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ADS-B In with Dynon 470 box and TFR displayed

NinerBikes

Well Known Member
We have had a local TFR for a fire in effect near the local airport for a week now. The airspace is rather complicated with Class C from KBUR with commercial flights, KVNY west of us 5 miles, and a surface to 070 TFR north of us in effect from the Saddleridge fire here in Los Angeles as well as the 30 mile Mode C veil of airspace around LAX.


Am I correct in understanding, that the Dynon SV 470 ADS-B In receiver and delta wing anntenna, while also showing "TIS Info available" with aircraft on the screen with orange lines, direction and altitude above or below us based on ground signals, should also alert us of NOTAMS and TFR's too, in red, as it does for sporting events at the Rose Bowl, purple lines for controlled B, C and D class airspace, as well as cloud covered areas?

Asking for a friend, as it's his RV-12 not mine, but from what I am reading on Dynon's website, it should be there? Is there a setting that we are missing that activates that stuff showing on the screen, somewhere in the menu, that needs to be changed?

In particular with ADS-B in, and TFRs as well as weather in the form of squalls and cloud cover density, is to be received and show up on the screen?

NOTAM TFR 9/6361 is the event, it's not showing on screen.
 
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"From page 7-26

Map Items on Charts

To reduce visual clutter on charts, map items from SkyView’s databases will only appear on top of a chart in some circumstances. Traffic, user waypoints and terrain warning colors will always appear on charts. Obstacles will be drawn in yellow and red on the charts when the aircraft altitude is within the warning range and flight plans will appear when Active.

With an SV-ADSB470/472 installed, TFRs appear on the charts.

Pilots can still select items for more information by selecting them with the map pointer (airports, airspaces, navaids, etc.) Weather is drawn on top of the charts when the WEATHER button is selected in the LAYERS menu."

Am I correct, then, in assuming that since we have the SV-ADSB470 installed, that, by default, TFR's should appear on the chart? There is no setting for this?

Or is "weather" "WX" tab required to be activated as well as "Local Airports" to get TFR's to show up? We see events like an orange donut around the Rosebowl, any time we fly even near it, but no TFR red area showed up for the fire area today? Is it something the Fire Dept needs to activate, or FAA, or the local airports, or who, that it shows up

The TFR did NOT show up today on the EFIS...

"TIS is Active" did show up on the screen, as well as numerous aircraft today, at least 15 planes and 7 helicopters in 35 minutes of flying time.

Sorry in advance, if I am having a comprehension problem with the owner's manual. I am not certain what all info wise that delta antenna receives or sends on the fuselage, the little stubby 3" 980 mhz antenna just behind the front cowling does and what info, if any is received on the GPS 2020 / mode C antenna, if it only transmits GPS signals out?
 
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So, If I am receiving traffic, my ADSB In antenna and 470 are performing properly? Should I be receiving more than just "TIS Info Available" in the black box in the lower right hand side of the screen? We have never seen a "ADSB OK" show up, just "TIS info Available"

Nor have I ever seen the "ADSB STATUS RECEIVING" Box.

Suggestions on what might be the cause of this?
 
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Looks like a call to Dynon Technical Support is required with some walk through while "live" to get this unit up to snuff, one on one. Will post up results, hopefully, once it's resolved.
 
So, If I am receiving traffic, my ADSB In antenna and 470 are performing properly? Should I be receiving more than just "TIS Info Available" in the black box in the lower right hand side of the screen? We have never seen a "ADSB OK" show up, just "TIS info Available"

Nor have I ever seen the "ADSB STATUS RECEIVING" Box.

Suggestions on what might be the cause of this?

The "ADSB STATUS" box should display when the WEATHER layer is on.
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I see the "ADSB OK" message when with range of an ADSB ground station and also within range of ATC radar. I have seen "TIS INFO" message but rarely, perhaps that displays when out of range of a ADSB ground station.

Some things to think about and possibly discuss at your call to Dynon. I learn from these questions so please follow-up with your findings.
 
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OK, we will first try the "WX " switch highlighted and turned on, first, and see what we get.

Hopefully, that gets us somewhere.
 
Page 7-86, I think, has the answer.

Individual Airport METARs / TAFs / Winds Aloft Forecast


"When METAR and/or TAF and/or Winds Aloft Forecast weather reports are available for an
airport, they are accessed by selecting the WX tab the INFO window for that airport. Those
reports can also be displayed as colored icons for the airport icons on the moving map and in
the nearest window (MAP > MAP MENU > WEATHER OPTIONS > METAR ICONS).
Alternatively, pressing INFO when the list of NRST WX is being shown will also bring you directly
to the WX tab of the airport’s INFO PAGE.
Depending on the setting chosen in MAIN MENU > MAP > MAP MENU > WEATHER OPTIONS >
METAR/TAF TEXT, the METARs and TAFs on the WX page can be in raw or decoded form:"
 
Page 7-86, I think, has the answer.

Individual Airport METARs / TAFs / Winds Aloft Forecast


"When METAR and/or TAF and/or Winds Aloft Forecast weather reports are available for an
airport, they are accessed by selecting the WX tab the INFO window for that airport. Those
reports can also be displayed as colored icons for the airport icons on the moving map and in
the nearest window (MAP > MAP MENU > WEATHER OPTIONS > METAR ICONS).
Alternatively, pressing INFO when the list of NRST WX is being shown will also bring you directly
to the WX tab of the airport?s INFO PAGE.
Depending on the setting chosen in MAIN MENU > MAP > MAP MENU > WEATHER OPTIONS >
METAR/TAF TEXT, the METARs and TAFs on the WX page can be in raw or decoded form:"

There is no "WEATHER OPTIONS" that comes up or shows in MAP> MAP MENU on his screen this morning.

There is also no WX tab for INFO at the airport we are at, KWHP.


Very frustrating.
 
So based on the above info, and the info in your Post #6 ("We have never seen a "ADSB OK" show up, just "TIS info Available" Nor have I ever seen the "ADSB STATUS RECEIVING" Box."), it appears that the SV is not seeing the -470.

The first thing to do is the "Post Installation Checks" on page 14-11 of the "System Installation Guide", to check that the -470 is communicating with the SV.

If not, check the -470's configuration details on page 14-1 of the "System Installation Guide".

Also see the bottom of page 14-10 and the top of 14-11, "SV-ADSB-470 Related SkyView Display Settings", to check the -470s serial port configuration.

Otherwise, the -470 is either failed, a fuse has blown, or some connections are problematic.

Doesn't make sense, how would "TIS AVAILABLE" and orange lines of planes be showing up on the MAP, and their elevation above or below us in 100's of ft? Isn't that only available with ADS B In? Or is that from the GPS 2020 or Xpander 261 ?
 
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I agree with Carl.

You also need to check your transponder configuration. The SV-261 has a configuration value for ADSB In. This parameter is transmitted to the FAA. If you are the only aircraft in that ADSB tower?s area, it has the potential for the FAA not to transmit data to you. In which case, you will only receive TIS data from your transponder.

You can choose None, 1090ES, UAT 978, or both. Both would be the proper value for the 472. UAT 978 would be the proper choice for the 470. A betting person might think that it may be set to None at the moment based upon your comments.

I have AFS screens, but I do have both the 261 and 472. The AFS manual has very verbose instructions on how to configure and test both weather and traffic features of these units. While I haven?t read the Dynon manual, I would suspect as Carl has suggested, it would have identical text in their manual.

Without reading the manuals, learning how the gear is supposed to work, and knowing how it?s exactly configured, your frustration will continue.
 
From the System Installation Guide:

"SkyView has the ability to receive and display aircraft traffic data from:
? Dynon Avionics SV-XPNDR-261/262 (from TIS)
? Dynon Avionics SV-ADSB-470/472/472 (from ADS-B)"​

If you don't want to do those simple troubleshooting steps, or bother to look through the on-line Dynon manuals, well ...

Thank you for your assistance.

It's not my bird, and the owner doesn't want to look up that stuff or read it. He's an old stick and rudder pilot at 73, from the 6 pack days, that was also an AP for a living. Electronics and computerized stuff is not his forte. Nor do I have access to the plane , hangar locks or card for the security gate to get it to solve the problem. I'd like to help him solve the problem, but you might have noticed, I don't have the problem, he does. I'm just trying to help, he understands next to nothing about ADSB out and ADSB in. Just that he has to have it for 2020 to fly in class D, C or B airspace. If I didn't update his EFIS monthly for him, it would never get done.
 
I agree with Carl.

You also need to check your transponder configuration. The SV-261 has a configuration value for ADSB In. This parameter is transmitted to the FAA. If you are the only aircraft in that ADSB tower’s area, it has the potential for the FAA not to transmit data to you. In which case, you will only receive TIS data from your transponder.

You can choose None, 1090ES, UAT 978, or both. Both would be the proper value for the 472. UAT 978 would be the proper choice for the 470. A betting person might think that it may be set to None at the moment based upon your comments.
You
I have AFS screens, but I do have both the 261 and 472. The AFS manual has very verbose instructions on how to configure and test both weather and traffic features of these units. While I haven’t read the Dynon manual, I would suspect as Carl has suggested, it would have identical text in their manual.

Without reading the manuals, learning how the gear is supposed to work, and knowing how it’s exactly configured, your frustration will continue.

Thank you for this valuable tip, I hope it solves the problem.

I will check the settings for None, 1090ES UAT 978 or BOTH.

Maybe I should just call Dynon, instead of attempting troubleshooting here.

You'd think by now, that the EFIS would be able to sense the configuration options on boot up, of what devices are there, hand shake with authentication packets going both ways, like on a canbus system, and communicate with them. But no, it's still like windows 98 OS laptop computer is with setting up a wireless access point with a Wireless Access Point card. That was 20 years ago, mind you.
 
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Understand. It's great that you're trying to help him. Maybe the next time you update the Aviation databases for him, you can sneak a peek at the -470 setup and the Transponder setup that Bob mentioned. Wouldn't take much time.

As you know, he should ask for a PAPR report to make sure his Dynon ADS-B OUT transponder is working correctly. You can actually do that, knowing the correct info to input into the form:

https://adsbperformance.faa.gov/PAPRRequest.aspx

ADS-B OUT will not be required in Class D beginning 1/1/2020. In addition to the other airspace you mentioned above, he will need ADS-B OUT in the 30nm Class B veil, above 10,000 ft MSL, above Class B and Class C airspace, and in some Class E airspace over the Gulf of Mexico.

Here is a post that nicely summarizes exactly where ADS-B OUT will be required come 1/1/2020:

http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showpost.php?p=1378469&postcount=23

Just to be clear, ADS-B IN will not be required.

We need it... we are within 30nm Class B veil of LAX and 4 miles out from BUR Class C, at WHP, where it is hangered. VNY is 5 miles west of us, too. Add in a fire recently closing down airspace right at runway 12 at WHP where we need to land with a TFR that didn't show on the map, and it's very, very complex airspace with natural mountain range barriers near by too.

I'm just a friend and a student that would like to learn to fly at age 61, by getting my sport pilot license.
 
Talked with Dynon tech support today.

Found a few things wrong.

Serial port 3 was ported up to a Garmin SL40 radio, since changed, now, to the correct Garmin GTR-200. Possible error due to the timeline that friend got the whole Dynon package from VAN's, or a bit of confusion as to what radio he really got.

Serial port 4 was connected to the GPS 2020 antenna.

Serial port 5 was connected up to the Xpnder 261.

Inside the programming for the Xpnder 261 was found that the 470 ADSB IN was set for the 1080 mhz frequency, when it needed the 981 mhz frequency. I fixed that earlier this morning and corrected it to just the single frequency of 981 mhz.

In doing a further search under the 470, it was found that a yellow section was lighting up, and that the Xpnder 261 needed a software update to something more current. Evidently, it is something that has to be done manually, everything was there to do it. So, the software for the Xpnder 261 is now current.

Will test now to see if "WX" appears as a tab under the airport, and will see next flight if we can activate the WX so that ADSB In now functions, and we get TIF and weather reports.

Fortunately, the local TFR was lifted, so we can get in and out of KWHP through the local Newhall pass. Unfortunately, we didn't get the settings done in time to verify that it works on the MAP screen. Hope to find out soon enough, if we fly with a day where there's some cloud cover, after a storm.

Moral of the story is that unless you are a computer hardware and software guru and know still about serial port set ups, frequencies, and are current with all the EFIS changes and how ADSB, Squidders, Xpnder 261's and all the other connections work, your best bet is to just call up Dynon Technical Support and have them walk you through all the tests. There's a tremendous amount of system knowledge you'd have to have to trouble shoot this stuff.

Special thanks to all who tried to help, we got most of the bits of it right before finding out about the required manual software update for the xpnder 261, to make it all work.
 
In addition, there is always the Read Me help file and Dynon Sky View Settings files in the downloads section of the Van's web site.

https://www.vansaircraft.com/downloads/#RV-12-12iS

I believe that loading the settings file takes care of a lot of the system configuration for you, and following through the read me file step by step will help with the rest that has to be manually configured.
 
Latest in the puzzle, with still not getting ADSB In was checking the serial ports in setup. The 470 was not showing up, and serial ports 3,4 and 5 were showing as XPNDER 261, ADHARS, and GPS-2020. I opened up serial port 2 and selected the 470 ADSB In. That finally got the local fire TFR showing on the map.

We now have continuity. TFR does show up on the map as red for the Getty Fire in Los Angeles, after clicking on WX tab on top when on KWHP .

I still haven't seen the "WX" tab at the bottom of the screen as a feature to show it is activated and turned on, or an "ADSB IN OK" block showing up on the map. Will go in to "Layers" tab next to see what we can find..

Getting there, slowly but surely, bit by bit
 
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