV-8, SN-82470, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-11351, purchased (yes it's cheating)
A&P - 2018 dues paid
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  #6  
Old 09-13-2018, 05:31 PM
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Bill.Peyton Bill.Peyton is offline
 
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Location: St. Louis, MO
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I had this same issue with my electro air installation. Electro air can supply you with suppression ignition wires. The same wire they use on certified installations. The new wires took care of 90 percent of my problem. These are spiral wound wires designed specifically for RV suppression. I believe they are supplied by magnecore
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  #7  
Old 09-13-2018, 05:51 PM
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13brv3 13brv3 is offline
 
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That's good to hear, because for almost $50 each , I'll have a set of 4 tomorrow. The price seems to have nearly doubled either because they are PMAed wires, or because they now come with an adapter that screws onto the aircraft plug to give it a normal spark plug contact. Having recently stuck that spring thing into wires a number of times, that will be a welcome change. I guess you still have to make up one end, but it's with a normal spark plug boot and connection which is supposed to be easier.

They said they started using the red (new) wires for all the certified installations, and at some point the experimental kits will get them too.

In the interesting theory dept, an RF genius friend of mine suggested that you want to make sure and not make the wires 1/4 wavelength, since that will make them a better antenna. For the 125 MHz range I've been using for testing, that would be about 23.5". I'd bet I have cables close to that, and I'll make sure and avoid it when I make the new ones, just in case.

Cheers,
Rusty
__________________
RV-8, SN-80587, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-10751, rotary engine, built, flown, sold
RV-8, SN-82470, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-11351, purchased (yes it's cheating)
A&P - 2018 dues paid
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  #8  
Old 09-13-2018, 06:00 PM
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Bill.Peyton Bill.Peyton is offline
 
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Location: St. Louis, MO
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My kit came with the blue solid core wires which we’re extremely noisy in the 10. Only the radio connected to the upper antenna had the issue. The cabin in the 10 is composite and did not block the upper antenna as well as the fuselage did for the lower antenna. I used a spectrum analyzer to troubleshoot the issue. Electroair replaced the wires for free.
I would not sweat the quarter wavelength issue with the spiral core wires, totally different situation than solid core wires
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RV-10 - 875 Hrs
First Flight Oct 2012
WA0SYV
Aviation Partners, LLC
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  #9  
Old 09-17-2018, 03:33 PM
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13brv3 13brv3 is offline
 
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I got the new wire kits, but they needed to send some connectors separately. When I got those today, I headed to the airport to install them. Just as I got to the airport, I got an email saying NOT to install them. Sounds like they're having some teething pains with the new spark plug tower adapters. I'm sending their wires and adapters back, and will try autoplugs and maybe magnacor wires.

Speaking of auto plugs. Any known good suggestions for use with an IO-320 160HP?

Thanks,
Rusty
__________________
RV-8, SN-80587, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-10751, rotary engine, built, flown, sold
RV-8, SN-82470, built, flown, sold.
RV-3B, SN-11351, purchased (yes it's cheating)
A&P - 2018 dues paid
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  #10  
Old 09-17-2018, 05:08 PM
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rocketbob rocketbob is offline
 
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Location: 8I3
Posts: 3,016
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NGK BR9ES and adapters.
__________________
Bob Japundza CFI A&PIA
N55BC RV-6 borrowed, flying
N678X F1 Rocket, under const.
N244BJ RV-6 "victim of SNF tornado" 1200+ hrs, rebuilding
N8155F C150 flying
N7925P PA-24-250 Comanche, restoring
Not a thing I own is stock.
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