Help! How Much Pro Seal / Firewall Seal?

A few specific sealant questions - I am working on the fuselage.
Does the Finish Kit (which has the fuel tank parts) include the Proseal (that is, the Van's Part # MC-236-XX) and if so, how much? Quart? If not, how much is needed to build the tank (and fill the top part of the boarding steps)?

What is the Flamemaster Product code for this product, because I think it might be cheaper elsewhere. I can't make it out on the picture on Vans website.

In particular, I may want to order it along with the Firewall Sealant (the CS-1900 - a different product) from here:
http://www.skygeek.com/flamemaster-cs-1900-sealant-6-oz.html
which is about $20 cheaper than Vans for the firewall sealant. It's not so much the money as I want to get it pretty quick.

It is a bit confusing because the FUEL TANK sealant is used between the lower firewall F-1201C and the F1201-B Firewall Shelf, but later FIREWALL sealant is used on other parts of the firewall.

I am reading other posts about using this stuff but the needed quantity and exact codes are not mentioned. Thanks!

What most of us found - I think

Tank sealant works best for all the areas calling for a sealant. It is messy, but to me is easier to spread out. I think the can is a pint. Been over a year, so might be wrong on that.

John Bender

Bill,

When the RV-12 kits first came out, they called for two different sealing products. Then they changed to just one, to be used for everything. The product that I ordered from Van's is a one quart kit. I used about 1/2 of it for the tank, firewall sealing, and a few other miscellaneous tasks. It has an expiration date, but I think it will keep for a long time in the fridge.

The label says:

FLAMEMASTER
AMS-S-8802B TYPE 2 Class B-2
CS 3204, SEALING COMPOUND, PART A

Catalyst comes with it in a little jar.

John

Bill_H said:

A few specific sealant questions - I am working on the fuselage.
Does the Finish Kit (which has the fuel tank parts) include the Proseal (that is, the Van's Part # MC-236-XX) and if so, how much? Quart? If not, how much is needed to build the tank (and fill the top part of the boarding steps)?

In particular, I may want to order it along with the Firewall Sealant (the CS-1900 - a different product) from here:
http://www.skygeek.com/flamemaster-cs-1900-sealant-6-oz.html
which is about $20 cheaper than Vans for the firewall sealant. It's not so much the money as I want to get it pretty quick.

It is a bit confusing because the FUEL TANK sealant is used between the lower firewall F-1201C and the F1201-B Firewall Shelf, but later FIREWALL sealant is used on other parts of the firewall.

I am reading other posts about using this stuff but the needed quantity and exact codes are not mentioned. Thanks!

Click to expand...

The finish kit does not include the fuel tank sealant. The 1 quart kit that Van's sells is enough for the entire build with a little left over. Mix it as needed using a gram scale.
It sounds like the plans still call for two different products to be used on the firewall. We are required to build it per the plans.
Van's doesn't overprice anything. Their price includes the $20 hazmat shipping for the firewall sealant, the web price link does not.
Once you mix the firewall sealant sem pak you have to use it up, it does not keep. Bummer, cause the firewall forward plans call for about 1/2 ounce of firewall sealant on the firewall grommet for the engine choke and throttle cables. I wonder how many have spent another $40 for that penetration?

Tony

Hi Tony,

I called Van's support way back when I hit this point and they told me they were now telling people to use the tank stuff on the firewall too. I wonder if they forgot to change the plans.

Meeting my friend with the scales this morning.

John

I believe the plans call for fuel tank sealant for the firewall lap joints and the CS1900 firewall sealant for the larger gaps, punched holes and to fill the bushings where there is more than a metal to metal joint.

You might also want to check out SealPak in Wichita, KS. They'll sell you any quantity you need from a few oz to a 55gal drum. Phone works best, 316-942-6211.

They also have the different consistencies... "peanut butter" vice "honey". The "honey" flows out nice to seal the bucked side of the rivets. The "peanut butter" is the more traditional type.

http://sealpakcoinc.com/welcome.htm

-Jim
40603

The plans may still call for the actual firewall sealant in a few places but this has changed back and forth through various revisions and was very hard to track for early builders. After speaking with a few very experienced builders, including some who are A&Ps and have worked for major airlines, the universal recommendation was to use the Pro-seal or an equivalent everywhere and that is what I did. I know there was a thread on this topic early on after the kit came out because the firewall sealant was very difficult to find and Van's stopped selling it for a time due to Hazmat shipping reg changes. Someone indicated the firewall sealant was not fireproof whereas the firewall sealant is. In reality, if there is a fire in the cowling that is really that significant, it is hard to imagine it would make much difference. The firewall sealant is also very difficult and messy to use.

So, like a few others, I used the Flamemaster tank sealant everywhere. I did end up using more than one can (a lot of waste mixing small batches for the tank and other items) and I was hesitant to use it much past the expiration date for anything critical, as the consistency of mine began to change. Note that I also spread a bead on top of all rivet lines on the tank exterior based on a recommendation from someone who runs a builders assistance center. The tank is one place you do not want to skimp- the builders who have had leaks after the initial build seem to have spent many hours trying to locate and stop them. Best to get it well sealed the first time around. I also used a few of the tubes as well- they don't require any measuring, are less messy, and work well for applying beads along joints on the firewall, etc. They also set up a bit more quickly.

Jeff

Expired ProSeal

Van sells "expired" 1 oz packs of ProSeal and ENDORSES it's use for the firewall - NOT FOR THE FUEL TANK. Price is below their cost - $3.00.

Which "fireWALL" sealant to use

Ok, so planning ahead and wondering which to use for the few places that calls for firewall sealant vs fuel tank sealant?

I see the following choices:

From ACS...the 3M choice:

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/firewall2000caulk.php

From Skygeek....the Flamemaster choice:

http://www.skygeek.com/flamemaster-cs-1900-sealant-6-oz.html

From Van's....the semkit....rather pricy....

http://www.vansaircraft.com/cgi-bin/store.cgi?ident=1369589995-174-306&browse=misc&product=cs1900

So what to use? I ordered some ACS 3m stuff based on some other posts but now I am not sure that is "good" enough.

Thoughts?

I also used 3M Fire Barrier 2000+ based on these tests:

http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=72087&page=4

John, I went to Auto Zone and bought black hi-temp RTV. I took some criticism on the site here, but it works and is much easier to work with than fuel tank sealer. It's cheap and comes in a tube so no mixing.

Rich

I used the FlameMaster. It was absolutely, positively the worst stuff I ever laid my hands on, and my finished job showed it. It was impossible to work with and made an unbelievable mess.

I had to rip it all off (or what I could), and redid it all with the 3M Fire Barrier 2000+ - a product that was MUCH easier to work with and produced a much better looking (and functioning) result.

Bob Bogash
N737G

RFSchaller said:

John, I went to Auto Zone and bought black hi-temp RTV. I took some criticism on the site here, but it works and is much easier to work with than fuel tank sealer. It's cheap and comes in a tube so no mixing.

Rich

Click to expand...

Hi-Temp RTV is my first choice for filling the cable penetration grommet in the firewall. Is this a bad idea?

Some folks felt the RTV would not stand up well to fuel. My argument is if there is fuel on your firewall you've got bigger issues!

I think the whole point of sealing a firewall is to try and protect you from the effects an unfortunate big issue (along with more minor ones like CO and oil leaks, etc.).
Not to just protect you from the simple issues, and then just asume you are out of luck if a bad one happens.