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The Terrible and Horrible Universal Law of Irony

drjjbrown

Member
Well boys and girls, it's your worst fear.

I did my due diligence before starting my build with a ongoing medical issue and had a special issuance for 6 years while I built the 9A of my dreams. It has the absolute best of everything, airworthiness certified and is ready for it's first flight.

Then I had a new medical issue last January, not life threatening, but they pulled my special issuance and won't give it back, despite every effort on my part including all you those you know, up to and including an NTSB hearing request which was denied. I am working through the denial, anger, bargaining, depression and pretty much into the acceptance phase.

I can fly the airplane with someone else acting as PIC, but that is not a long term solution and certainly not the situation I dreamed of for so many years. I don't want to try fly my 40 hours in this setting.

So I have a new airplane, painted, state of the art panel and interior that I have to sell. I simply don't have any experience in selling an RV or any airplane, particularly in this situation.

I am looking for any and all advice in doing this. Sympathy appreciated but not required.

Jeff in Portland
 
Here's some advice that may be worth what you paid for it...

In my opinion, a plane that's ready to go is worth more than one that's never flown. I've heard that some planes could be ferried to their new home after five flight hours, so do that as a minimum. Out of phase 1 with a full set of flight test data -- not just hours flown off -- is worth something, but that will cost $1,500 of gas, more or less.

Also, the more documentation you can provide with the plane -- component list, serial numbers, manuals, wiring diagrams -- that will reduce risk to the buyer.

Places to advertise are on this web site, and others. Spring is typically a good time to sell, winter not so much, so you've got time to get your selling act together.

Take good pictures -- great lighting, all the details shown. You want to communicate that the plane is gorgeous, well equipped, and well built. Make sure your pictures cover all three of those objectives. Take shots of the panel, interior, firewall forward, and workmanship detail.

Get several people to inspect the plane and provide written opinions that you can use. Make sure that they're objective -- a whitewash will be counterproductive.

Lastly, and this is painful advice, consider how long you are prepared to wait for a buyer. I once looked at a car and told the seller he had to choose between having a $28,000 car in his driveway or $24,000 in his bank account.

Hope this helps, and that your post-RV life is filled with great people and things to do.

Ed
 
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Dang Jeff---words cant express what we all feel. Keep fighting--you never know. But--if you must sell it, some one will be getting a great plane.

Tom
 
maybe don't give up

I might open a can of worms by discussing male psychology, but here goes.
Rather than give up on flying your dream, maybe consider finding a suitable flying partner to stay in the game. We all seem to have that "PIC" mentality and it is understandable. I think with some effort and "re-training" your normal thought process, you might come to be able to adjust to not flying alone. The candidate could be young or old. Male or female. Significant other or not.
Even financing some lessons to complete a private rating could be considered. You seem to have the health needed to do the actual flying (if I am wrong, I will not expect medical privacy to be violated on a forum). Your co-pilot can sit right seat from the beginning, as I can't recall any regulation preventing it.
Think about the thousands of professional pilots who board planes each day and never think twice about it being a crew. Anyway, I thought I would just offer encouragement to think about alternatives. Best.
 
If you were lucky enough find a flight instructor that is also a medical examiner he might become a great help with the FAA.
 
I've always wondered just what the percentage of GA pilots there are that have no license, after all, there's not that much the feds can do but revoke your license. There's no doubt that flying in the more rural parts of the country one would never encounter a fed. Even flying in SoCal for 40 years I've only been ramped once and I refused to show him anything. Just food for thought. :cool:
 
Hi Jeff,

You?re not alone. I know of a few guys, still airplane owners, flying with friends and at the airport several days a week. It?s in their blood.

Have we met? EAA? CAA? OPA? Many great friends through these organizations like VAF, but more face to face.

Where are you based? Let me know if I or a friend can help.

Bruce,
[email protected]
 
I've always wondered just what the percentage of GA pilots there are that have no license, after all, there's not that much the feds can do but revoke your license. There's no doubt that flying in the more rural parts of the country one would never encounter a fed. Even flying in SoCal for 40 years I've only been ramped once and I refused to show him anything. Just food for thought. :cool:

Actually, you would be wrong on both counts.

https://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/Fairbanks-Pilot-Faces-Possible-Jail-Time-230053-1.html


Now, having said that, every man must weigh the consequences against the action, and pick their own path. If you don't screw up, you likely won't get caught.
 
Regardless of the facts, it's not a good idea to "promote" illegal activities on this forum. I know you guys don't think you are promoting these activities, but by just making these statements, some people are encouraged to do so.
 
So maybe the feds can?t do anything but if there?s an accident, the lawyers sure can. Maybe toss in some local laws on reckless operation of s motor vehicle. Yes, there?s federal law preempting local law but I?ve read of such charges bring filed.
 
Like Bruce said, there are many of us around this here Portland area willing to help if you want someone to ride along so you can fly it and/or get the phase one test hours flown off. Myself included.
 
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Really nice of all of you to render advice. I generally try harder not to break the law than in my youth, but still have no problem encouraging others. I doubt my insurance would cover anything if I did have an accident, or absolute worst case hurt someone.

I am going to try to recruit enough people to go flying and contacts are great. I did some transition training with Mike Seagar but having not flown in a long time my skills are not there yet. My airplane is based at KHIO and I am a Chapter 105 member so someone may have met me. Feel free to ask Char or Joe to point me out at the breakfast.
 
I was fortunate to help an aging EAA chapter member "stay in the game". There was no way he wanted to hang up his wings, sell his airplane. Being a pilot just meant too much to him.

We flew together for several years. They were good years, with many memorable flights. We had lots of great moments just sitting there after a flight, listening to the gyros spinning down, reflecting on what a wonderful pleasure it is to look down upon this beautiful earth.

My friend is gone now, his airplane and hangar have passed into the stewardship of another EAA chapter member.

As I reflect on the years we flew together I cannot help but feel good about helped my friend stay in the air. Some folks have asked why I was doing it. They'll not likely ever understand the pleasure that comes from helping a person keep their passion for flying alive.

Don't be afraid to reach out and have others help you fly your airplane. I know they will feel as I do, that it is an honor and a pleasure to assist a fellow flyer in living the dream of flight.
 
Really nice of all of you to render advice. I generally try harder not to break the law than in my youth, but still have no problem encouraging others. I doubt my insurance would cover anything if I did have an accident, or absolute worst case hurt someone.

I am going to try to recruit enough people to go flying and contacts are great. I did some transition training with Mike Seagar but having not flown in a long time my skills are not there yet. My airplane is based at KHIO and I am a Chapter 105 member so someone may have met me. Feel free to ask Char or Joe to point me out at the breakfast.

I'll look for you at the January breakfast. I fly out of Twin Oaks.
 
Actually, you would be wrong on both counts.

https://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/Fairbanks-Pilot-Faces-Possible-Jail-Time-230053-1.html


Now, having said that, every man must weigh the consequences against the action, and pick their own path. If you don't screw up, you likely won't get caught.

What the feds "Can" do and what they "Will" do are two different worlds. It is a huge process to file criminal charges against a pilot, and a pilot with a lawyer it's nearly impossible. I closely followed a VERY notorious Aviation Criminal for years. This was a well known continual violator, including at least 6 deaths. After many many years of the feds rattling their limp sabers they finally revoked his license, WOW!!! Countless violations, big ones and multiple deaths, years and years of this.. And they finally pulled his ticket. And the limit is a year. Retest and you're a pilot again. Better yet, he went to Canada and got another license. All this is fact! Karma finally stepped in and he flew into a lake and killed himself.
Now, saying that.. I don't promote illegal flying and there is the liability you will except since your insurance will laugh at any claim. There is no doubt many people fly without a license and that was the question I posed.
 
I know you have worked hard on keeping your medical. Before you sell the plane give these guys a shot. I know several pilots who were told there was no way they would get a medical restored and were giving up. AMAS got their medical restored. They are the very best at this. If they tell you it cant be done then you know you have exhausted every option.
George

https://www.aviationmedicine.com
 
I bet there are lots of young pilots out there anxious to build time in something other than a c150. I know several guys around here who fly with copilots to still enjoy flying and be legal. They have lots of fun and adventures. Flying is more fun if you can share it with a friend. But if you have made up your mind to sell then that is unfortunate but understandable.
 
+1 for AMAS! They are the absolute best at getting your medical back. I fly for a living and they have helped 2 of my professional pilot friends get their medical back when the outlook was originally very dismal.
 
another option?

ok, just a shot in the dark....
if the plane ain't 'quite' finished yet, is it too late to make it one of those Rv-9's that's registered as a light-sport? would that help with the license issue?
yes, lots of limitations on payload and range, but once you're 'back in the saddle' you can deal with those as you so choose.

just a thought, hope it might help?
 
When I first got my private, I became friends with a guy in a similar situation. We flew almost every day for probably 300 hours! Made a great friend with him In that 150, and I don't think he missed much not being able to be PIC..
 
He has a medically disqualifying condition. That excludes him from light sport, or basic med. It doesn't sound like he wants to continue with this airplane as SIC. He just needs advice on selling it. Doesn't sound like he's going to be able to overcome his medical condition, even though it's not life threatening.

My advice: get some help with finishing phase I (I would help you with that if you were in Cincinnati), take some good pictures; advertise with pictures here, on Barnstormers, TAP, and Controller. Be realistic about the price and it will sell.
 
I know he said that isn't his ideal situation, but I just wanted to let him know that with the right buddy, perhaps it wouldn't be so bad, maybe even enjoyable!
 
ok, just a shot in the dark....
if the plane ain't 'quite' finished yet, is it too late to make it one of those Rv-9's that's registered as a light-sport? would that help with the license issue?
yes, lots of limitations on payload and range, but once you're 'back in the saddle' you can deal with those as you so choose.

just a thought, hope it might help?

Too late. The few planes that were but this way started from the beginning as LSA eligible. Which means small engines, light climb props to limit speed, spartan interiors, limited instruments and options.
 
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