Van's Air Force
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Fuel Pickup SB Poll
- Thread starter walter
- Start date
Well it might be something like this
No, I will not get into the whole Van's shooting a flea with a cannon, CMA response to a single event thing that is so blatently without justification that they make no effort to notify the owners in a formal manner. It would surprise me if 1 in 100 owners with completed and painted airplanes comply with the service bulleten. The information is not being collected in a controlled maner and could give false credibility to the action taken by Van's which ranks right up there with the magnetic latched airbox filter by-pass design.
Bob Axsom
No, I will not get into the whole Van's shooting a flea with a cannon, CMA response to a single event thing that is so blatently without justification that they make no effort to notify the owners in a formal manner. It would surprise me if 1 in 100 owners with completed and painted airplanes comply with the service bulleten. The information is not being collected in a controlled maner and could give false credibility to the action taken by Van's which ranks right up there with the magnetic latched airbox filter by-pass design.
Bob Axsom
robertahegy
Moderator/Tech Counselor
But one person admitted they never tightened the fitting in the first place. I think we need to know more before ripping our tanks apart.
Roberta
Roberta
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redbeardmark
Well Known Member
Yes, more info
I agree, Roberta. It would be nice to have input from pilots who have 1,000+ hours on their RV's, who did not proseal or safety wire the fuel pickup nut, and have run each tank empty(with plenty of fuel in the other tank, hopefully) to see if the tank could actually be drawn down to zero.
The fuel pickup SB is probably a very good thing for: 1)those who are still building because it will motivate them to make sure those nuts won't come off, 2)those who know that they forgot to tighten that nut, 3)those who enjoy tearing down a perfectly good airplane just to tinker with it.
I agree, Roberta. It would be nice to have input from pilots who have 1,000+ hours on their RV's, who did not proseal or safety wire the fuel pickup nut, and have run each tank empty(with plenty of fuel in the other tank, hopefully) to see if the tank could actually be drawn down to zero.
The fuel pickup SB is probably a very good thing for: 1)those who are still building because it will motivate them to make sure those nuts won't come off, 2)those who know that they forgot to tighten that nut, 3)those who enjoy tearing down a perfectly good airplane just to tinker with it.
On my last trip Panama City, FL to Fayetteville, AR
I have two 8.5 gallon tip tanks and two 19 gallon main tanks. After flying non-stop from Panama City, Florida to Fayetteville, Arkansas my refuel requirement was:
Left tip = 7 gallons
Left Main = 16.6 gallons
Right Main = 16.1 gallons
Right tip = 8.3 gallons
I ran the right tip dry by Little Rock about 2 minutes before I expected it but I have no doubt my tubes are attached as I installed them.
Bob Axsom
I have two 8.5 gallon tip tanks and two 19 gallon main tanks. After flying non-stop from Panama City, Florida to Fayetteville, Arkansas my refuel requirement was:
Left tip = 7 gallons
Left Main = 16.6 gallons
Right Main = 16.1 gallons
Right tip = 8.3 gallons
I ran the right tip dry by Little Rock about 2 minutes before I expected it but I have no doubt my tubes are attached as I installed them.
Bob Axsom
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Highflight
Well Known Member
thallock said:
Make that two.
My QB wings aren't fitted yet so it was easy for me to pop off the plates and have a look-see.
Two things of note; the cover was sealed with only the gasket and no additional sealer of any sort. Had I installed it myself, I would have opted to use a thin coat of sealer on both sides of the gasket and pro-sealed around the bases of the screws. That will be done when I put them back in.
Second, while the fuel tube pickup nut wasn't loose enough to take off with just finger pressure, I can say that the moment I even thought about giving the wrench the smallest amount of pressure, it spun free immediately. That particular nut was not even snugged, let alone tightened enough to get a good seal from the fitting to the flared tubing. There is no question in my mind that it would have come loose from vibration at some point in the (probably near) future after it began flying.
I'm sure somebody knows, although I don't, if the orignal reported instance was of a Quickbuild aircraft.
As everyone knows, Van's doesn't have a separate QB set of instructions because they say right up front that QB builders NEED to go over every step just as if they were building the entire aircraft themselves and verify everything. Good advice.
My feeling on this is that if you are flying a QB aircraft and never pulled the the pickup assemblies off and checked everything for proper installation, you really should consider grounding the aircraft as Van's suggests until doing the SB. Van's has no direct control over the building of the QB kits and I can see how a detail like this could be overlooked by everybody.
I don't fault Van's for this at all since they have always been clear that all builders, including QB builders, are responsible for either doing every detail of construction with care or in the case of QB builders, VERYIFYING EVERY DETAIL of construction even if the QB builders didn't do it themselves.
More QB Info
I built a QB, which is now flying, and I can say the nuts were very loose, but I went over it carefully and even upgraded to the screen type tubes. The day I installed the tubes and sealed the covers was the day that went on "forever", but because I remember that day so well, I know they are tight. I agree that ALL QB guys that don't remember tightening the nuts should check. As for the other guys, I don't think that it is really justified if you are sure you got your nuts tight.
The following is what I finally got back from Tom Green at Van's:
VAN?S AIRCRAFT, INC.
14401 NE Keil Road, Aurora, Oregon, USA 97002
PHONE 503-678-6545 ? FAX 503-678-6560 ? www.vansaircraft.com ? [email protected]
2-27-06
Van?s Aircraft has received several questions regarding alternative means of safetying the fasteners affected in SB 06-2-23 (Safetying the Fuel Pickups). While the methods called out in the service bulletin are not the only means to secure these fasteners, Van?s Aircraft feels that they are the best option to achieve the intended result. Van?s Aircraft Inc. does not intend to evaluate or recommend other options.
Service bulletins for aircraft operated under Part 91, regardless of how they are named (mandatory, required, optional, etc.) are issued by the manufacturer and, legally speaking, are advisory only. Service advisories are required for Part 91 operators only in the form of AD?s.
Van?s Aircraft issued Service Bulletin 06-2-23 in the interest of safety. If even one builder has neglected to properly install and torque these fittings and this service bulletin prevents an accident, injury or death, our mission is successful. We apologize for the inconvenience but stand firm in our diligence to safety.
I built a QB, which is now flying, and I can say the nuts were very loose, but I went over it carefully and even upgraded to the screen type tubes. The day I installed the tubes and sealed the covers was the day that went on "forever", but because I remember that day so well, I know they are tight. I agree that ALL QB guys that don't remember tightening the nuts should check. As for the other guys, I don't think that it is really justified if you are sure you got your nuts tight.
The following is what I finally got back from Tom Green at Van's:
VAN?S AIRCRAFT, INC.
14401 NE Keil Road, Aurora, Oregon, USA 97002
PHONE 503-678-6545 ? FAX 503-678-6560 ? www.vansaircraft.com ? [email protected]
2-27-06
Van?s Aircraft has received several questions regarding alternative means of safetying the fasteners affected in SB 06-2-23 (Safetying the Fuel Pickups). While the methods called out in the service bulletin are not the only means to secure these fasteners, Van?s Aircraft feels that they are the best option to achieve the intended result. Van?s Aircraft Inc. does not intend to evaluate or recommend other options.
Service bulletins for aircraft operated under Part 91, regardless of how they are named (mandatory, required, optional, etc.) are issued by the manufacturer and, legally speaking, are advisory only. Service advisories are required for Part 91 operators only in the form of AD?s.
Van?s Aircraft issued Service Bulletin 06-2-23 in the interest of safety. If even one builder has neglected to properly install and torque these fittings and this service bulletin prevents an accident, injury or death, our mission is successful. We apologize for the inconvenience but stand firm in our diligence to safety.
Bryan Wood
Well Known Member
Kevin,
I've completed the service bulletin on the first tank, but have the other to do this weekend. Total time for me to do this one was about 4 hours. Much of this time was spent looking for tools or little glitches that could be prevented with a little better planning. What I learned from the first was:
1. Pull the plane outside of the hanger if able to drain the tanks. After removing the drain the gas is coming out and will spill on the floor before you can get your finger over the hole in the bottom of the wing. Each time you switch gas cans and the funnel more will leak while you put your finger over the hole and remove it. By the time the tanks are drained the floor of the hanger where you'll be working smells strongly of gas and is terrible to work around. (20 minutes plus to drain a full tank into 4 cans)
2. Removing wing root fairing (10 minutes)
3. Removing screws on access plate (1 hour) I had a heck of a time until settling on a 1/4" ratchet with a 1/4" socket and a new phillips tip. Everything basically went smooth from there.
4. Removing the plate: I simply couldn't get anything between the plate and the rib to get a starting point. I tried a hacksaw blade thinned out on the end on the bench sander and broke it trying to get between the plate and rib. Then tried a feeler guage which just bent. Then tried a screwdriver but it seemed like it would just ruin the plate and rib so this was abandened. At this point I went to the local A&P and asked him if he thought that I would blow myself up if a heat gun was used to soften up the proseal. He told me to be careful and it should be okay with no open flames. This along with a putty knive that was thinned out on the bench sander finally got through. From there it took about 5 more minutes to get everything apart.
(1 and 1/2 hours, but could have been 10 minutes if starting with the heat gun)
5. Drilling the nut: Should have taken 5 minutes, but... I brought down two really small bits, approx. #50's?, and found that the chuck on my cordless drill wouldn't clamp down on such small drills. Charged up the compresser and then found my air drill wouldn't grab them either. Tried wrapping a drill bit with masking tape very evenly so the drill motor would grab it. Success!
6. Safety wired the pickup: Re-safety wired it several times until it was perfect. (15 minutes.)
7. Mixed proseal and installed plate onto tank: Made another run accross the field to buy 24 new stainless screws for reassembly. Tightened it up and installed the drain valve.
As you can see the job could be done fairly quickly if it was better planned out. I'm guessing 2 hours is realistic per tank.
Now, for what it's worth the side I did was tight. However, the fuel line on the outside of the tank was not. It was to tight to come off with only fingers, but the wrench practically fell under its own weight loosening the fitting. I know for sure that these were tight because when fueling the plane for the first time I had not tightened one of these and had a leak. I remember clearly tightening the leaking one and correcting the other at that time also. So it seems there is something to this service bulletin. My plane has 253 hours and it apeares that vibration was having an effect on the fuel line attachments.
Hoping this account of my bumbling helps,
I've completed the service bulletin on the first tank, but have the other to do this weekend. Total time for me to do this one was about 4 hours. Much of this time was spent looking for tools or little glitches that could be prevented with a little better planning. What I learned from the first was:
1. Pull the plane outside of the hanger if able to drain the tanks. After removing the drain the gas is coming out and will spill on the floor before you can get your finger over the hole in the bottom of the wing. Each time you switch gas cans and the funnel more will leak while you put your finger over the hole and remove it. By the time the tanks are drained the floor of the hanger where you'll be working smells strongly of gas and is terrible to work around. (20 minutes plus to drain a full tank into 4 cans)
2. Removing wing root fairing (10 minutes)
3. Removing screws on access plate (1 hour) I had a heck of a time until settling on a 1/4" ratchet with a 1/4" socket and a new phillips tip. Everything basically went smooth from there.
4. Removing the plate: I simply couldn't get anything between the plate and the rib to get a starting point. I tried a hacksaw blade thinned out on the end on the bench sander and broke it trying to get between the plate and rib. Then tried a feeler guage which just bent. Then tried a screwdriver but it seemed like it would just ruin the plate and rib so this was abandened. At this point I went to the local A&P and asked him if he thought that I would blow myself up if a heat gun was used to soften up the proseal. He told me to be careful and it should be okay with no open flames. This along with a putty knive that was thinned out on the bench sander finally got through. From there it took about 5 more minutes to get everything apart.
(1 and 1/2 hours, but could have been 10 minutes if starting with the heat gun)
5. Drilling the nut: Should have taken 5 minutes, but... I brought down two really small bits, approx. #50's?, and found that the chuck on my cordless drill wouldn't clamp down on such small drills. Charged up the compresser and then found my air drill wouldn't grab them either. Tried wrapping a drill bit with masking tape very evenly so the drill motor would grab it. Success!
6. Safety wired the pickup: Re-safety wired it several times until it was perfect. (15 minutes.)
7. Mixed proseal and installed plate onto tank: Made another run accross the field to buy 24 new stainless screws for reassembly. Tightened it up and installed the drain valve.
As you can see the job could be done fairly quickly if it was better planned out. I'm guessing 2 hours is realistic per tank.
Now, for what it's worth the side I did was tight. However, the fuel line on the outside of the tank was not. It was to tight to come off with only fingers, but the wrench practically fell under its own weight loosening the fitting. I know for sure that these were tight because when fueling the plane for the first time I had not tightened one of these and had a leak. I remember clearly tightening the leaking one and correcting the other at that time also. So it seems there is something to this service bulletin. My plane has 253 hours and it apeares that vibration was having an effect on the fuel line attachments.
Hoping this account of my bumbling helps,
Bryan,
Thanks for the description and the times. Sounds like your other tank will go much faster.
Do you (or anyone else) have a more detailed description of the actual drilling? Pictures would be nice also. Since no one is talking about it, it must be a no-brainer. But, I am having trouble figuring out just where/how to drill the nut for the safety wire. Do you drill toward the fitting end (what about the threads)? Do you drill toward the fuel tube end (what about the compression sleeve)? Do you drill in the middle of the flat spot or closer to the edge toward the other flat spot you are drilling towards?
Thanks,
Thanks for the description and the times. Sounds like your other tank will go much faster.
Do you (or anyone else) have a more detailed description of the actual drilling? Pictures would be nice also. Since no one is talking about it, it must be a no-brainer. But, I am having trouble figuring out just where/how to drill the nut for the safety wire. Do you drill toward the fitting end (what about the threads)? Do you drill toward the fuel tube end (what about the compression sleeve)? Do you drill in the middle of the flat spot or closer to the edge toward the other flat spot you are drilling towards?
Thanks,
Bryan Wood
Well Known Member
Tony,
I finished the 2nd tank today. Here is a blurry photo of the fitting after being safety wired. A #30 hole was drilled thru the anti rotation bracket for the wire to pass thru which is slightly different from the plans, but it helped to get the wire good and snug. Sorry the photo is blurry, but once the thing was back together there was no second chance to take a better picture. After the picture I used a razor blade and got the bead of old proseal off and then added the new. Total time = 2 hours and 15 minutes.
Regards,
I finished the 2nd tank today. Here is a blurry photo of the fitting after being safety wired. A #30 hole was drilled thru the anti rotation bracket for the wire to pass thru which is slightly different from the plans, but it helped to get the wire good and snug. Sorry the photo is blurry, but once the thing was back together there was no second chance to take a better picture. After the picture I used a razor blade and got the bead of old proseal off and then added the new. Total time = 2 hours and 15 minutes.
Regards,
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Kyle Boatright
Well Known Member
I completed part of the SB today. I got the tanks drained and pulled the wing root fairings in no time at all. In draining the tanks, I simply pulled off the fuel drains and let the fuel pour into a funnel and a 5 gallon can. I don't think I spilled any at all. Very easy.
I have a little ratcheting screwdriver I purchased at SNF a couple of years ago that came in very handy in pulling the phillips screws out of the access plate. No problems with stripped screws, which was what I feared most. Probably 20 minutes to remove the screws on one access cover.
The problem I had was cutting the proseal with a sharpened putty knife. Actually, the putty knife worked well, but the putty knives I have are not long enough. Mine probably have 6" long blades and it would take an 8" blade (at least) to reach the aft end of the access plate. The problem is/was that the only real access is to the side of the plate that is closest to the leading edge. The top and bottom are blocked by rib flanges, and the aft part is obstructed by the spar.
Fortunately, I had some .032 aluminum and some duct tape at the hangar, so I fabricated a 2" wide by 10" long piece of .032 and sharpened one end. The duct tape was layered on the other edges so I could push on it without cutting myself. Not as easy to work with as the putty knife, but it did the job. I'd say cutting through the proseal on one tank took roughly an hour, including tool fabrication.
I'm not sure I should be happy or sad about what I found inside the tank. I had prosealed the nut on the fuel pick-up, so there is/was no way it would have come loose. This leaves me with two dilemmas going forward:
1) Should I even mess with the pick-up since it is well secured? I could leave it as is, or I could make the modification per the SB. I figure "in for a penny, in for a pound", so I'll probably drill the hole, and do the safety wire thing.
2) Should I bother with the other tank? I think so...
It'll be interesting to see how clean I can get the access cover. That should be a piece of cake compared to cleaning the end-rib down in the hole between the wing and fuselage.
By the way, I found it easiest to work from under the airplane on 99% of this job. If you have a camping pad or an old matress pad, it might be worth dragging it to the airport to lie on...
I have a little ratcheting screwdriver I purchased at SNF a couple of years ago that came in very handy in pulling the phillips screws out of the access plate. No problems with stripped screws, which was what I feared most. Probably 20 minutes to remove the screws on one access cover.
The problem I had was cutting the proseal with a sharpened putty knife. Actually, the putty knife worked well, but the putty knives I have are not long enough. Mine probably have 6" long blades and it would take an 8" blade (at least) to reach the aft end of the access plate. The problem is/was that the only real access is to the side of the plate that is closest to the leading edge. The top and bottom are blocked by rib flanges, and the aft part is obstructed by the spar.
Fortunately, I had some .032 aluminum and some duct tape at the hangar, so I fabricated a 2" wide by 10" long piece of .032 and sharpened one end. The duct tape was layered on the other edges so I could push on it without cutting myself. Not as easy to work with as the putty knife, but it did the job. I'd say cutting through the proseal on one tank took roughly an hour, including tool fabrication.
I'm not sure I should be happy or sad about what I found inside the tank. I had prosealed the nut on the fuel pick-up, so there is/was no way it would have come loose. This leaves me with two dilemmas going forward:
1) Should I even mess with the pick-up since it is well secured? I could leave it as is, or I could make the modification per the SB. I figure "in for a penny, in for a pound", so I'll probably drill the hole, and do the safety wire thing.
2) Should I bother with the other tank? I think so...
It'll be interesting to see how clean I can get the access cover. That should be a piece of cake compared to cleaning the end-rib down in the hole between the wing and fuselage.
By the way, I found it easiest to work from under the airplane on 99% of this job. If you have a camping pad or an old matress pad, it might be worth dragging it to the airport to lie on...
Tony Partain
Well Known Member
Right Tank
Today I did the SB on my right tank. The nut was not as tight as it should have been. I couldn't turn it with my fingers but just putting the wrench on it made it turn instantly. I can honstly say I can't remember checking this during the build process. Total time for the right tank 4 hours. The left tank should go much faster part of the time was setting up an automotive fuel pump to transfer the fuel from one tank to another. Cost for the pump $35 at Napa. 20 feet of rubber fuel line $20. Plus one small Proseal $7.40.
I think that Vans made the right choice on this one. Better safe than sorry.
Today I did the SB on my right tank. The nut was not as tight as it should have been. I couldn't turn it with my fingers but just putting the wrench on it made it turn instantly. I can honstly say I can't remember checking this during the build process. Total time for the right tank 4 hours. The left tank should go much faster part of the time was setting up an automotive fuel pump to transfer the fuel from one tank to another. Cost for the pump $35 at Napa. 20 feet of rubber fuel line $20. Plus one small Proseal $7.40.
I think that Vans made the right choice on this one. Better safe than sorry.
airtime
Member
SB - right tank
Since I was just finishing the condition inspection and had re-installed the wing root fairing two days before the SB I was favoring the "I've flown it 300 hrs without a problem" approach. But I just couldn't rememeber tightening the fitting. I have QB wings and I rememeber pulling the plate to check the anti-rotation bracket during the building process but I just didn't rememeber putting a wrench to the fitting. I couldn't imagine that I didn't but just couldn't recall.
I finally decided today it would be easier to just check a wing than continue with the mental masterbation. It was too windy to fly and after 6 weeks down what's another week.
Disassembly took 30-40 minutes. To say the fitting was "finger tight" would be a slight exageration. I could actually tighten it slightly by hand. I was surprised to say the least.
I will promptly pull the other side tomorrow, order some proseal for reassembly, and proceed to eat crow for my ranting about this with fellow RVers at the airport this past week.
Rob Herndon - Nampa, Idaho RV6 223RH
Since I was just finishing the condition inspection and had re-installed the wing root fairing two days before the SB I was favoring the "I've flown it 300 hrs without a problem" approach. But I just couldn't rememeber tightening the fitting. I have QB wings and I rememeber pulling the plate to check the anti-rotation bracket during the building process but I just didn't rememeber putting a wrench to the fitting. I couldn't imagine that I didn't but just couldn't recall.
I finally decided today it would be easier to just check a wing than continue with the mental masterbation. It was too windy to fly and after 6 weeks down what's another week.
Disassembly took 30-40 minutes. To say the fitting was "finger tight" would be a slight exageration. I could actually tighten it slightly by hand. I was surprised to say the least.
I will promptly pull the other side tomorrow, order some proseal for reassembly, and proceed to eat crow for my ranting about this with fellow RVers at the airport this past week.
Rob Herndon - Nampa, Idaho RV6 223RH
Tony Partain
Well Known Member
Yes it's a QB. I kept thinking back to last summer trying to remember if I had taken the plates off or if I just put the sending units in. Couldn't remember. My best guess is that I didn't take them off.
Sunriver is a great place. By air its only 12 miles to my house. Last week I flew over to Wally Anderson's Synergy Air and stopped at Sunriver for lunch on the return flight. What a great place, good food, fantastic service and a very cool lodge. They have three golf course's that are world class. I can't wait for summer!
Sunriver is a great place. By air its only 12 miles to my house. Last week I flew over to Wally Anderson's Synergy Air and stopped at Sunriver for lunch on the return flight. What a great place, good food, fantastic service and a very cool lodge. They have three golf course's that are world class. I can't wait for summer!
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airtime
Member
SB - left tank
Pulled the left side today. Fitting could be unthreaded by hand.
I can only assume when I checked the QB wing for the anti-rotation bracket
I failed to tighten the nut. My confidence is not running high today.
I guess I'm grateful I used the cork and rubber gasket last time. I just hope
there's no next time, I have them gooped on well this time.
Rob H - Nampa, Idaho
Pulled the left side today. Fitting could be unthreaded by hand.
I can only assume when I checked the QB wing for the anti-rotation bracket
I failed to tighten the nut. My confidence is not running high today.
I guess I'm grateful I used the cork and rubber gasket last time. I just hope
there's no next time, I have them gooped on well this time.
Rob H - Nampa, Idaho
SB Pick up Poll
Started and almost finished today after flying this morning.
I marked "loose" because I was able to put at least half a turn on each B-nut before the were tight. Additionally, both vent tube lines connecting to inboard rib took half a turn to be tight.
I pulled both tanks to do the job, which made it relatively easy. It has taken about 3 hours (which included lots of coffee drinking and thinking) so far. A fellow DVT RVer helped with first side removal. All that is left is to reinstall the tanks (about another hour).
I'm glad I made the effort!
Larry
RV6AQB 375hrs
176A
Started and almost finished today after flying this morning.
I marked "loose" because I was able to put at least half a turn on each B-nut before the were tight. Additionally, both vent tube lines connecting to inboard rib took half a turn to be tight.
I pulled both tanks to do the job, which made it relatively easy. It has taken about 3 hours (which included lots of coffee drinking and thinking) so far. A fellow DVT RVer helped with first side removal. All that is left is to reinstall the tanks (about another hour).
I'm glad I made the effort!
Larry
RV6AQB 375hrs
176A
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fuel pickup tube B nut
I pulled both tanks off Saturday, and today with the help of DAR Tim Mahoney, I installed the anti-rotation brackets to both tank tubes, safetytied the B nuts, and prosealed the whole works. All fittings were tight when I tore it all apart, but I now feel very sure that nothing will ever come loose. I figure it will have taken 8 to 10 hours to complete the {fix} when the tanks are reinstalled.
I was real reluctant to unscrew 64 or 65 screws per tank, wondering how the paint would crack. But, after the first few, I gained confidence, and every thing worked out fine.
I will use stainless steel screws to install the tanks. I think they will look cool.
Dale
565DM
I pulled both tanks off Saturday, and today with the help of DAR Tim Mahoney, I installed the anti-rotation brackets to both tank tubes, safetytied the B nuts, and prosealed the whole works. All fittings were tight when I tore it all apart, but I now feel very sure that nothing will ever come loose. I figure it will have taken 8 to 10 hours to complete the {fix} when the tanks are reinstalled.
I was real reluctant to unscrew 64 or 65 screws per tank, wondering how the paint would crack. But, after the first few, I gained confidence, and every thing worked out fine.
I will use stainless steel screws to install the tanks. I think they will look cool.
Dale
565DM
Yup! Mine is a Quickbuild
I was probably the first guy to check in with a loose nut?!?!? but I didn't bother noting that it was a QB. I have drilled the nut and the anti-rotation bracket but will probably not do the weird and wonderfull lockwiring pattern shown in the AD. Jeez! There are easier ways than that. I will do it like I do my sump drain, oil pressure regulator, or gascolator drain.
The guy who designed the AD lockwiring pattern must have stock in the Stainless Wire Company!? We are just trying to keep the nut from rotating (backing off) one way here.
Cheers, Pete
I was probably the first guy to check in with a loose nut?!?!? but I didn't bother noting that it was a QB. I have drilled the nut and the anti-rotation bracket but will probably not do the weird and wonderfull lockwiring pattern shown in the AD. Jeez! There are easier ways than that. I will do it like I do my sump drain, oil pressure regulator, or gascolator drain.
The guy who designed the AD lockwiring pattern must have stock in the Stainless Wire Company!? We are just trying to keep the nut from rotating (backing off) one way here.
Cheers, Pete
Fuel Pick-up QB and Safety wire proc
I completed my modification last night and found something QB owners might want to check. I checked the location of the pick-up tube prior to removing it and found that the tube was almost 1" from the bottom of the tank. I checked the plans and it clearly stated that it should be on the bottom. A few slight bends an both are on the bottom and just inside the drain hole. One thing I did change was the way the plans had shown the safety wire. I drilled a small hole in the anti-rotation bracket then wired off to that. A much more professional proceedure and tighter. Never a chance of backing off.
I completed my modification last night and found something QB owners might want to check. I checked the location of the pick-up tube prior to removing it and found that the tube was almost 1" from the bottom of the tank. I checked the plans and it clearly stated that it should be on the bottom. A few slight bends an both are on the bottom and just inside the drain hole. One thing I did change was the way the plans had shown the safety wire. I drilled a small hole in the anti-rotation bracket then wired off to that. A much more professional proceedure and tighter. Never a chance of backing off.
Walt
Well Known Member
I did mine the other day while the plane is grounded anyway...
Not because I was worried about them as I prosealed them when I installed them the first time but it was an opportunity that "made" me go in the tank to check the pick up finger screens which is something I've been wanting to do but could never quite muster the ambititon. Everything was fine, no debris at all in the screens and so I went ahead and verified the fitting were still tight and then safetied them up. I also drilled a hole in the rotation bracket rather than use the fitting to wrap the wire to. I used proseal to install the plate the first time and they were a bear to get off but once you get them started it's not to bad. The plane has been grounded for 2 weeks now doing the nose gear mod (shorten front leg and install new fork) which I really wanted to do (been waiting on Langair machine to return my leg for a week and a half now). The NLG mod and trimming up the nose gear fairing will provide at least another inch of ground clearance on the front. This in my opinion is much more of a necessity for us nose draggers than the fuel mod, but while she was out of service anyway I figured it was a good time to do all the little things. Plus god forbid something happens the plane is now in "compliance" with all Van's SB's.
Not because I was worried about them as I prosealed them when I installed them the first time but it was an opportunity that "made" me go in the tank to check the pick up finger screens which is something I've been wanting to do but could never quite muster the ambititon. Everything was fine, no debris at all in the screens and so I went ahead and verified the fitting were still tight and then safetied them up. I also drilled a hole in the rotation bracket rather than use the fitting to wrap the wire to. I used proseal to install the plate the first time and they were a bear to get off but once you get them started it's not to bad. The plane has been grounded for 2 weeks now doing the nose gear mod (shorten front leg and install new fork) which I really wanted to do (been waiting on Langair machine to return my leg for a week and a half now). The NLG mod and trimming up the nose gear fairing will provide at least another inch of ground clearance on the front. This in my opinion is much more of a necessity for us nose draggers than the fuel mod, but while she was out of service anyway I figured it was a good time to do all the little things. Plus god forbid something happens the plane is now in "compliance" with all Van's SB's.
akarmy
Well Known Member
walter said:
Well, I dove in today and fixed up my tanks to comply with the SB.
First, it took 7 hours to do both tanks, including drainging 7 gallons of gas, removing the intersection fairings and reinstalling everything.
I'll give some of the rest of you a bit more detail as I sure wanted some before I started... Tools required. 1 stiff and 1 flexable 1 1/4" putty knives. a 1/2" x 3/4" block of hardwood. Hammer, 3/8" short handled socket set with 1/4" socket. Short phillips ACR bit to go in the 1/4" socket. Make sure the ratchet has a smooth top (mine has the release button on the back) so you can apply pressure with one hand while turning it. Waggner heat gun.
Using the ratchet all of the screws came out with no trouble at all. Very easy overall. So now my confidence is high... Hum, how to get the putty knife started... There is only one location that you can get it started, that's the lower front section. Everywhere else has too large of a flange on the edge of the tanks (at least on the RV9 tanks). A little heat and a lot of pushing with the flexable knife got it started. Now others have said to slice through the proseal. That works for about 2" in each direction, then your knife bottoms out and there is no other way to get leverage on it.
After lots of head scratching I finally started prying on the access cover with my stiff putty knife. By applying heat, and simply prying up and outward it started to let loose. I pryed the first side that I had access to out enough to fit the 3/4" block of oak in place and hold it open. Then moving the knife and prying more with more heat the rest of the flange let go.
By now I figured I would have a taco from all the force needed to get it free, but the plate is still flat and unbent after the event. All my connections were still tight just as the day I built it... 450hrs and 3 years of flying. I drilled them and drilled the corner of the anti-rotation bracket as others have. Next was to clean up the proseal. Scraping with the putty knife and an exacto knife got most of it off, then some red scotch brite took the rest off nicely. Once the plate is done, then you need to clean the tank flange, bit harder, but not bad compared to what you've already done by now.
I got the single serving proseal from Vans so I would have a new batch. You simply mix it in the can it comes in. They have that down perfect as it was just enough with about a marble sized drop left when finished. Proseal on both the flange of the tank and the access cover, put it in place and put a touch of proseal on each screw as they get started. I used all new screws (just the same #8 screws) They were easy to get in place using the same ratchet.
All in all it was not that bad, but was the worst thing I've had to do since I started flying my 9A 3 years ago. Oh well... Good times! Now... How long does that proseal need to cure before filling those tanks?
Good luck with yours...
Static Sparking
The SB requires draining the tanks. Falling fuel generates a static charge. Has anyone mentioned that you can set your airplane on fire by draining fuel without considering static electricity?
We all use plastic gas cans, so do yourself a favor. Obtain a large STEEL funnel. Attach three stranded copper wires at two points with pop rivets or screws/nuts. The first is attached to the inside of the small end of the funnel. Make it about 18" long and bare the last 6". This one goes inside the gas can you are filling to submerge in the fuel. The other two wires attach to the upper lip of the funnel and get alligator clips on the ends. One is maybe 2 feet long, the other as much as 6 or 8 feet. The first clips to a good airframe ground. The other clips to an earth ground, which can be a well-buried steel tiedown if nothing else.
Dan
The SB requires draining the tanks. Falling fuel generates a static charge. Has anyone mentioned that you can set your airplane on fire by draining fuel without considering static electricity?
We all use plastic gas cans, so do yourself a favor. Obtain a large STEEL funnel. Attach three stranded copper wires at two points with pop rivets or screws/nuts. The first is attached to the inside of the small end of the funnel. Make it about 18" long and bare the last 6". This one goes inside the gas can you are filling to submerge in the fuel. The other two wires attach to the upper lip of the funnel and get alligator clips on the ends. One is maybe 2 feet long, the other as much as 6 or 8 feet. The first clips to a good airframe ground. The other clips to an earth ground, which can be a well-buried steel tiedown if nothing else.
Dan
grahamcalder
Member
It took an A&P 6 hrs to do both.kevinh said:
Cost UK ? 280.00
Benefit : peace of mind (I did not build the A/C)
G Calder
Tony Partain
Well Known Member
Static electricity
Would there be a static problem if you used a 12 volt auto fuel pump (Facet)hooked to an external battery with a rubber hose on each end to transfer fuel from one wing tank to another?
Would there be a static problem if you used a 12 volt auto fuel pump (Facet)hooked to an external battery with a rubber hose on each end to transfer fuel from one wing tank to another?
