Van's Air Force
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Replica .50 cal Brownings!
- Thread starter TXFlyGuy
- Start date
The barrels are being machined now, should be done by late next week. As soon as we get these completed, and the fiberglass blisters made, we will have a good handle on the cost.
This is close to what it will look like...but ours will be much closer to the original in appearance. This installation could have been done far better, and a quality paint shop (GLO-Custom) would really make this look good.
Ours will look more like this:
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rv7charlie
Well Known Member
Six big multi-edged blisters directly on the leading edge, a hard span-wise trip line near the lowest pressure area of the wing, and a bunch of big dome head pop rivets won't affect performance on a 200 mph airframe? Really?
Will riveting a doubler to the leading edge have any effect on the load path/distribution when the wing tries to flex under load?
Charlie
Those rivets are not what we would recommend. You can use what ever you like. Real world flight testing shows little or no impact on performance with these installed. Yes, really.
Not certain, but it would appear that the wing root may stall first, leaving aileron control available. These are installed on a number of P-51 replica aircraft.
ChiefPilot
Well Known Member
I would love to have a set of these installed ... on my sparring buddies airplanes, that is. Straight-and-level unaccelerated flight is not where you'd be likely to notice the difference.
The planes that are flying with these installed report negligible impact on performance. Perhaps one, maybe two mph speed loss. No affect on stall characteristics, or other flight regimes.
For those of you who are not willing to sacrifice one mph, do not buy these. For those of you who are looking for a WOW factor, this is the ticket.
Why would you want to remove it? That being the case, I would not recommend this for you. Problem being the tape would not be strong enough to hold the guns in place, and still allow for easy removal.
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David Paule
Well Known Member
If you got rid of that sleeve and used fairing compound to fair the individual blisters in, it would look much better.
Dave
Dave
The original installation is in a separate panel attached to the wing. Again, the picture here is not the way we will install these. The seams will be treated and will blend into the wing.
While your suggestion has merit, it adds complexity and cost.
ChiefPilot
Well Known Member
I'm curious where exactly on the RV wing you will install these? Surely not on the fuel tank? On the other hand, they might look odd - too far outboard - otherwise.
A double-sided tape like that used on bumper parts on cars would certainly be strong enough, given how far around the leading edge it attaches. You'd have a hard time attaching it outboard of the fuel tank and inboard of the ailerons... I don't have my wing handy, but doesn't the fuel tank end at the same bay where the aileron starts?
ChiefPilot
Well Known Member
Looking at sheet 10 of the -6/6A plans, the aileron starts about 1/2 bay or so outboard of the fuel tank.
For sure it'd need to be something like double sided tape if it's going to overlap the fuel tank and I'd certainly agree that the stuff you mention would be strong enough. I can't say I'd be very excited about riviting anything to the fuel tank skin especially on a completed aircraft
Only in 2015 would we be talking about adding a 6-pack of 50 Cal with double sided tape to hold them on!
Bevan
There may be an adhesive material (glue like) that could be used, eliminating rivets. But it would be a permanent install.
I would almost bet that Flamemaster CS-3204 would work.
Michael White
Well Known Member
You guys can have the small caliber stuff...I'll go with the chin mounted cannon!
XOverZero
Well Known Member
On the off chance this thread is drifting into a ?top this? firepower arms race, here?s where it leads to. True, this ain?t no RV?why heck, it iddn even a homebuilt, but DANG, Son! You wanna talk cannon??THAT is a CANNON! Seven-five mike mike and Boo-Yah!
On a more serious note, maybe I?m just way too square, but fake guns on the wing?? Sorry?don?t get it. S?cuse me while I go remove the bubble gum cards I got clothes-pinned on my bicycle spokes.
But if that?s what blows yer skirt up, hey, go for it. Different strokes and it?s all good.
On a more serious note, maybe I?m just way too square, but fake guns on the wing?? Sorry?don?t get it. S?cuse me while I go remove the bubble gum cards I got clothes-pinned on my bicycle spokes.
But if that?s what blows yer skirt up, hey, go for it. Different strokes and it?s all good.
OK, I've answered my own question. The 75 MM gun was installed from the nose and went aft and under the pilot's seat. It was a single fire weapon (manual loading). The installation included 10 forward facing 50 cal. guns. It was called the "train dispatcher". And just to keep this RV related, it will not fit in your RV!
Bevan
Bevan
On a more serious note, maybe I’m just way too square, but fake guns on the wing?? Sorry…don’t get it. S’cuse me while I go remove the bubble gum cards I got clothes-pinned on my bicycle spokes.
But if that’s what blows yer skirt up, hey, go for it. Different strokes and it’s all good.
Like, so many P-51 paint schemes. Ain't no Mustang. Sure, the guns are cool for those who like the warbird theme.
Will have more info in about ten days. The machine shop is still hard at work.
vfrazier
Well Known Member
My Rocket needed a bit more ventilation, so I added these to the wingroot:
http://vincesrocket.com/wingroot vent with bird guard.jpg
I shortened them by about 1/2 after I snapped the photo. The kids always seemed to spot them at the fly-ins.
They were fully functional air vents too. Made from PVC pipe scraps, cost nothing.
The full story: http://vincesrocket.com/Additions after 10-27-04.htm
http://vincesrocket.com/wingroot vent with bird guard.jpg
I shortened them by about 1/2 after I snapped the photo. The kids always seemed to spot them at the fly-ins.
They were fully functional air vents too. Made from PVC pipe scraps, cost nothing.
The full story: http://vincesrocket.com/Additions after 10-27-04.htm
My Rocket needed a bit more ventilation, so I added these to the wingroot:
http://vincesrocket.com/wingroot vent with bird guard.jpg
I shortened them by about 1/2 after I snapped the photo. The kids always seemed to spot them at the fly-ins.
They were fully functional air vents too. Made from PVC pipe scraps, cost nothing.
The full story: http://vincesrocket.com/Additions after 10-27-04.htm
Vince, that's bad to the bone! Practical/functional in the air, fun when parked on the ground. My compliments sir.
ChiefPilot
Well Known Member
So does putting a set of these on an airplane equate to an invitation to be bounced?
azrv6
Well Known Member
Recent test fire .50 caliber machine guns on a P-51. Hope the link works.
https://www.facebook.com/FagenFightersWwiiMuseum/videos/10150947251111610/
https://www.facebook.com/FagenFightersWwiiMuseum/videos/10150947251111610/
David-aviator
Well Known Member
Don Sheldon mounted shotguns to Cub struts for wolf hunting back when there was a bounty on wolves. I guess they worked.
There is a Don Sheldon display at the museum in Talkeetna AK. with more pictures of that hunting set up.
Yes, the link works. It's on our page as well...Project: Mustang, LLC.
Note the recoil. Bet they lost 5 knots when the guns were fired!
You want to be real quiet about that. Do not let the Federales (ATF) know about this.
David-aviator
Well Known Member
I wonder if the video of firing of 50 caliber guns is for real. It looked like real bullets going onto dirt bank but how does one get a permit for installing machine guns in a civilian airplane?
Yes, for sure those are live rounds. They had to get a special license as a Browning repair facility from the ATF in order to install these guns in the Mustang. The Feds will not allow them to fly the Mustang with the guns installed. Prior to flying, the guns have to be removed / disabled.
ColoRv
Well Known Member
The amount of time I've spent reducing drag trying to scrape together fractions of knots and someone really wants to pop rivet something like this to their wing....like on purpose?
I'll need to see a photo of these on an RV because until I do I just can't believe anyone would consider doing this to an RV. One or two mph speed loss and no effect on flying characteristics....was that on a 200mph plane? That is very hard to believe. Looks like a non retractable air brake to me.
I'll need to see a photo of these on an RV because until I do I just can't believe anyone would consider doing this to an RV. One or two mph speed loss and no effect on flying characteristics....was that on a 200mph plane? That is very hard to believe. Looks like a non retractable air brake to me.
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vfrazier
Well Known Member
OTOH, with a bit of trial and error, and a bit of luck, it might be possible to design and position the fake guns to act as VGs, thus enhancing the low speed handling.
Of course, the opposite is also true.
Dan H., thanks for the kind words about my installation in the wing root.
Just to expand on why I tried the "guns/vents" in the wing root, I was trying to get some cooler air from away from the fuselage. On my Rocket, the NACA vents on the fuselage sides were measured 11 degrees F. hotter air temp than the underwing vent air.
On the new F4 that I'm working on, I can assure you that the cabin ventilation air will not be coming from the fuselage sides!! It will have an extra underwing vent for the pilot also.
Of course, the opposite is also true.
Dan H., thanks for the kind words about my installation in the wing root.
Just to expand on why I tried the "guns/vents" in the wing root, I was trying to get some cooler air from away from the fuselage. On my Rocket, the NACA vents on the fuselage sides were measured 11 degrees F. hotter air temp than the underwing vent air.
On the new F4 that I'm working on, I can assure you that the cabin ventilation air will not be coming from the fuselage sides!! It will have an extra underwing vent for the pilot also.
Yes, flight tested on 200 mph (and greater) aircraft. Almost no impact on handling or speed.
Wallbangar
Well Known Member
Noise maker
While your at it, how about a switch in the cockpit that will cause an air popping noise that sounds like .50 cal's !!!!!!!!!!!
While your at it, how about a switch in the cockpit that will cause an air popping noise that sounds like .50 cal's !!!!!!!!!!!
Stitch462
Well Known Member
You guys can have the small caliber stuff...I'll go with the chin mounted cannon!
I see your little gun and raise you a Seven-Barrel Avenger Cannon with 1150 rounds of 30mm!
