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Split in tire tube

SMO

SMO

Well Known Member
Friend
Had a flat tire on the Rocket the other day. Took the wheel off this is what I found:

Tube%20(800x480).jpg


Looks like a defect to me. The split is in a place where it is joined - there is double thickness all the way round at that spot. The tube doesn't say who made it (maybe rubbed off?) but does say "Made in Mexico". It is at least 8 years old.

I checked the inside of the tire carefully for any protrusions that might have contributed to this but didn't find anything. Is there any operational reason for a tube to split like this?
 
I would suspect under inflation as the cause. See that a lot with those small tires that don't hold much air and are almost impossible to keep full inflation all the time. More pronounced, it shows as a series of those small pinholes that can run the entire circumference right where the sidewall bulges when not fully inflated. Throw in a little relative motion between the tire and tube when the wheel accelerates upon landing and you get a tear like yours. That's my guess.
 
HA! I had a flat tire last Saturday with the leak in the inner tube in the exact same spot. Luckily it waited til I pulled up in front of my hangar instead of 300 miles away in N Carolina. Don't know if it was made in Mexico or not, but tomorrow, when I go flying, I will pull it out of the garbage and see if it says.
 
I have my first flat under my workbench. I know the leak was in that area but I will pull the tube out next time I am at the hangar and see if it was on the seam.
 
tough break...

Mark, hope you had no other damage or grief.
...hmmm....making tubes for 100 years or so, and that's the best they can do? for a $80 aircraft tube?

perhaps send the photo to Goodyear or Michelin, Desser, and see what their techs say...apparently a common problem, we all need to know how to avoid it. (could easily have written off a 1/4 million dollar aircraft!)

not that it would solve this, but for the persistent nosewheel issues, balance, etc. does anyone use the green snot that many motorcycle riders put in their tubes? ( puncture seal, leak stop and balancer are all claims, or uses, for this gunk. I used it on all my motorcycles with no ill effect)
 
I think you are talking about Slime. I bought a squeeze bottle to carry in the plane after I got my first flat. I never considered putting it in before a leak developed. What type of experience do yu have with it in your bike tires?
 
Inflation pressure for Don

35 PSI for donaziza By the way, I did pull it out of the garbage to see if it was made in Mexico. Couldn't find anything---that I could read anyhow.
 
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That tube looks quite worn. I also think under inflation, not enough talc and age. Once they go flat the wheel and tire will destroy them very quickly. Tearing at the seams is not uncommon.
 
slime in tires

AndyRV7 said:
I think you are talking about Slime. I bought a squeeze bottle to carry in the plane after I got my first flat. I never considered putting it in before a leak developed. What type of experience do yu have with it in your bike tires?
Click to expand...

bought the slime, put the suggested amount in each tube, and smooshed it around. Mounted tube & tire. did not balance tires, but found no vibration or shimmy at any speed, so figured it was gravitating to the out of balance spot as suggested. never lost air, or got a flat in 5 years of riding. put the same stuff in bicycle tires as well.
Never tired in aircraft tires....I'd be concerned that it would settle to the bottom, and a short taxi wouldn't be enough to warm up and distribute it around the tube before takeoff, especially in cold weather....not an issue with fair weather motorcycling though.
 
Use Michelin Airstops

Is that a Michelin Airstop or the cheapo tube from Van's?

I originally had the cheapo tube from Van's and it failed at the seam just sitting in the hangar - which to me is unacceptable.

The Michelin Airstops are much better made, I think they are extruded with one overlapped seam - no "butt" joints. Anyway they hold up really well and hold air for like, forever.
 
The tube should have been removed a couple of years ago and thrown away if it is "at least 8 years old" as you stated. Rubber is a highly complex chemical, and is affected by oxygen aging. That is why the auto companies now recommend that all tires that are 6 years old be discarded, even if it is the spare that has never been used but just sat under the frame ageing away.

In our club we used to change the tube at every tire change. Cheap insurance to keep from pulling into the ditch next to the runway.
 
novipilot said:
That is why the auto companies now recommend that all tires that are 6 years old be discarded, even if it is the spare that has never been used but just sat under the frame ageing away.
Click to expand...

I'm sure it has nothing to do with wanting to sell more tires :D
 
DanH said:
Mark, Don, inflation pressures?
Click to expand...

I run in the mid 30's. Pressures have stayed up - no slow leak down.

Is that a Michelin Airstop or the cheapo tube from Van's?
Click to expand...

I believe it is the cheapo variety

The tube should have been removed a couple of years ago and thrown away if it is "at least 8 years old" as you stated.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I was wondering about this. I should probably change out the other one as well.
 
Mark
I run the Michelin Air-stop tubes. These have 850 hours on this set since 2006.
I use around 45 lbs of air pressure for the Rocket.
 
I had a flat at Triple Tree in January during the Chilly Chili. My LeakGuard tube was only about 3 years old, had about 375 hours flying time, drowned in talc, and the pressure was just under 40psi (about 37-38 psi). I had inflated both tires a few weeks earlier to 40psi. Historically they both leaked down about the same rate. After the incident the other tire's pressure was 37-38 psi, measured with two different gages. The tube showed a rub mark and a small pinhole toward the top of the tire opposite the valve. Nothing inside the tire itself. I don't have an explanation for how this tube failed.

All I know is that the original AirHawk tires and tubes from Specialty lasted almost 5 years and 600 hours. I may go back to that this next time around.

Jerry Esquenazi
RV-8 N84JE
 
We've had this discussion before, but...

Empirical evidence suggests the incidence of tube failures goes down with increased pressure. Tires deform under landing and maneuver loads far more than most operators realize. Lower pressure increases deformation. Lots of deformation means lots of relative movement between tire, tube, and wheel.
 
More pressure, baby!

Hey Mark:

Try keeping about 45psi in the tires from now on....

So sayeth the Boss!

Carry on!
Mark
 
Used motorcycle green goop

flyboy1963 said:
Mark, hope you had no other damage or grief.
...hmmm....making tubes for 100 years or so, and that's the best they can do? for a $80 aircraft tube?

perhaps send the photo to Goodyear or Michelin, Desser, and see what their techs say...apparently a common problem, we all need to know how to avoid it. (could easily have written off a 1/4 million dollar aircraft!)

not that it would solve this, but for the persistent nosewheel issues, balance, etc. does anyone use the green snot that many motorcycle riders put in their tubes? ( puncture seal, leak stop and balancer are all claims, or uses, for this gunk. I used it on all my motorcycles with no ill effect)
Click to expand...

The stuff I used was purchased at a local motorcycle shop. I loved it when I rode. It helps balance while eliminating small puncture leaks. I used Ride-On brand TPS- P/N 531700.
It reduced, but did not eliminate a nagging slow leak (about 2 psi/wk).
I would use it again.
when I replaced the tubes during conditional inspection, I did not add it again, and the new tubes work great.

Daddyman
 
Tube

In the fall of 2009 I had only had my RV-4 for about 2 weeks when I was doing my first high speed taxi test when my left tire blew and applied my brakes while slowly leaving the runway. Lucky there was no damage to the plane but after removing the tire we found a tear in the tube. Decided to by new tires and tubes and keep my tires inflated to 35psi. I haven't had a problem since. Never did find out what happened to the tube.
 
F1Boss said:
Hey Mark:

Try keeping about 45psi in the tires from now on....

So sayeth the Boss!
Click to expand...

Aye Aye Sir! Consider it done! Probably going to result in more skipping down the runway, but as Wayne H. says, it just means the airplane is happy!

Tom Martin said:
Mark
I run the Michelin Air-stop tubes. These have 850 hours on this set since 2006.
I use around 45 lbs of air pressure for the Rocket.
Click to expand...

I also used a Michelin Air-stop to replace the leaker.

BTW, wrote and passed the Inrat today. Woo Hoo!
 
Flat tire wow's

After all this talk of flat tires I had to go out and purchase some new Aero Classic Leak Stop Tubes. It took me 10 years to finish the build and now with 150 hours in two years on the original tires and tubes. The tires look great but the tubes???
I don't want to have to rebuild a wheel cover or worse!
 
SMO said:
Aye Aye Sir! Consider it done! Probably going to result in more skipping down the runway, but as Wayne H. says, it just means the airplane is happy!



I also used a Michelin Air-stop to replace the leaker.

BTW, wrote and passed the Inrat today. Woo Hoo!
Click to expand...

Aye Aye Sir 2-----45 psi from now on vs my old 35 psi
 
here is my report: last may i replaced both tires and tubes on the mains. a month later a small pin hole resulted in a flat. last saturday another slow leak on the other side resulted another flat. this time no leak found using soapy water. both tubes replaced with new tubes from the local maintenance shop. psi back up to 45. thanks joe gauthier for your help both times with tools, jack, and air compressor to get the job done! moral of the story, don't replace your good tubes if they look good and are not very old. can't believe the number of rvs at hartford ct.
P1000206.jpg

bombarders ready for the grapefruit drop at tavares seaplane base in florida. you can see the course in the background which is well played out with lead in markers on both sides of the orange target. area.:cool:
 
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