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Windshield installation

B

bob888

Well Known Member
I'm debating whether to lay a strip of glass over the joint around sides and top of windshield vs just fill irregularities with micro. I seem to have good adhesion and most of the gap is filled with the Lord adhesive. Anyone have opinions about this? Is it just belt and suspenders type thing?
 
bob888 said:
I'm debating whether to lay a strip of glass over the joint around sides and top of windshield vs just fill irregularities with micro. I seem to have good adhesion and most of the gap is filled with the Lord adhesive. Anyone have opinions about this? Is it just belt and suspenders type thing?
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I glassed mine, so I guess I have an opinion. I think it looks better and eliminates any potential cracking due to the various expansion rates of the filler, cabin cover, and windshield. I did the same for all glass. Almost three years later, no crazing or cracking apparent.
 
fiberglass cloth around windows

I second Bob. I used 2 inch strips for windscreen and 1 inch around windows. I than covered those strips with epoxy/micro, no cracks or any indication of issues after 3.5 years.
I think I covered the adhesive with flox, than overlapped with the strips.

Pascal
 
Prep

Did you guys rough the exterior plexi to allow the fiberglass to bond or did you leave it smooth so the cloth was just an overlay?
 
I faired in a strip of fiberglass over the seam, and then had problems with small portions of the glass lifting on leading edge and delaminating from the plexi. If it was painted, you might not even know, but because it was not painted I could see the void. I sanded the plexi with a fine grit, I think a coarser grit might lead to a better bond.
 
I laid up the fiberglass fairing as per the plans - no issues - just a @#$%-load of work! Did I mention how much I hated the fiberglass?

I omitted to colour the mix, though. Do that, as it shows inside.
 
What the other guys did

I did the same thing on all my transparencies. It makes for a very clean transition and clean look. It's a fair amount of work but when you're done the transition from transparency to cabin top is only the thickness of a single layer of electrical tape.

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rocketman1988 said:
Did you guys rough the exterior plexi to allow the fiberglass to bond or did you leave it smooth so the cloth was just an overlay?
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I installed all my transparencies ala Rutan style. It is a proven technique that works well and holds up. Tape off both sides of transparencies leaving inside/outside bonding surface clear. Sand mating surfaces of the transparencies with 220 grit,,,,nothing courser. Leaving the transparency un-sanded will give you problems later on. Leave no shiny spots. Sand the fiberglass mating surfaces with 60 grit. Again leaving nothing shiny! Paint the inside mating surfaces with very thin coat of pure epoxy then bed the transparency in flox tinted black (if you want tint). You want to see a little flox squeeze out all around and no voids in the mating surfaces. Clean up all the squeeze out. After cure, prep the outside for 2"-3" wide taping strips of BID fiberglass. I use plastic coated butcher paper for making fiberglass tapes. Tape the butcher paper down on flat surface. Use fine point permanent marker, draw out the taping size you want. Cut your fiberglass oversize for two layers, the next layer weave is orientated 90* off from the first. Wet out one layer at a time using as little epoxy as needed to get it wet out. Heat from a hair dryer works great to get the epoxy to flow. Stippling with a brush and squeegee to get it wet out without access epoxy. I tinted my epoxy black for this. You will be able to see the outline you drew on the butcher paper to cut out your tapes. The paper will hold everything in place for you. Fill any voids in the prepped joint with flox level with the transparencies/canopy, paint the surface's with tinted pure epoxy very thing again, carry your cut out tapes over and lay in place peeling the paper off as you go. Stipple brush with heat from a hair dryer the tape down. Use a bright light to check for any air bubbles that might get trapped. Work them out! You want 100% bonding here. Now cut some dacron fabric peel ply and lay that over the tapes extending it an inch or more beyond the tapes wetting it out carefully. When cured, remove the peel ply and you will have a very nice installation that will require minimal fill and sanding to finish off. You will not have to worry about any crazing from using Weld-On also. The black tint in the epoxy and flox gives a nice clean professional looking installation too.
 
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Uh, yeah...no.

I don't think I can stand doing that much more fiberglass.

I recall seeing some pictures of an rv-10 where the builder installed the windows much like a car. The windows were taped off, the exterior face of the bonding area was tinted dark using plastic paint. The window was bonded to the cabin top and the gap was filled with a flexible sealant (can't remember what kind). When the airplane was painted, the paint only went as far as the edge of the sealant. Clean looking, simpler than all the extra fiberglass work, and absolutely no chance for cracks...
 
rocketman1988 said:
I don't think I can stand doing that much more fiberglass.

I recall seeing some pictures of an rv-10 where the builder installed the windows much like a car. The windows were taped off, the exterior face of the bonding area was tinted dark using plastic paint. The window was bonded to the cabin top and the gap was filled with a flexible sealant (can't remember what kind). When the airplane was painted, the paint only went as far as the edge of the sealant. Clean looking, simpler than all the extra fiberglass work, and absolutely no chance for cracks...
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Many ways to skin this cat. I personally find fiberglass work to be very easy and satisfying,,,but then again I built a Cozy MKIV and over half of another one!
 
Tape vs Fabric

Question for you guys. Is there a difference between Fiberglass tape and Fabric?

So far windscreen in installed and I used a combination of lords adhesive during installation and followed up with mirco bubble fill to create a fillet around the bottom of my windscreen. It looks nice, but of course could use more sanding/touch up:). My question is I didn't seem to get any fabric from vans to do the layup they describe in the plans and the local Western Marine only has 9oz tape not fabric. I haven't seen it but before I made the trip over I figured I would ask if anyone knew if this could be a suitable replacement for the fabric?

Thanks

Michael Chase
40644
90% Really the Tech advisor said so:).
 
Drippy said:
Question for you guys. Is there a difference between Fiberglass tape and Fabric?

So far windscreen in installed and I used a combination of lords adhesive during installation and followed up with mirco bubble fill to create a fillet around the bottom of my windscreen. It looks nice, but of course could use more sanding/touch up:). My question is I didn't seem to get any fabric from vans to do the layup they describe in the plans and the local Western Marine only has 9oz tape not fabric. I haven't seen it but before I made the trip over I figured I would ask if anyone knew if this could be a suitable replacement for the fabric?

Thanks



Michael Chase
40644
90% Really the Tech advisor said so:).
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Probably easier and cheaper to go with cloth in order to make all of the necessary strips of the required widths unless they carry a tape as wide as the widest callout - 3 1/2".
 
Tape

I according to the women on the phone the tape is 4inx12ft so plenty wide. Just not sure if it has the same properties. I expect the weave isn't the same.
 
The tape, and a strip cut from cloth, are the same, except the tape has finished edges so it doesn't unravel like cut cloth can do. It does take just a bit more sanding, after cure, to remove the slight raised area of the finished edge.
 
Question Please

Please advise me as to the source and type of black color that you used in the epoxy mix. Also, are there a variety of colors such as tan, brown, etc? Thank you all.
 
I used the tape and had issues with it. The finished edge of the tape seems to leave small gaps between the main weave area of the tape and the finished edge. These "large" openings then had a single thin strand of glass at the finished edge. The result was when sanding this strand broke away and left a very bad ragged edge. And in many spots it didn't seem to stick properly to the plexiglass at all. Large portions just peeled away with a little poking at the edges. I ended up working off all of it from all windows and redoing with a mixture of mostly micro and some cab-o-sil to help it stay where I put it. I laid down a very thin layer about the thickness of electrical tape and then blended with the cabin top. It looks really good now.

I used the glass tape because I thought it would save me time with the finished edges and all. Whatever I did wrong (and I'm sure I must have done something wrong), it cost me a lot of extra time. Would it have been any different had I used cloth? No idea. Will what I've done form cracks? Ask me in a year or two.

I've seen pictures of others who had great success with the strips or glass tape, so I know it can be done. I just had a bad experience with it and won't attempt it again.

Documented here for whatever it's worth:
http://airplane.athomeinthewilburness.com/2016/11/11/cabin-top-finally-done/
 
Thanks, Todd

I'm assembling an RV-12 kit and since my interior color is 100% tan. I thought that I'd try a tan color added to the fiberglass mixture. Found the TAP Company on line and since they don't have a tan color, I asked if adding white to their brown color would work. I'll repeat their answer here asap.

Thanks again, Todd, for the info.
 
jwilbur said:
I used the tape and had issues with it. The finished edge of the tape seems to leave small gaps between the main weave area of the tape and the finished edge. These "large" openings then had a single thin strand of glass at the finished edge. The result was when sanding this strand broke away and left a very bad ragged edge. And in many spots it didn't seem to stick properly to the plexiglass at all. Large portions just peeled away with a little poking at the edges. I ended up working off all of it from all windows and redoing with a mixture of mostly micro and some cab-o-sil to help it stay where I put it. I laid down a very thin layer about the thickness of electrical tape and then blended with the cabin top. It looks really good now.

I used the glass tape because I thought it would save me time with the finished edges and all. Whatever I did wrong (and I'm sure I must have done something wrong), it cost me a lot of extra time. Would it have been any different had I used cloth? No idea. Will what I've done form cracks? Ask me in a year or two.

I've seen pictures of others who had great success with the strips or glass tape, so I know it can be done. I just had a bad experience with it and won't attempt it again.

Documented here for whatever it's worth:
http://airplane.athomeinthewilburness.com/2016/11/11/cabin-top-finally-done/
Click to expand...


FYI...... I didn't have any issues using glass tape. I used tape on all the windows.
 
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