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Normalizing Results

chazking

Well Known Member
Recognizing empirical data can have considerable variation given altitude, temperature, direction, etc., I have data that I'd like to normalize for comparison purposes. So, here's a go:

These two sets of data (same flight)

Pr Alt D Alt OAT GS IAS True Mag
6060 7881 66?F 158 151 353 358
6010 7820 66?F 194 153 264 269
6090 7905 66?F 173 151 173 179
6080 7844 66?F 148 154 083 089

Pr Alt D Alt OAT GS IAS True Mag
6090 7856 65?F 161 151 340 346
6000 7808 66?F 195 151 240 245
5980 7783 66?F 175 153 173 178
5920 7710 66?F 140 152 083 089

Using the GPS_Groundspeed_TAS spreadsheet with Mag, the results are

Vwind|Wind Dir|Vtrue
Kts | Deg | kts
24.2 | 70.1 | 169.1
28.3 | 70.6 | 167.9

But, I believe the difference in Alt (& DAlt) on each leg introduce an error(s) into the results.

How can the error be minimized or eliminated? (It's not a test! I need help as I have a bunch of this data; without rationalizing for the error(s) meaningful interpretation may not be possible).
 
Well, for starters, I'd say you did pretty well.
The single biggest issue is the wind. All of these calculations assume it is constant during the test. But compare the highest and lowest ground speeds in your two samples. Clearly the wind strength picked up from dataset 1 to dataset 2. If it was increasing during the time it took to get one data set that's hard (impossible, without assumptions) to calculate out. IMHO the best way to get the TAS when you've got 20 kt winds is to watch your ground track and ground speed on a gps while very slowly turning, to figure out when you are tracking directly into the wind. Note IAS and gps ground speed, and immediately do a 180, adjust pitch to get same IAS, note ground speed. Average ground speed then equals TAS. (note how close you come by averaging your highest and lowest groundspeeds from each set, even though you were not exactly into the wind).
To do better try again on a day when the wind is not so strong. If you have an autopilot use it (IAS should not vary. If it does you are climbing or descending). Use a program that will take gps ground track rather than magnetic heading (that's probably more accurate). And, scan the data for errors. For example, your first data set claims constant temperature, but shows DA at 6080 PA to be lower than DA at both 6060 and 6090 PA. That cannot be right.
 
I agree but with one difference, using ground track instead of magnetic heading. If you are truly into the wind and wind directly on a 2-direction average, then ground track and magnetic heading will be he same. If you are not directly into and/or with the wind, then using ground track will require a crab into the wind on every heading taken, which will lower your groundspeed based on the strength of the wind. So, some of your TAS will be wasted keeping you on a certain ground track.

Now, in real life, you are very seldom directly into or with the wind, and when you are going somewhere, you want to fly a ground track, not a magnetic heading. However, if you want to find out the actual speed of your airplane, using ground track on speed runs will give you a lower than actual average speed.
 
Jesse,

I think you misunderstood me. I suggested he use ground track as being slightly more accurate than magnetic heading, but that also requires that he use a program to calculate TAS that inputs ground track instead of heading.

I agree you cannot just swap one for the other.
 
I was suggesting he use magnetic heading instead of ground track because of the error induced by ground track.
 
I was suggesting he use magnetic heading instead of ground track because of the error induced by ground track.

What error?
If you do three runs on different headings and record ground speed and headings, you can calculate wind speed and direction, ground track, and true airspeed.

If you do three runs on different ground tracks and record ground speed and track, you can calculate wind speed and direction, heading, and true airspeed.

Different programs, off course. I was just suggesting that the gps ground track method might be more accurate than magnetic heading, especially since most autopilots will track gps ground track, and so yield better results. But I'd bet the difference in fact would be small between the two methods.
 
I am suggesting that ground speed would be higher when flying a heading versus a ground track because on all 3 tracks, you will be crabbing into the wind to maintain the ground track. Most efis-driven auto pilots can fly a heading or a track via the auto pilot. I would love for someone to give me data that refutes this, but if trying to get an accurate TAS by averages, I think heading is best.

As you suggested, if you calculate heading you can interpolate how much of your TAS is going to maintain your track and add that back into your TAS calculation.
 
I am suggesting that ground speed would be higher when flying a heading versus a ground track because on all 3 tracks, you will be crabbing into the wind to maintain the ground track. Most efis-driven auto pilots can fly a heading or a track via the auto pilot. I would love for someone to give me data that refutes this, but if trying to get an accurate TAS by averages, I think heading is best.

As you suggested, if you calculate heading you can interpolate how much of your TAS is going to maintain your track and add that back into your TAS calculation.

Suppose you are holding a heading of 350, and your gps shows a ground track of 340. Surely the ground speed does not change, depending on whether or not I concentrate on holding the heading, versus the ground track? I just meant to suggest that gps track data may be a bit more accurate than the magnetic heading. And certainly not average the data, but rather solve the algebraic equations (or use a spreadsheet which does) for TAS, wind, etc. This requires data runs in three different directions.

Edit. I understand what you meant - if you pick a number, say, 270, flying a heading of 270 will result in a higher ground speed than flying a ground track of 270 (except no difference if the wind is 90 or 270). But averaging is not good enough here, you need to calculate out the wind by flying a roughly triangular course.
 
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Altitudes

I took the actual heading and created a third set of numbers

Run 1 ? (A) DA 8000?
_________|Vwind | WDir | Vtrue
Vg | Track | Kts | Deg | Kts
161 | 359 | 25.1 | 70.0 | 170.6
194 | 270 | 23.8 | 72.0 | 171.4
173 | 170 | 22.7 | 69.0 | 170.1
148 | 084 | 24.6 | 67.0 | 171.7
_____Avg | 24.1 | 69.5 | 171.0

Run-2 (A) - DA 8000'
161 | 355 | 24.7 | 66.0 | 170.7
195 | 256 | 29.4 | 60.0 | 167.0
175 | 170 | 33.6 | 71.0 | 172.7
140 | 086 | 27.6 | 77.0 | 167.4
_____Avg | 28.8 | 68.3 | 169.4

Run 1 - TAS Spreadsheet M: 169.2 | T: 168.5 | A: 171.0
Run 2 - TAS Spreadsheet M: 167.1 | T: 167.0 | A: 169.4

The altitude for each of these legs varied (pressure & density). Is there a method to "normalize" this data to the same altitude & hence have results that are comparable to each other?
 
I took the actual heading and created a third set of numbers

Run 1 ? (A) DA 8000?
_________|Vwind | WDir | Vtrue
Vg | Track | Kts | Deg | Kts
161 | 359 | 25.1 | 70.0 | 170.6
194 | 270 | 23.8 | 72.0 | 171.4
173 | 170 | 22.7 | 69.0 | 170.1
148 | 084 | 24.6 | 67.0 | 171.7
_____Avg | 24.1 | 69.5 | 171.0

Run-2 (A) - DA 8000'
161 | 355 | 24.7 | 66.0 | 170.7
195 | 256 | 29.4 | 60.0 | 167.0
175 | 170 | 33.6 | 71.0 | 172.7
140 | 086 | 27.6 | 77.0 | 167.4
_____Avg | 28.8 | 68.3 | 169.4

Run 1 - TAS Spreadsheet M: 169.2 | T: 168.5 | A: 171.0
Run 2 - TAS Spreadsheet M: 167.1 | T: 167.0 | A: 169.4

The altitude for each of these legs varied (pressure & density). Is there a method to "normalize" this data to the same altitude & hence have results that are comparable to each other?


RV builder Doug Gray came up with a very nice method to calculate TAS using ground speeds and tracks from three legs. I showed his method to the National Test Pilot School, and they liked it so much they adopted it as one of their standard methods. They did come up with a very clever enhancement that uses data from four legs. The four leg method does four TAS calculations, ignoring data from a different leg each time. If the data is high quality, all four TAS calculations are similar. If the four TAS calculations differ, that tells you that at least one of the legs has suspect data. You don't know which leg is bad (or if maybe they are all bad), so you throw out all four legs.

I put this data in their spreadsheet, using the four leg option. It tells me that the first four legs have a standard deviation of 0.7 kt, which is acceptable. I shoot for 0.5 or lower myself, but anything less than 1 is OK. The second four legs have a standard deviation of 2.7 kt, so I would throw out that data, as it is not good quality.

You asked about normalizing data. The conditions at your two test points are so similar (the average DA is only about 70 ft lower for the second set of four legs) that the effect on TAS would be less than the typical error of the test technique. i.e. there is no point to worrying about normalizing when comparing two test points at such similar conditions.

Typically data would be normalized to standard temperature, a standard power, and standard weight. You need a large data set, implying many flights of data, to feed typical data analysis routines. I've done that sort of thing for my RV-8, because I do flight test for a living, and I enjoy it. But it was a lot of work, first to gather good quality data over many flights, then to analyze it, and finally to present it in a format suitable for my POH.

My general approach to speed vs power flight testing is to first determine ASI instrument error, then very carefully determine the airspeed system errors over a wide range of speeds, using a four leg method at each target IAS. Then, when doing cruise performance testing, I record IAS, pressure altitude, OAT, weight and the data to determine engine power - this is repeated at a range of powers at various altitudes. I do not do a multiple leg run at each speed, as it takes a huge amount of time for the speed to fully stabilize after the turn onto each new leg. Instead, I base everything on IAS, after correction for the errors in my airspeed system.

I then normalize each speed vs power point to sea level, standard temperature and standard weight, plot and draw a line through the sea of test points. That line is declared as the average performance, and I expand it to give predicted performance at other altitudes, weights and temperatures. When I'm on a cross country flight I often compare the TAS against the values predicted in my POH, and I'm usually within a kt once I apply the known corrections for the errors in my airspeed system.
 
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