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Recommendation on Class

Reflex

Well Known Member
With my workshop complete, many tools purchased, and other considerations out of the way, I'm ready to start on a 14. After reading this forum daily for quite some time and visiting countless builders blogs/web sites, I've come to the conclusion that the build will go much better if I have some help in the beginning. I've decided that it would be best to spend a couple of days learning some basics and asking questions. With this in mind, I've begun looking at the availability of classes.

Over the last few weeks, I've tried to contact the two classes closest to home though both e-mail and phone messages. Unfortunately, I've received only a generic e-mail back from one of the shops. I've made phone calls and left messages that as of yet haven't been returned. My guess is that it's just a busy time of year. I've decided that I shouldn't worry about where the class is, and just get on an airplane and go where I can find the best education.

My questions are:

1) If you didn't have prior sheet metal/riveting experience, did you take a class before you began construction?

2) What, who, or where would you recommend in the U.S. to go for a two day class?

3) Other suggestions?

Thanks,

Fred
 
Hey Fred,

I had never done any solid riveting before, so I watched a few online tutorials, then assembled the toolbox practice kit from Van's. After butchering that, I cut up the metal into several strips, then continued to practice on the scrap.

A class would be great...get in touch with your local chapter of EAA, or go online to find a class near you. I got the hang of it myself pretty quickly, but if I had to do it again, I would've ordered the other practice kit (which resembles a section of elevator or something) to more finely hone the technique.

Hint: When you start riveting on the horizontal stab, do the underside first. That way, someone would pretty much have to be lying beneath the stab to see any dings.

Also, when dimpling with a C-frame, hit it pretty hard with the hammer. Hit it twice if need be. It's nearly impossible to over-dimple a hole, easier to under-dimple (which is what I did at first). Good luck with your project!!
 
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I took the EAA Sportair sheet metal class a couple weeks ago before I started on my 14A. I had zero experience prior and it was a huge help to learn the tools and to practice many of the procedures necessary. I am debating whether to also take the EAA "building an RV" class as well as it seems like a lot of it is covering sheet metal basics that you cover in the sheet metal class.
 
How to 101

Fred if you can't find a class, see what you can find on u-tube, get some scraps of aluminum and start banging away. When you have a bunch of practice rivets driven take them to an EAA meeting, tech counselor or to an experienced builder and get critiqued. The range of acceptable rivets is larger than most new builders think. I believe that the FAA standard is 80% of rivets meeting spec.. If you try to make everything absolute perfect you will drive yourself crazy. Strive for perfection but accept the best you can do.

Steve
 
Before I started the RV-9A, and now the 14 I attended a class with Troy Grover and enjoyed it thoroughly. http://grov-air.com.woad.arvixe.com/Classes.aspx . I flew to him because I was also looking for an excuse to fly my plane on an extended trip as well. He is now located in Colorado but I visited him when he was still in Indiana. The advantage of Troy's class as I recall is that he has lots of different brand tools and opinions on what is needed and what is not.

I also think that the EAA classes are great for what you are looking for and they may be local to you. The sheet metal class would be just what you need and there is one in Indiana coming up in November. www.sportair.com

Echoing what everyone else is saying as well, the class was very valuable however the experience you get just building, and fixing your mistakes either on the practice kit or for many of us the real project is what gives you confidence and really educates you. Case in point, things like working with Tank Sealant, Trailing edge work, staring at a rivet in a tight spot for twenty minutes trying to figure out how you are going to buck is best learned by doing ;)

Good luck!
 
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RV White Pages

There used to be some RV specific videos (George Orndoff, RV-6A) available on VHS :eek: I would think their first hour or so would help you with the basics even though they were pre-pre-RV14 days. The basics would be the same regardless of which RV you are building. The EAA has a Sheet metal channel that has about 90 short videos available for viewing on their web site.

Several years ago there was a TV show produced by EAA on the Discovery Channel named "From the Ground Up" with Joe Schumacher. Each episode showed progress on an RV-8 until it was completed. EAA also sold VHS videos of those episodes. If you ask around you might find a set of those.

Also, you might check the RV White Pages on Doug's front page for builders near you. I notice several builders listed in Kansas and even one RV14 builder in Wichita.

I think the previous post about Youtube videos and working with some scrap is spot on. There are several ways to get started. Whether or not you take a class, you'll soon be breezing through the build process.

To answer your questions, I did not take a class, but I did learn how to buck rivets by helping two different friends as they were building their RV-6's. I also attended Sun'n Fun as well as joined our local RV Builder's Group where I asked a lot of questions.

Good luck and best wishes!

Don
 
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Aircraft Fab. Classes

I'm a truck driver. I took no classes, all I did was read the directions in Van's manual.
I do suggest a little practice with a rivet gun before you do the real thing. It takes a little practice and even with practice some times you will pull away from the material before taking my finger off the trigger and k-thump and it leaves a dent.....:cool:
Enjoy the build, I did...
 
The EAA Web site has a few videos available that walk you through the basics, or as mentioned the DVDs/video tapes available for purchase are pretty good.

Perhaps the best "class" is meeting up with someone who's done it before and asking them to teach ya. There are many out there who can and will help. Before I started on my kit I had the benefit of working with Teen Flight kids and mentors, so I kinda learned from some pretty great builders. But, I've still replaced parts hah.

Have fun with it!
 
Or even just find a local EAA tech counselor (or other RV builder in the area), and buy him dinner or give him a few bucks and he will probably help you for a few hours. Most builders would be glad to lend a hand getting you started. As they will then have someone that owes them some riveting time when they need to do a part that needs 2 people.
 
I took a week long class in Griffin, Ga. It was expensive but worth every penny. At their class you took your tail kit with you and came home with it completed! Unless you were building a -10. Sadly I do not think it is still being offered.
 
Welcome

The EAA Web site has a few videos available that walk you through the basics, or as mentioned the DVDs/video tapes available for purchase are pretty good.

Perhaps the best "class" is meeting up with someone who's done it before and asking them to teach ya. There are many out there who can and will help. Before I started on my kit I had the benefit of working with Teen Flight kids and mentors, so I kinda learned from some pretty great builders. But, I've still replaced parts hah.

Have fun with it!

Welcome Fred.
You've received some great advise but personally, I feel this is the best. Find a mentor. For most, it's a huge ego boost to help a noobie and most will jump at the oportunity.
For sure, watch the EAA Webinars. Attend a class if available but you will learn more in less time with a mentor.
 
I took the Sportair sheet metal class before starting on my RV-7 project, then took the Sportair Electrical class the next year, and took the composites course this year so I could be more comfortable with the fiberglass work.

Each of these has provided valuable skills and knowledge that took much of the mystery out of the build.

I'm a fan!
 
Contact your local EAA chapter. There will be a builder there and they will probably be more than happy to help you through the begging stages.

(I have introduced more people to the rivet gun than I can recall.)
 
Builder Classes

I ran across your post about wanting to take a class about building your RV-14. I work for Synergy Air out in Eugene OR and we offer a fundamentals course to teach you how to do the metal work that you will need to know to finish your 14. We also offer tail kit classes, in which we help you build your tail kit one on one. Thought that you would find this helpful.
 
Can't say enough good about Synergy and the folks that work there. They love what they do and are excellent teachers.

I started to build my -10 there and am now finishing a -7A project there.

Only thing is I wish they were a little closer to Atlanta! ;)
 
I agree with KatanaPilot - Synergy Air is a great place to start your RV build. I took their empennage class to get started on my RV-10 build last year, even though I had already attended the EAA SportAir sheet metal classes. While the 2 day EAA classes were a very good introduction, actually building the empennage under the guidance of the Synergy Air folks gave me a lot more confidence and experience in techniques, not to mention a great start on the build.

I just wish Synergy offered an intensive hands-on class in the fiberglass work required for the RV-10!
 
I just attended Eaa's metal workshop at sun n fun.
It was affordable $375.
I did learn basics but was disappointed in them not having more tools to try like pneumatic squeezers, maybe up graded drills and rivet guns.
The tools were dated and we had one portable compressor for 16 builders.

Still the instructers were knowledgeable and again I learned the basics.
Agree with leaning on your local EAA. I have some great guys to help here in Fort Myers.

Good luck
 
My wife, both my daughters, and I took a weekend long building class with Troy Grover when he was in Indiana. It was an awesome class. Hands on building of a section of an aileron.

Troy has since moved to Watkins, Colorado, which is just east of Denver. Troy is a great guy and teaches you a lot for a weekend course. After the class, he will answer any questions you have as you build.

Here is his website:
http://www.grov-air.com
 
I took the Synergy Air fundamentals and quick build classes, it was a great education. A large number of class from all over the country stayed on to work on their empennage's for what ever plane they were building in the empennage build class the following week.. You pretty much complete your empennage in the class in a week. Just seems like a huge jump start on an airplane build esp if you are quick building.
 
I got excited when I saw this title in the "new posts" list. No one has ever asked me for advice on class before!

But then I saw how long ago the question was posted, and realized that, as always, I was late for class.
 
I took the EAA sheet metal boot camp. It was excellent and i would highly recommend it for those with no riveting experience as myself. Also buy the tungsten bucking bar, it makes a difference
 
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