VansAirForceForums  
Home > VansAirForceForums

- POSTING RULES
- Donate yearly (please).
- Advertise in here!

- Today's Posts | Insert Pics


Go Back   VAF Forums > Model Specific > RV-9/9A
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #31  
Old 10-16-2019, 11:35 AM
Sam Buchanan's Avatar
Sam Buchanan Sam Buchanan is offline
been here awhile
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: North Alabama
Posts: 3,995
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulvS View Post
The elevator trim is manual and even small adjustments have a lot of effect. I am still getting used to sensing when the trim adjustment is right because the stick forces are so light. It is easy to inadvertently gain 200 feet on downwind, or increase speed from 65 knots to 70 knots on final, by just small movements of the stick.

I have tried flying downwind at 80 knots (no flaps) and it makes the workload more manageable, however my transition instructor advises that it is bad airmanship to fly an RV too slowly, so 110 knots it is I guess.
80 kts is an excellent downwind speed, that is what Mike Seager (RV factory transition pilot with a gazillion RV hrs....) taught me when transitioning to the RV-6. If your instructor is uncomfortable with flying the -9 at that speed then take him flying sometime and train him in RV slow-flight maneuvers....

When setting the trim, just take your hand off the stick to verify you have trim set so the aircraft maintains level flight. This becomes instinctive after getting used to the technique.

Enjoy!
__________________
Sam Buchanan
1999 RV-6
1918 Fokker D.VII replica
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 10-16-2019, 06:56 PM
rjcthree's Avatar
rjcthree rjcthree is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Bay Village, OH
Posts: 805
Default Slow?

My Vso is 43kt....80kt isnít exactly slow! Iím going to try the full flap at crossing the numbers at 75kt, Iím curious how that works. Currently Iím 85/75/65 with half then full flaps at 75/65.
__________________
Rick
RV-9A N183RC/90432: tip-up, O320H2, Ellison, Dynon D180, crossed over 100 hours TT
RV-8 83718, wing kit (tanks! Black Death!) in work with a four year plan
2011-2019 VAF contributor
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 10-16-2019, 06:59 PM
Flying Canuck Flying Canuck is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Red Deer, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 300
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SPX View Post
Your pattern speeds are unnecessarily fast, if youíre most comfortable at 80 knots. Flying at 80 knots while in the pattern isnít bad airmanship at all. On the contrary, if youíre just working the pattern, Iíd say letting it accelerate to 110 or so is bad airmanship...

If I was instructing in an RV-9, Iíd teach enter the pattern between 90 and 100 knots. Midfield at 80 knots, a beam landing with flaps partially extended at 75-80 knots. Base around 70 knots, final at 55-60 knots.
Very close to what I do for speeds. Just looked back at my flight last Friday which was at night. Pattern entry/downwind ~90KT. 1st flaps (5) and 85 as I'm abeam the numbers. 2nd flaps (18), throttle to 12-13" as I turn base, trim for 70-75. Full flaps as I turn final and trim for low 60s. Cross the numbers around 60. Find myself adding a little power in on short final to curb the descent, although this is more likely at night. Touchdown is below 65 every time, best results are right around 60.

In my head I use 95/85/75/65KT for arrival/downwind/base/final speeds and the closer I adhere to that the better it goes for my landings.

If you look back at my posts from March/April this year, you'll see that my "instructor" had me coming in closer to 75 every time. After a landing incident caused significantly by that high landing speed, I had to retrain myself to do what my transition trainer taught and my description above is the result of that. I will say that 60 over the numbers seems really slow, so does 75 on base and even 90 on downwind, but for me the results are irrefutable. These speeds also make it so I play nice with the 172s that overrun this airport. I enjoy my 110+ when I away from the airport but I dial it back to <95 before I get within 3 miles. I like not breaking things when I land.

One caveat, I fly behind a C/S prop and have never landed a FP. I don't think it would be that different but I've heard that it is more difficult slowing it down with the FP. All the more reason to not go too quick on downwind.
__________________
Claude Pitre
RV-9A #91081, C-GCPT
Dynon SkyView HDX, IO-320 and WW 200RV C/S. Flying as of August 6, 2018
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 10-16-2019, 09:11 PM
Dugaru's Avatar
Dugaru Dugaru is online now
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Richmond VA, USA
Posts: 378
Default Speeds

Take the following for what it's worth, because I'm not an instructor

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulvS View Post
I was originally having difficulty holding off the nose wheel after landing; once the speed reduced, the nose wheel would drop down as the elevator lost effectiveness. But some additional ballast in the baggage area (15 Kg water keg) has helped significantly and I can lower the nose wheel down gently at just above taxi speed. Also, it is possible to do a fast taxi balancing on just the mains and steering with rudder.
Yes it takes a bit of practice to be able to lower the nosewheel gently. Make sure your seat cushion isn't interfering with your ability to get the stick ALL the way back. The ability to taxi on the mains is how I learned that my shimmy is a main gear issue, not a nosewheel issue.

Quote:
The elevator trim is manual and even small adjustments have a lot of effect. I am still getting used to sensing when the trim adjustment is right because the stick forces are so light. It is easy to inadvertently gain 200 feet on downwind, or increase speed from 65 knots to 70 knots on final, by just small movements of the stick.
This was my biggest issue transitioning from a Warrior - for a variety of reasons the 9A is MUCH quick to gain altitude. You'll get used to it pretty quickly though. I have a CS prop so it doesn't seem to speed up very quickly in the pattern.

Quote:
The initial take-off roll is easier to control with right rudder if I go to full throttle a bit more progressively over 3-4 seconds. Once speed builds up the right rudder needs much less pressure.
Agreed, the rudder seems to have a lot of authority if there is any wind over it at all. Note too that the position of the nosewheel as you start the takeoff roll can impact how much rudder you need right at first. With a little practice you'll be able to position the nosewheel straight before adding takeoff power.

Quote:
The circuit procedure that has been instructed is: build up speed in ground effect and climb upwind to 500 feet at 110 knots. Turn crosswind and climb to 1000 feet maintaining 110 knots. Fly downwind at 110-120 knots. Reduce power to idle abeam the numbers so that speed drops to 80-85 knots at the point of turning base. When the base turn causes speed to drop to 78 knots Vfe, deploy full flaps and trim for 70 knots. Turn final by 500', hold at 65 knots, or better at 60 knots to reduce float.
Respectfully, I'm not a fan of the first part of this procedure. You're climbing out much faster than Vy, and a downwind leg of 110 to 120 seems unnecessarily fast and requires a lot of slowing in the pattern. I slow to 78 on downwind, feed in all the flaps before turning base, and that keeps things super simple. No doubt there are various opinions on this sort of thing.

Quote:
I have tried flying downwind at 80 knots (no flaps) and it makes the workload more manageable, however my transition instructor advises that it is bad airmanship to fly an RV too slowly, so 110 knots it is I guess.
I like your 80-knot downwind idea. I think the instructor is confusing the RV with a Lancair or F-104. There's bound to be some variation in RV weight and actual/indicated stall speed, but 80 knots is plenty fast in my plane on downwind. Plenty. Also the darn thing bucks like a bronco before it stalls, so a stall is not going to sneak up on you in level flight.

Have fun and keep us posted!!!
__________________
N929JA, 2007 RV-9A
Based W96 - near Richmond, VA USA
2019 Dues Paid
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:31 AM.


The VAFForums come to you courtesy Delta Romeo, LLC. By viewing and participating in them you agree to build your plane using standardized methods and practices and to fly it safely and in accordance with the laws governing the country you are located in.