Ah, that makes sense. The context made it sound like it was the transiting pilot's fault for not reading a NOTAM for a field they don't intend to land at.
Van's Air Force
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What keeps you from flying aerobatics? Really?
- Thread starter ronschreck
- Start date
Ah, that makes sense. The context made it sound like it was the transiting pilot's fault for not reading a NOTAM for a field they don't intend to land at.
Pilot135pd
Well Known Member
Thunderbirds and Blue Angels do it.
Thanks Ron!
I am just about to complete my IFR and Commercial license training...IFR check ride Next Friday after Sun n Fun. (Goal for Commercial is to be done before end of April.)
Speaking of, I hope I can run into you Friday or Saturday at Sun n Fun if you are going to make it.
Either way, I will get my tail down to Georgia or that IAC in Tennessee. Hope I run into you sir.
Thank you
Dan
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It was Great! During one of the hammerheads, was so busy enjoying the view watching the wing as it went vertical then vertical the other way, instructor was telling me to use opposite aileron, almost put us over on the back, finally added some to keep the instructor quiet...
Was shown how to draw things with the spinner (boxes, circles and figure 8s), keeping the wings level and just moving the nose around.
Loops were a blast. Forgot to "float" across the top on the first one, but the second much better.
More practice maneuvers along a road, guess you would call them wing overs with wing level when crossing the road of reference.
Will be going again this week.
Spins, rolls and lots more fun planned a few times after work this week! Scott then heads out for his regular job.
Just can't get over how beautiful the wing looks when going vertical! Looks natural!
Scott flies a show at the Valdez STOL competition. Highly recommended locally, then at the last EAA Chapt 975 meeting we met.
Just learning the basics, not much competition in Alaska.
Best regards,
Mike Bauer
Gash
Well Known Member
I just found this thread. Thanks Ron for starting the discussion. As you know, I was completely unaware of IAC and the possibility of doing aerobatics in my RV-8 until I stumbled upon your presentation at Oshkosh 3 years ago. For me, it was a game changer.
Motivated by your speech and slides, I started doing aerobatics on my own, and then showed up cold at my first contest 2 years ago. Believe it or not, my first time diving into the box was the very first time I had seen an aerobatic box with markers on the ground. Despite my almost comical lack of experience, I had a wonderful time and met some of the friendliest and most supportive people I know in all of aviation!
You can read the article about it that I wrote for EAA here.
I had a good first year in competition aerobatics. I won first place in the Southwest Regional Series in the Sportsman category. I also won the 2017 California Point Series first place trophy. I've now flown a total of 7 contests, and will probably fly another 5 this season, including Nationals.
My trusted Vans airplane turned out to be my "gateway drug" leading to further advancement in aerobatics. I sold my RV-8 and bought an Extra 330LX. I'm now flying in the Intermediate category, and plan to move up to Advanced later this year. I've trained with Rob Holland, Bill Stein and Sergei Boriak, as well as many other talented pilots in my local IAC Chapter 62. You could say that I've gone "all in".
So why do I do it? First, I LOVE challenging myself to fly every single figure in the book as perfectly as possible. After 15,000 hours in 36 different aircraft, the only place I still find difficult and exciting challenges is in aerobatics. It's physical, mental, emotional, and an even spiritual experience when I achieve that elusive perfect double vertical roll and "reach out and touch the face of God". It's even better when I fly an entire tank of fuel doing snap rolls for Sergei, and I finally do a perfect snap and hear a Russian accent on the radio saying "good Karl, now go land and think about it."
Second, I think I thrive on "pre-game jitters". Living on the edge of something competitive just makes me feel alive. I got to experience it when playing football in school and when going feet dry in combat in my F-16. But at this stage in life, the only times I can feel the same sense of purpose is when I'm risking embarrassment in front of a crowd and 5 judges.
I tell everyone that if I can do it, anybody can. Walking into Ron's Oshkosh presentation was a random event that changed my life. I said "what the heck, I'll give it a try". Since then, I've had some of the my best-ever experiences in aviation.
Motivated by your speech and slides, I started doing aerobatics on my own, and then showed up cold at my first contest 2 years ago. Believe it or not, my first time diving into the box was the very first time I had seen an aerobatic box with markers on the ground. Despite my almost comical lack of experience, I had a wonderful time and met some of the friendliest and most supportive people I know in all of aviation!
You can read the article about it that I wrote for EAA here.
I had a good first year in competition aerobatics. I won first place in the Southwest Regional Series in the Sportsman category. I also won the 2017 California Point Series first place trophy. I've now flown a total of 7 contests, and will probably fly another 5 this season, including Nationals.
My trusted Vans airplane turned out to be my "gateway drug" leading to further advancement in aerobatics. I sold my RV-8 and bought an Extra 330LX. I'm now flying in the Intermediate category, and plan to move up to Advanced later this year. I've trained with Rob Holland, Bill Stein and Sergei Boriak, as well as many other talented pilots in my local IAC Chapter 62. You could say that I've gone "all in".
So why do I do it? First, I LOVE challenging myself to fly every single figure in the book as perfectly as possible. After 15,000 hours in 36 different aircraft, the only place I still find difficult and exciting challenges is in aerobatics. It's physical, mental, emotional, and an even spiritual experience when I achieve that elusive perfect double vertical roll and "reach out and touch the face of God". It's even better when I fly an entire tank of fuel doing snap rolls for Sergei, and I finally do a perfect snap and hear a Russian accent on the radio saying "good Karl, now go land and think about it."
Second, I think I thrive on "pre-game jitters". Living on the edge of something competitive just makes me feel alive. I got to experience it when playing football in school and when going feet dry in combat in my F-16. But at this stage in life, the only times I can feel the same sense of purpose is when I'm risking embarrassment in front of a crowd and 5 judges.
I tell everyone that if I can do it, anybody can. Walking into Ron's Oshkosh presentation was a random event that changed my life. I said "what the heck, I'll give it a try". Since then, I've had some of the my best-ever experiences in aviation.
ronschreck
Well Known Member
Hi Karl.
Karl, It's always great to hear from you, the "poster child" of IAC competition. Or maybe you and Jerry Esquenazi are the poster twins. I re-read your article and one thing hit me that needs to be said more often: IAC competition is supported by volunteers and we couldn't exist without them. Only about 11% of IAC members actively compete. The rest are there for a variety of reasons. Maybe they want to learn more about recreational aerobatics or just want to become a safer pilot. We have lots of members who aren't even pilots; they just enjoy being around an exciting sport. My friend and neighbor, Gary Sobek attended an IAC judge's school earlier this year and volunteered as a judges assistant at a contest this past weekend. He will need to assist at one more contest and he will be ready to take the exam and become an IAC judge! Gary is a RV-6 pilot who many of you know from his formation activity. He may not compete in aerobatics but he sure seems to enjoy being a volunteer. I hope he leaps on this thread and tells you all about his first contest experience.
Karl, It's always great to hear from you, the "poster child" of IAC competition. Or maybe you and Jerry Esquenazi are the poster twins. I re-read your article and one thing hit me that needs to be said more often: IAC competition is supported by volunteers and we couldn't exist without them. Only about 11% of IAC members actively compete. The rest are there for a variety of reasons. Maybe they want to learn more about recreational aerobatics or just want to become a safer pilot. We have lots of members who aren't even pilots; they just enjoy being around an exciting sport. My friend and neighbor, Gary Sobek attended an IAC judge's school earlier this year and volunteered as a judges assistant at a contest this past weekend. He will need to assist at one more contest and he will be ready to take the exam and become an IAC judge! Gary is a RV-6 pilot who many of you know from his formation activity. He may not compete in aerobatics but he sure seems to enjoy being a volunteer. I hope he leaps on this thread and tells you all about his first contest experience.
The IAC Judging School is one of the most intense training classes I have been in. There is a lot of information presented in a short period of time. None of it is difficult but there is a lot of info in a short period of time. Volunteering at an event is also another challenge. After passing the written test after the school, you may feel like you know a lot BUT there is just as much more that is needed to know.
The Competition is something that is hard to describe. By flying each flight figure the pilot is showing the precision of what they can do with an airplane. Flying Formation or Flying IFR both are pilot flying airplane with precision. Now take that precision and make your airplane do acrobatics with precision. You must have complete control of your aircraft and situational awareness to have the airplane travel a perfect flight path to earn a good score.
The RV series of aircraft is a very capable aircraft. It may not be as good as a PITTS or other aircraft designed just for acrobatics but it has the capability to do well considering all the other things it does.
Are your pilot skills up to it? The performance of the pilot using RV aircraft in the acrobatic box that I saw over the weekend was impressive.
I was also impressed with a first time competitor who we shall call Joe. Joe was flying a Ran's S-9. An S-9 is a small inexpensive 65 HP 2-cycle engine powered acrobatic capable airplane but Joe was able to make the airplane do everything required to make a good showing and show off what he as a pilot was capable of.
Volunteering at IAC is a chance to help support part of aviation. It is also an excuse (just like the $100 hamburger) to use your airplane for travel and to meet more great people that are also pilots. The greatest thing about being an RV pilot is all the other pilots you have the chance to meet. In the past 21+ years that I have been flying my RV, it is the people that I have met that have enriched my life the most.
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Scott Hersha
Well Known Member
Ron,
What keeps me from flying aerobatics in my RV8? Um, well.... my partner(s) that keep having prop strikes on my beautiful bird, that takes if out of commission for 2 months at a time, if I?m fast - twice in the last 10 months.... Why do I have a partnership?? Good question. I?m still trying to figure out how to get out of this situation.. Not easy. I?m under this dark cloud with the insurance companies - which is getting worse for all of us - even though I didn?t cause any of the claims, ever. This past year has not been a good one in many ways. I hope it?s temporary.
SH
What keeps me from flying aerobatics in my RV8? Um, well.... my partner(s) that keep having prop strikes on my beautiful bird, that takes if out of commission for 2 months at a time, if I?m fast - twice in the last 10 months.... Why do I have a partnership?? Good question. I?m still trying to figure out how to get out of this situation.. Not easy. I?m under this dark cloud with the insurance companies - which is getting worse for all of us - even though I didn?t cause any of the claims, ever. This past year has not been a good one in many ways. I hope it?s temporary.
SH
RV8Squaz
Well Known Member
Hi Karl,
Great to hear from you! I share the same sentiments you so eloquently wrote in your article and in your post. Like Ron, I re-read the article. I too have somewhere around 15,000 hours in many aircraft types and despite all of that experience, I find this sport very very challenging. It is as much a mental sport as a physical sport.
I enjoy all the prep leading to ”game day.” It motivates me and gives me a reason to fly my airplane every day. I enjoy the camaraderie at the contests, at chapter practices, and the one on one training. I enjoy the contests and that positive energy nervousness and adrenaline rush you get as you wag into the box and the satisfaction of knowing that you just flew an awesome sequence. Of course there are those times that you don’t fly a great sequence and then the challenge becomes to learn from it and do better the next time.
I enjoy the cross-country time getting me to practices and contests all over the country. In fact, that was a driving force in my decision to do the TX series this year. I have a few good RV friends in TX and of course the BBQ is first class. I couldn’t think of a better way to combine in it all!
And of course there are the people. I have met some really wonderful people over the last 2 1/2 years with my involvement in the IAC. Every time I go to a contest, I get to see some old friends and meet some new faces. It’s also very interesting to hear the stories from the people that have been doing this for 20+ years. I have learned the history and lineage of some of the aircraft and heard many stories about some of the aerobatic greats. Fun stuff.
It’s funny that Ron refers to us as poster children. It’s his fault we’re in this crazy sport and why we’re having so much fun!
Prior to Oshkosh 2016 I had known about Ron and we had even met a few times. But, it wasn’t until that fateful Airventure that we were having a beer (or two) at the SOS tent with some mutual friends. Aerobatics of course was the topic of discussion. I had already been enjoying flying aerobatics for many years. I first started during college learning in a Super Decathlon, then 20 years in the AF, and then 9 years of flying “gentleman aerobatics” in my RV. He realized how much I already enjoyed aerobatics and looked me straight in the eye and said, “You need to do this,” referring to IAC competition. The rest is history and I’m so grateful for that meeting. Thank you Ron.And Karl, like you, I’ve gone all in as well. I believe the RV is a perfect airplane for Primary and Sportsman. And it is certainly capable of Intermediate. But as of late I feel like I’m abusing my RV. I’ve flown 12 contests and countless hours practicing in my RV. My RV-8 is “my baby” and I want to continue enjoy flying it for many years and I want to see my son fly it for many years. So with that, I am currently on the look out for an airplane that will serve me well in Intermediate and beyond.
To all of you contemplating aerobatics and competition aerobatics, jump in... the water is fine. One caution... it is addicting! My wife recently told me I was obsessed with “aerobatics and the competition stuff.” I’m going to take that as compliment!
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RV8Squaz
Well Known Member
P.S. Congratulations to Chris Crawford who flew in his first contest in an RV-8A in Primary. Chris, if you?re online, please tell us more about it.
It was a small contest due to weather and Easter Sunday with only 10 competitors but RVs represented 20% of the field! Great job Chris and Ron!
It was a small contest due to weather and Easter Sunday with only 10 competitors but RVs represented 20% of the field! Great job Chris and Ron!
gerardoconnell
I'm New Here
Aerobatic instruction
Hi there, I?m new to the forum and to Vans aircraft. I have flown a Lancair 320 exclusively for the last 15 + years. I recently purchased a finished RV8A powered by Superior 180 HP fuel injected engine and constant speed prop.
All my flying hours thus far have been straight and level. I am interested in learning some basic aerobatics which I believe will improve my general flying abilities and my familiarity with this magnificent aircraft. It has similarities but also many differences to the Lancair. I am still familiarising myself with the knobology and layout of the aircraft which is completely different to the Lancair I was intimately familiar with-re training the brain is challenging !
I intend to fly with an experienced aerobatic pilot. I would appreciate any information regarding aircraft weight and entry speeds for aerobatic flying you can provide to guide my training.
Cheers from down under
Gerard
Hi there, I?m new to the forum and to Vans aircraft. I have flown a Lancair 320 exclusively for the last 15 + years. I recently purchased a finished RV8A powered by Superior 180 HP fuel injected engine and constant speed prop.
All my flying hours thus far have been straight and level. I am interested in learning some basic aerobatics which I believe will improve my general flying abilities and my familiarity with this magnificent aircraft. It has similarities but also many differences to the Lancair. I am still familiarising myself with the knobology and layout of the aircraft which is completely different to the Lancair I was intimately familiar with-re training the brain is challenging !
I intend to fly with an experienced aerobatic pilot. I would appreciate any information regarding aircraft weight and entry speeds for aerobatic flying you can provide to guide my training.
Cheers from down under
Gerard
ronschreck
Well Known Member
Hi Gerard,
Here's a link to a webinar I did for the EAA last year. I think it will answer all your questions.
Eddie P
Well Known Member
Ron, thanks for leaving this thread open. I hope your great thread can serve to be a conversation for some time to come rather than just a commentary, if it were closed.
I would place myself in sort of the “I’m afraid I’ll break my plane” camp, but not really that... To be more specific, I am in a camp that wonders about how to start... and really, “what exactly should I be looking for in preventative maintenance, safety modifications and fellow guidance from professionals as I prepare to become more aerobatic proficient after joining the IAC.”
Ten years back I was flying a 4 and purchased a aerobatic chute in preparation for aerobatics and joining the IAC. I took 10 hours of dual in a Decathalon and Pitts S2B. Like you, I started flying RC models at 8 years old and could do flat spins, 16 point tolls and rolling 360 turns by the time I was 12. I was delighted to see how the concepts and visualization of the aerobatic box and routine are the same in a Pitts S2B... not 100 percent applicable from the seat view but still similar. Just the repetitive negative G stuff I will take a pass on as I feel it’s just not comfortable. And it’s hard on the plane too.
The opportunity in the 4 did not last long for me but it was all good. Life circumstances had other opportunities in store for us so I took a hiatus from sport aviation for a while. But, now that I have an 8, the goal is to get comfortable with what is required to start this aerobatic effort again in a responsible and sustainable way. I appreciate the thread and great information you provide, Ron!
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ronschreck
Well Known Member
Ed,
Welcome back! It sounds like you did all the right things to ready yourself for aerobatics, albeit 10 years ago. It wouldn't hurt to take a refresher course if it would make you feel more comfortable. Your local IAC chapter is a great resource for some advanced aerobatic training so I hope you will hook up with them. I'll be looking for you on the contest results. Good luck!
