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Fltplan Go, free with Canadian Charts and CFS

vlittle

vlittle

Well Known Member
This is a first look review of the Fltpan Go app for the iPad.
Hardware: iPad Mini, iOS 7.1.1, cellular, 32G
App: Fltplan Go version 2.5.4, May 8, 2014

Preamble: Canada has been terribly underserved by the lack of availability of digital charts and publications due to the inaction of Nav Canada. Recently, Foreflight brought complete mapping/publication data to their slick 'gold standard' App.

Unfortunately, a $175 per year subscription for Foreflight, plus a similar fee for Pocket FMS on my SkyView plus a Jeppesen update fee for my Aera puts my total annual cost north of $400 for databases. For one of my VFR aircraft, this is about $10 per operating hour. Put another way, this is more than the engine depreciation cost! Something is fundamentally wrong.

IFR pilots face much more onerous costs, to be sure, but that's another topic.

So when Fltplan.com announced their Go app with FREE Canadian charts and publications, I was cautiously optimistic. I downloaded the Fltplan Go app from the Apple store and spent a day getting familiar with the basic operation, including a cross-country flight.

....more....
 
...continued...

The executive summary of my short evaluation: Fltplan Go is not ready for prime time.

I found five bugs very quickly, one of which is fatal. Here is my description and Fltplan's official response:

-missing VFR procedures from the CFS. They are available for download into a separate 'binder' section, but they are not searchable. For example, BC has 49 pages of approaches that you have to scroll through one by one to find a particular airport.

RESPONSE: 'In the future we hope to have additional means in accessing this information.'

-on app startup, the map layer selections are forgotten and must be reconfigured. This means that I get a blank map page because the default is the USA.

RESPONSE: 'Thanks for your comments'

-On a fresh startup of the app, none of the Airport Diagrams or A/FD links work properly. Touching the Downloads tab, then immediately back to Airports tab, then everything works fine. (Note, this is not the same as refreshing downloads)

RESPONSE: 'Thanks for your comments'

-When using the graphical flight plan editing, when I attempt to insert waypoints by rubber banding and selecting lat/lon, the app tends to insert the new waypoint after the next sequential waypoint than before it. This requires manual editing to fix.

RESPONSE: 'This is a known bug and will be fixed in a future update.'

-the app becomes slower and slower in response to selections and gestures until it eventually locks up. This happens on the ground and in flight. A cold start of the app fixes the problem for a while, but is not practical in flight because it loses the map settings as reported earlier.

RESPONSE: This sounds like you iPad's memory is 'maxed' out.
Please close out all the other apps you might have open on your iPad (whether you are using them or not), and just run the FltPlan Go app
We have no known problems for this, and no other similar complaints.
As a matter of fact, we have pilots using the app for over 5 hours straight in flight with no lockup or sluggishness.

UPDATE: even with all other apps closed down, this continues to be a problem. A simple test with the app open is to alternately press the Maps button and the Airports button. After about 10 sequences the application slows down and then about 15 sequences it locks up entirely. I can reproduce this at will.

RESPONSE: none

...more...
 
...continued...

At this point I stopped looking for bugs. There are many other features in the application that I did not check, however, I wanted to get the basic operation operating smoothly before diving in too deep.

I also noticed that the maps do not support VTAs yet. These are similar to the US TAC charts. To be fair, Pocket FMS did not support VTA data either until I worked with them to get it included in their databases. Jeppesen does not support VTA data. Only Foreflight currently supports accurate VTA information in raster form.

I am a huge fan of the promise of Fltplan Go and that's why I provided the bug reports directly to them and worked with them to improve their product. Unfortunately because of the fatal in-flight lock up, I can't recommend this product for prime time.

I am very experienced with product development, including the new mantra of 'do it, try it, fix it' that business schools are promoting. I don't think that this model should apply to aviation. In any case, when serious bugs are reported, denial or silence is NOT the appropriate response.

I've had the experience of reporting bugs to Dynon and Pocket FMS recently. Despite my grumblings about the bugs both companies took me seriously and addressed the issues.

I hope that Fltplan can step it up.
 
I agree with Vern..

I have FltPln GO on my Nexus 7 tablet and their newest GO software is really NOT user friendly. I used their previous software and really liked it. Faster downloads, easier access to the info I was looking for. New version, if I pinch (zoom in ) too far the map disappears. And yes I have tried the zoom lock On and Off. Anyway, thought it was just me being computer dumb, Happy to see it isn't that.rolleyes: Other issues too. Guess I'll have to pony up for a pay per view map program.
 
JimS said:
I have FltPln GO on my Nexus 7 tablet and their newest GO software is really NOT user friendly. I used their previous software and really liked it. Faster downloads, easier access to the info I was looking for. New version, if I pinch (zoom in ) too far the map disappears. And yes I have tried the zoom lock On and Off. Anyway, thought it was just me being computer dumb, Happy to see it isn't that.rolleyes: Other issues too. Guess I'll have to pony up for a pay per view map program.
Click to expand...

I too have the zoom in problem. Didn't report it as a bug, though. I also found the app is not very user friendly. For example, if you forget to load the airports database, it just does nothing rather than notify you.

I really want these folks to be successful, but they have to be more responsive.
 
Interesting report on functionality on the iPad Mini. I installed FltPLan Go on my Android phone (Nexus 5) and did a bunch of testing as well. I haven't flown with it yet, so my usage maxed out at about 30 minutes when I was putting it through its paces at home. I later installed it on my wife's Nexus 7 tablet and tried it there as well. Apart from being a little slower on the Nexus 7, the functionality was the same (but the larger screen was nice).

I didn't have any issues with maps not defaulting properly, or AFD pages not coming up.

The CFS pages, apart from not having procedures as you mention (CYYJ was the first airport I looked up...), also don't have small grass strips (try finding CAK3, for example). Not a problem for most commercial pilots, who I think the app is targeted towards. But for recreational pilots of light singles, it might be an issue.

No VTA makes it less useful as well. Here around Vancouver, a lot of us never leave the VTA... But I suspect this is something that will change over time. Looking at how they've handled the Seattle VNC to Seattle TAC chart transition gives me hope that the Canadian map will be just as nice soon.

The thing that kept running through my mind is "how are they able to do this for free?"
 
Snowflake said:
The thing that kept running through my mind is "how are they able to do this for free?"
Click to expand...

There are embedded ads.

Anyway, I keep finding bugs (e.g. heading -7 degrees??). Lots of features, few of them work.

Good, fast, cheap, pick two.

I finally bailed and purchased PocketFMS. They have all of the VTA frequency data embedded which is a big help. I worked with them on this and they were very responsive to suggestions.
 
I've been using Avare on my Nexus 7. It's free and works very well. You can download the App from the Play Store.
 
FasGlas said:
I've been using Avare on my Nexus 7. It's free and works very well. You can download the App from the Play Store.
Click to expand...

Avare works well, needs just a small bit more polish. Since the code is open source I downloaded the code and got it to compile in Android Studio. I can change things around as I please :)

The code is well structured and I recognize a few RV guys working on the project.
 
I have Avare running on my Nexus 7, as well as Avilution - I like them both. The only problem is the lack of Canadian charts. Have looked at PocketFMS but for the $$ it's hard to beat the slick operation of the iPad with Foreflight and Canadian charts.
 
with Canadian charts????

FasGlas said:
I've been using Avare on my Nexus 7. It's free and works very well. You can download the App from the Play Store.
Click to expand...

sorry, but I'm following this discussion due to Vern's OP about 'Canadian flight planning options.'

can you pirep Avare if applicable.....please?
 
Perry, Avare doesn't have Canadian charts.

I still think the best bang-for-the-buck for Canadians is Air Navigation Pro. One time purchase (no annual fee). Free basemap and terrain data, free airspace overlays. It's not the official chart, but it's enough for a VFR pilot.

FltPlan Go is a close second, the official charts are nice but the lack of terminal charts (VTA's) makes it a non-starter in my area. There's too much going on, and the sectional (VNC) leaves off a lot of the data because you should really be looking at the VTA anyway.
 
MOA Info

I'am loving the new digital charts as I just entered the IPAd age and have fltplan go. Is there a place to check MOA info such as altitudes restrictions on this app? ***Figured it out to turn on SUA's- really liking this app so far. Be great to take it up in the plane and try it out!
 
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Lock up problem seems fixed. Flight plan rubber banding still faulty. I haven't checked the other bugs yet.
 
"Binders" are now working on the Android version. You can save favorite airports, approach plates, etc. to a binder for quicker reference.

"Checklists" now works on Android as well. Looks like you have to make them on the FltPLan.com website, then they get downloaded to the app. Has anyone made one for an RV yet? The process is rather cumbersome so i'm not going to do it unless I can modify something existing...
 
Snowflake said:
"Binders" are now working on the Android version. You can save favorite airports, approach plates, etc. to a binder for quicker reference.

"Checklists" now works on Android as well. Looks like you have to make them on the FltPLan.com website, then they get downloaded to the app. Has anyone made one for an RV yet? The process is rather cumbersome so i'm not going to do it unless I can modify something existing...
Click to expand...

Check PM <.....>
 
vlittle said:
Lock up problem seems fixed. Flight plan rubber banding still faulty. I haven't checked the other bugs yet.
Click to expand...

Spoke too soon. Lock up fixed, but maps will not work at all after a cold start without an internet connection.

Update**** It turns out that after an upgrade, one must reload the charts and databases, even though the app says they are up to date. Go figure, but this seems to work.
 
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vlittle said:
...continued...

At this point I stopped looking for bugs. There are many other features in the application that I did not check, however, I wanted to get the basic operation operating smoothly before diving in too deep.

I also noticed that the maps do not support VTAs yet. These are similar to the US TAC charts. To be fair, Pocket FMS did not support VTA data either until I worked with them to get it included in their databases. Jeppesen does not support VTA data. Only Foreflight currently supports accurate VTA information in raster form.

I am a huge fan of the promise of Fltplan Go and that's why I provided the bug reports directly to them and worked with them to improve their product. Unfortunately because of the fatal in-flight lock up, I can't recommend this product for prime time.

I am very experienced with product development, including the new mantra of 'do it, try it, fix it' that business schools are promoting. I don't think that this model should apply to aviation. In any case, when serious bugs are reported, denial or silence is NOT the appropriate response.

I've had the experience of reporting bugs to Dynon and Pocket FMS recently. Despite my grumblings about the bugs both companies took me seriously and addressed the issues.

I hope that Fltplan can step it up.
Click to expand...

Update: looks like the map default bug and in flight lock-up bugs are resolved. Starting to become a more stable, useful app. The lack of Canadian VTA data makes it inadequate for where I fly, however.

I spent a lot time working with Pocket FMS to get VTA info and correct airfield frequency displays working on their App, which is now working well. PFMS, however, does not have CFS data. Instead they use their own airfield info pages.

So right now, FLTPlan Go is better on the ground, PFMS (easyVFR) is better in flight. If PFMS supported Canadian CFS and airport diagrams and plate display, it would be killer. If FLTPlan Go supported VTA, fixed the flightplan rubber banding bug and properly displayed VFR departure and arrival procedures from the CFS, It would be close to ForeFlight in its capability for Canada.

Since FLTPlan Go is 'free', I am hoping for the best.
 
vlittle said:
Update: looks like the map default bug and in flight lock-up bugs are resolved. Starting to become a more stable, useful app. The lack of Canadian VTA data makes it inadequate for where I fly, however.
Click to expand...
Canadian VTA's have been in the app for a few weeks. They're in the downloads section. The only downside is that they are an "overlay" that has to be turned on each time you start the app. The VNC's load by default, the overlay selection isn't remembered between uses.

If FLTPlan Go supported VTA, fixed the flightplan rubber banding bug and properly displayed VFR departure and arrival procedures from the CFS, It would be close to ForeFlight in its capability for Canada.
Click to expand...
One down, two to go. :)
 
Snowflake said:
Canadian VTA's have been in the app for a few weeks. They're in the downloads section. The only downside is that they are an "overlay" that has to be turned on each time you start the app. The VNC's load by default, the overlay selection isn't remembered between uses.


One down, two to go. :)
Click to expand...

Well, so it does. You can also zoom in very close now.
 
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And, as of this afternoon, flight plan rubber banding is working.... Fltplan Go is rounding into shape.
 
Unfortunately, many or all small airports are missing from the database. They are in the paper copy of the CFS but not in FLTPlan Go's version.

Example Duncan BC or Delta Airpark BC. GRRRRRRR.

What's the point if you still have to carry the CFS? These guys are annoying. Yes, I updated the database and I am displaying all runway lengths.
 
It seems that they are taking the airport location info from some database that only includes airports with runways a certain length or longer (or maybe it's paved only). The old US DAFIF database was like that, because it was military-oriented and only had airports in it that their aircraft could land on. Delta didn't qualify, and despite Duncan's resemblance to an aircraft carrier I guess it didn't either. :)

The thing that gets me is that they clearly have access now to the CFS and the Charts, through some official NavCanada channel. But they can't figure out how to get the procedures pages for the airports included with each airport's CFS page. It's all right there. They probably have to extract the page sets manually, NavCanada probably just gave them a single PDF for the CFS.
 
They seem to be using the same data base that GRT has on their system, small Canadian airports are missing. Went to Alert Bay today and it was missing on GRT but was in the goflplan.
 
Not bad for free

I loaded it on an older Nexus 7. It looks pretty good for a free program. Still missing smaller airports... Seems reasonably snappy on older hardware. Gotta go flying!
 
It has improved since my first review, but the lack of airports is a problem, the difficulty in getting the VFR Procedures info and the lack of a time stamp on the map weather overlay are problems. Editing a flight plan is still buggy.

Still cheering them on, but still not over the goal line.
 
I still haven't figured out how to do flight planning with this tool. To say it is non-intuitive would be accurate. It has worked well here using AIR5000 VNC chart and the Ottawa VTA as an overlay.

I'm not sure why but a couple of weeks ago the VNC just disappeared and I had to reload it. I've also loaded IFR approach plates. Compared to Foreflight with its nice blinking blue geo-referenced airplane symbol on the approach plate, FltplanGo still has a ways to go.

All that having been said, having a FREE program with Canadian charts is a huge bonus. Now if only some of us can figure out how to use it for flightplanning on the go... I still can't figure out even the simplest of things like a "direct to" function.

Also, on smaller screens like my Nexus7 it would be a huge improvement to have the side menu bar disappear after a fixed time in order to display more map. That menu bar takes up a large percentage of the available display space and could easily be replaced by a tap zone to pull up the menu or even a small, dedicated menu button.
 
Just did a quick check on a nearby airport, CYPQ. Last year it officially added runway length to go from 5000' to 7000'. In FltPlanGo the airport is listed as having the longest runway length of 7000', yet when you hit the "runways" tab it still shows 09/27 as being 5000x100', and unlit. Both of these pieces of info are patently WRONG. When clicking the "Open CFS" button it shows there is no CFS entry for this airport.

I don't know about you, but 7000 feet of pavement is a pretty major airport. I don't know what source of data FltPlanGo is using but either that source is very much out to lunch or the algorithm controlling which airport data to import from the CFS needs more than just a minor tweak. At this point I'm afraid I'll have no choice but to continue carrying that big ole' brick of a CFS!
 
Also, on smaller screens like my Nexus7 it would be a huge improvement to have the side menu bar disappear after a fixed time in order to display more map. That menu bar takes up a large percentage of the available display space and could easily be replaced by a tap zone to pull up the menu or even a small, dedicated menu button.[/QUOTE]

On my Nexus 7 there IS a button for hiding the side menu.
I would like to see a ETE to your destination displayed along the bottom of the display ( where the groundspeed is)

Program is getting better. One thing I discovered today is when you need to update maps/charts/etc. select downloaded files and all the items you have downloaded will show and you can update them all with a single tap instead of selecting each sectional,AFD/State approuch plates etc.
 
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Went flying

Went flying from home base to Meaford and back so in a good mood and finding it hard to complain 😀. I'm cheap and old enough to be really good with paper charts. But this was pretty impressive for free software and 100 bucks of hardware. I wouldn't depend on it or use it for planning but really a good bump for situational awareness just using the moving map. If they could get all the airports in the database and the CFS, it would be a huge improvement but not complaining today...
 
Canadian_JOY said:
Just did a quick check on a nearby airport, CYPQ. Last year it officially added runway length to go from 5000' to 7000'. In FltPlanGo the airport is listed as having the longest runway length of 7000', yet when you hit the "runways" tab it still shows 09/27 as being 5000x100', and unlit. Both of these pieces of info are patently WRONG. When clicking the "Open CFS" button it shows there is no CFS entry for this airport.
Click to expand...
We're clearly in a transition period, for NavCanada and for apps in general. Traditional legacy software databases were based off of the US DAFIF database, which only held airports that were paved and greater than a certain length... It was intended for military use, so a short, private, grass strip wasn't something they'd care about. The DAFIF database stopped being made available a few years ago, and other sources have cropped up, although how complete/accurate they are is always left to the user to verify.

Still, it's a little odd that FltPlan Go, who clearly have access to NavCanada's map data, either aren't getting access or aren't making use of the access to the airport data at the same time.

I didn't go back and check when my data source was updated, but I do show Peterborough as having 7000x100 and lighted: http://www.100ll.ca/info.php?home=CYPQ
 
CLA4 now available

Just checked the latest update and my home airport is now in the database though still does not have a CFS entry. Small step in the right direction...:)
 
It seems to use multiple databases... I can enter some of the smaller airports now and find them in the "airports" section, but if I enter them as part of a route it won't find them. Some have CFS pages. So it continues to improve, and I expect it'll get there eventually.

More of an issue for me right now is that some of the airports have procedure pages in the CFS. You can get the airport pages, but the procedures aren't included, they're usually on the pages preceeding the airport entry.
 
Snowflake said:
It seems to use multiple databases... I can enter some of the smaller airports now and find them in the "airports" section, but if I enter them as part of a route it won't find them. Some have CFS pages. So it continues to improve, and I expect it'll get there eventually.

More of an issue for me right now is that some of the airports have procedure pages in the CFS. You can get the airport pages, but the procedures aren't included, they're usually on the pages preceeding the airport entry.
Click to expand...

The procedures are downloaded in a separate document, by province. It's not searchable so you have to scroll through to find the airport.

Not a good user interface, but things are gradually improving.
 
I think I must either be incredibly stupid (highly likely) or this software is incredibly flaky. While I sit here at home with wifi access I download the charts I want (Canada Southeast and Canada Northeast, Montreal, Toronto & Ottawa VTA's). Great, all downloads complete, everything is happy.

Then I go to the airport, turn on my Nexus 7, boot up FltplanGo and it can't seem to find any charts. I switch over to Avilution and it has the US chart which I haven't updated in ages, but it's there.

What in tarnation am I doing wrong?
 
So Fltplan Go no longer works at all on my iPad. I see they issued a new release today. I tried removing and reinstalling, but no joy. Application won't even start.

It's one thing after the other. Now I've permanently removed it.
 
Last night I downloaded (not intentionally - it was an automatic update) a new version of FltplanGo and then re-downloaded the Canadian charts I needed. Since downloading the charts I've left the Nexus7 running and it hasn't hung up or otherwise crashed.

I still don't get how to do actual flight planning with this app. Whenever I try to do the most simple function, "from present position direct to an airport", it wants to go out to the FltplanGo.com website. That ain't ever going to happen when I'm flying, so in essence FltplanGo is a moving map, and sure as heck not a flight planning tool for use in the cockpit. Or so it seems to me.... Please correct my perception if it is wrong.
 
Canadian_Joy said:
Then I go to the airport, turn on my Nexus 7, boot up FltplanGo and it can't seem to find any charts. I switch over to Avilution and it has the US chart which I haven't updated in ages, but it's there. What in tarnation am I doing wrong?
Click to expand...

I do the same thing about every second time I update maps. When you're on the "Maps" screen, hit the "Basemaps" button on in the top left corner, and turn on "Sectionals (Canada)". Optionally, once you've done that, hit the "Overlays" button on the map screen, and turn on "Terminal Area Charts" to get you VTA's overlaid.

Voltar said:
It's one thing after the other. Now I've permanently removed it.
Click to expand...
Odd that it's gone so far sideways on iPad. On Android, it's constantly improving...
 
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Norman CYYJ said:
I have downloaded the new version Vern and it works okay on my ipad2.
Click to expand...

iPad Mini Retina, IOS8.02

No longer functions. Flashes the welcome screen, then crashes. Double clicking shows the app, but selecting causes the crash again.
 
There's another thread here where someone reported that the recent (day or two) ago update on FltPlanGo fails miserably on iOS due to a compiling problem at Apple. Apple is aware of the problem and "will fix it in a few days".

I'm so glad I could get away from that walled garden by moving to Android.
 
Snowflake said:
I do the same thing about every second time I update maps. When you're on the "Maps" screen, hit the "Basemaps" button on in the top left corner, and turn on "Sectionals (Canada)". Optionally, once you've done that, hit the "Overlays" button on the map screen, and turn on "Terminal Area Charts" to get you VTA's overlaid.


Odd that it's gone so far sideways on iPad. On Android, it's constantly improving...
Click to expand...

Rob - in my case when I try to select "Sectionals (Canada)" I get an error message indicating the map needs to be downloaded, even though I may have downloaded it not more than 48 hours prior. The map data just seems to vanish. Just checked again now, some 36 hours after downloading current charts and they seem to be available in the machine. Keeping fingers crossed!
 
Snowflake said:
There's another thread here where someone reported that the recent (day or two) ago update on FltPlanGo fails miserably on iOS due to a compiling problem at Apple. Apple is aware of the problem and "will fix it in a few days".

I'm so glad I could get away from that walled garden by moving to Android.
Click to expand...

Fltplan Go has now been removed from the APP store.
 
This is an app that has been plagued by ineptitude. Every so often I check it out to see if they are making any progress, and on the latest go around, I had the same result - with the updated OS and their "fix" the program won't even start.

Lots of potential, but a miserable failure in execution.

Dan
 
@Dan, I bet if you email them, they'll send you a full refund of your purchase price. :)

Personally, i'm happy being a beta tester at the current price (Free). Note that the problem wasn't FltPlanGo's fix. It was Apple's upgrade that broke working software.
 
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