Clamp? Ouch
J5Cub said:
This is one of the older props that has the clamp AD........I thought I read someplace that Experimentals had to comply with ADs also.
Thanks again, Greg
CLAMP!!!!!!!! OUCH! Yea if you have a clamp you have an old prop (very old HC-82XG-2) and it is not any of the ones I mentioned above. The above props do not have clamps.
My old Piper Apache (PA-23-160) had clamps and know all about the clamp issues and steel hub. It is likely this is the same prop you're talking about. I doubt it's off a twin Comanche (PA-30). Twin Comanche props are the the HC-E2YL. It could be a single engine Comanche (PA-24), which used the same prop as the Apache, with the steel clamps and the short 250hr/60month recurring inspections AD.
As far as experimental and AD compliance you read it above, I wrote it. You do not need AD compliance. However there is some issue that people in the know have brought up, if you are not the builder of the plane regarding AD's.
If you build the plane you can sign off the condition inspection every year. If you did not build the plane you need an annual condition inspection from an A&P, right. The A&P may NOT want to sign it off if there are any AD's on prop, engine or accessory, but the FAA regs do not say you must comply. However you can understand an A&P may want to CYA and his.
An experimental can have an experimental prop and engine off a lawnmower, so no you don't need to comply with AD's............... However wisdom and common sense says may be you should comply with SB's and AD's or at least not ignore them completely. I'd not ignore a clamp prop, they are real old. Also they are real heavy, not a good thing.
If you really have a steel hub prop with clamps........throw it away, it is trash or a wall trophy. Go out and buy a new Hartzell from Vans or Glasair for $5500 (or what ever) with out any AD's. You might find used later model Hartzells as mentioned for $2,500-$4,000. Overall its a bad idea, even if its free. If money and budget are the concern, he would even be better served a million times over with a Fixed Sensenich. Check their web site out. The Sensenich on the RV's have been nothing less than a super value and great performer (about $2,000). Plus you save another $1,200 on the governor and less weight. Constant speed is cool but not a old crusty one.
To answer your question:
Can your friend use it? First, if its a Twin Comanche prop (which I doubt) it's a
feathering prop (what are you going to do about that?). You will need to jury rig something (red flag alert) or get a feathering governor. Feathering prop on a single? "Danger, Will Robinson!"
Second, it's going to
weighs a ton with those big counter weights, it's an anchor. Third,
Safety, he will have a prop with a boat load of AD's on it, very restrictive AD's. If you call Hartzell and ask them, they will tell you (BEG YOU, CAUTION, THREATEN and SCARE YOU) not to use it. It was a GREAT prop in 1958, but Grandpa needs to retire. Does your friend come up with a lot of strange ideas and is real cheap?
IF HE MUST, I'm not going to tell you what to do, that is your decision. At least MAKE sure you have the latest and best clamps. If it was overhauled with 69 hours in the last year or so, than its basically airworthy. The next inspection is 250 hours / 60 months (which he can ignore if he has a death wish
). What does it cost to inspect it? Needs to taken off, torn apart, inspected and reassembled. 10-15 years ago it was $1,000, figure $1,500 each time.
When you say 69 hours that is great, but if it was 5 or 15 years ago than forget it, its scrap metal. If it has prohibited clamps its trash and not airworthy, but those bad clamps should be out of circulation by now (but who knows what you have with out serial numbers, which are on the clamp).
This prop is from the late 1950's. Also this is going on a SPORT plane and you are likely to put more force on it flying around. Aerobatics? Forget it.
I would run, not walk, from a steel clamp prop personally on a new homebuilt. They are out there still today flying, but the 250 hr AD for very short tear down inspection will cost more than buying a new prop in short order.
Throwing a blade could ruin you whole day.
If you can get it FREE, for example it comes with an engine you are buying, take it. You can part it out and sell it to a prop shop or Piper Apache/Comanche (single) guy trying to milk his existing old props for a little longer.
I would not pay anything for an old prop. Now that I think of it, I bought an engine off an Apache Geronimo (O360A1A-180HP) for my RV; the engine came with the damaged prop for free, same Apache/Comanche prop we're talking about; I ended up selling it for parts. It worked out well, got about $250 for it I recall, but that was a long time ago. Not sure what the prop is really worth today. If its FREE, take it and part it out or trade it. Usually the blades are worth a few hundred bucks if there is no corrosion and they have meat (material) on them. These parts are old and not made any more. Someone is milking these old props and needs the parts. When Hartzell did the prop trade in exchange deal, they chop the old props up.
I was an Apache owner and sold the plane a few years before the 250hr AD came out. New modern replacement props for the Apache where about $16,000. The Hartzell replacement program is long over; they probably cost closer to $20,000 (pair) now. You can buy a whole Apache with old props for $20-$30,000; the prop replacement is a big nugget. Some guys (I know one) shell out the inspection each time. As much as he flys he hits the 60 month limit and its cheaper for him than buying new props.
In the big scheme of things, the Apache's are a great plane. For less than the cost of a cheap RV you can have a twin with new props. I hate to see them go. Ugly may be, but sweet flying; and they actually have the same wing as the RV's. You can carry 108 gal of gas, so with the O320's leaned to 7.5 gal/hr, do the math, almost 7 hours @ 160 mph TAS, not to bad. The cockpit is huge. You can walk to the back, hunched over of course. It's a big plane and could fly 4 big adults and bags. Has a fifth seat in the large baggage area.
If you have model number that would help. Really can't guess any more. Good luck, Happy Easter You All