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Navworx , back in business?

recapen said:
Yup - I got the two service bulletins downloaded already...they leave so many questions un-answered...yes, we asked them after the SB's came out...
Click to expand...

Ralph, the response was to check out the SBs as they didn't have anymore info.
Much of the delay is waiting on the approvals from the FAA.
 
DennisRhodes said:
And Dan , add one more please. Will the software/ hardware be included for the 1090 receive .? Thanks
Click to expand...

Talked to David & Bethany, the delay is based on the approvals coming from the FAA.

This is the reason a date has been difficult to publish. On approval, the updates will be released. As explained to me, the 1090ES data stream comes in packets to be assembled. The UAT broadcasts in a distinct data stream & parsed.

Please, Don't beat me up on this high level simplistic explanation.
 
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THANKS DAN!

We appreciate your efforts! Communication has not been a strong suit for this conflagration...thanks for your intermediation!

Yes, we're a tough crowd - happens when you find out you may have bought an expensive paperweight!

Hopefully, my AMOC will come through soon and I will gain a little independence - and the ability to run past July and 2020!

Don't get me wrong, I want them to succeed - against the likes of Garmin that abandons their acquisitions...they remind me of JPI and Vision MicroSystems!

Again, thanks Dan and all others relaying info from the booth @ Osh-17!
 
recapen said:
How about some sort of press release - highlights, future time-frames for software and features. A bunch of questions have been posed - mostly relevant to the new SB and upcoming software release to remediate the AD.....

Those of us that couldn't go are anxious to hear some positive information!
Click to expand...

I don't have the authority to give an official press release. Come to think of it, I simply don't have any authority at all. I'm nothing. Just a spouse of an employee. For the most part, I am a concerned customer, just like every other participant here. I don't have a playbill, and I certainly don't have the script. The only unique thing I have over anybody else, is a seat with a slightly better view of the stage. And in some aspects, even that is debatable.

So if you're offering me a 'penny for my thoughts' I am happy to oblige, and that penny is about all they're worth. Here is what I think I know...

For existing EXP installations:
There will be a software available (6.0) soon. That software will bring the SIL down to 1. The 1 means you are still a client of the network and receiving all traffic services, but you are not 2020-compliant. Apparently the FAA is okay with this. Disclaimer: I don't know if that means they will accept it as an AMOC for the AD which says to move to a SIL of 0, or if they are simply okay with it in the interim to the compliance date.

There will be a software available (7.0) later. That software will work in combination with the add-on certified GPS to bring the SIL back up to 3 and make everything kosher for 2020. When is later? I can't tell. But I can guess that it will be after the certification is in hand for the add-on GPS and before the compliance date for the AD comes to pass.

If it was my cat, I would do nothing until either software 7.0 is available or until the AD compliance date draws near.

For new EXP installations:
The Gen 2.0 EXP unit will have the same form-factor as the certified unit, but (naturally) a lower price.

For new ADS600-B installations:
FAA approval (such that expectations can exist) is expected in August. Once certification is in hand, the production line will spool up. For the sake of simplicity, the company line here at Oshkosh is, "Certification in August, product shipping in September." Of course, there is a backlog and of course initial production is bound to have some unforeseen snag. So my crystal ball says that the company will transition from initial production into full-steam volume production in the month of October. Purely my guess, not a commitment to anybody on the part of NavWorx.

One the production line is humming, the company can flex it left, right, or center to emphasize new production or EXP upgrades or certified unit upgrades. Which brings me to...

For existing ADS600-B installations there are several paths forward:
1) There will be a global AMOC (or three?) that allow the unit to be slaved to an external certified GPS. From what I've read (mostly here) all of the major brands and models will have coverage. With an external certified GPS and the AMOC, the system can continue to broadcast a SIL of 3.

2a) There will be an upgrade program to install the newly certified GPS into an existing unit. It won't be free, but it isn't very expensive either. It is below the company's cost, so we bleed a little and they bleed a little. Reminds me of an expression: the goal of democracy is not to make anybody happy. The goal of democracy is to try to ensure an even and equal level of unhappiness across the population.

2b) For those who want to avail themselves of some of the new and novel features of the Gen 2.0 box there will be a more extensive upgrade program. The cost will be slightly higher than option 2a, but not dramatically so.

New and novel Gen 2.0 features:
Internal TransMON function
Internal WiFi
USB Maintenance Console connection (no more serial port adapters, yay!)
Simplified configuration process

All of the new certified units will have software 5.0. This software will auto-detect much of the aircraft configuration that was done manually until now. The unit will self-detect if it is connected to an external certified GPS, or if it needs to use the internal GPS. The unit will self-detect if it is connected to digital data for the squawk code and barometric altitude, or if it needs to use the internal TransMON. For the digital interfaces, it will auto-detect baud rates.

Software 5.0 will include anonymous mode when squawking 1200.

All units will come with the hardware to receive 1090MHz, but the software to process the 1090 piecemeal data is still in the future. Just too much to tackle in this software release. (I am just as bummed as you are.) The good news is that once the dust settles on this chapter in the company's history, I think the biggest remaining customer noise will be for the dual-band functionality. So that's why I still think I will have it in my airplane some day.
 
THANKS DAVID

This was certainly worth more than a penny and answers a few of the outstanding question while giving us something positive to hang our hats on.

Hopefully soon, the individual and Global AMOCs will be published. For those of us getting individual AMOCs - we'll be good to go post 2020 as is...although some of the features touted in the new software release will be nice to have as soon as possible...Display Port 2 and Anonymous Mode jump right out for me...although the SL-70 fix may be needed for more of the certified guys as Garmin sold a bunch of SL-70/GX-60/SL-30/MX-20/SL-15 combo platters.

Again thanks!
 
Thanks David for the Update, and also Dan for the question asked. Although sounds like the 1090 receive for the 600EXP maybe " next round" Thats OK, I would be happy to just see the AD go away for this round. Maybe the FAA can make the approval and allow Navworx the time to produce some parts for us within the 6 mths.
 
Back to the beginning - Navworx , back in business?

I believe they are.

Spoke with Bill Mofffet regarding my order of last August. He said it would be filled, hopefully by end of August with a black certified box without STC label. The transmon has been incorporated in the box so it, with the GPS they send, should put me in business re ADS-B via UAT.

It was amicable conversation, parted with hand shake. I asked if war with FAA was over and he responded it is settled. :)
 
The unit looks good in the photo. Just curious does the GPS ant plug into the piggyback unit or remain connected to the original connector on the EXP?
Thanks
 
Delta Bravo said:
The unit looks good in the photo. Just curious does the GPS ant plug into the piggyback unit or remain connected to the original connector on the EXP?
Thanks
Click to expand...

It all stays the same from my understanding. Your existing 9 pin harness now connects to the piggyback box, which jumps to the original 9 pin connector.
 
The one question that has not been answered to my knowledge...:

Will software version 5 work WITHOUT the hardware changes?
 
recapen said:
The one question that has not been answered to my knowledge...:

Will software version 5 work WITHOUT the hardware changes?
Click to expand...

It is addressed in the service bulletin. V5 will auto detect the gps source and set the SIL value appropriately.
 
Delta Bravo said:
The unit looks good in the photo. Just curious does the GPS ant plug into the piggyback unit or remain connected to the original connector on the EXP?
Thanks
Click to expand...

The GPS antenna plugs into the piggyback unit according to the long conversation I had with Bill Moffet.
 
The add-on GPS module (I was calling it "the doghouse" since that is where NavWorx found itself with the FAA) attaches to the ADS600-EXP by way of three existing screws. You take out three of the screws that are already there holding the sheet metal cover on, then locate the doghouse and reinstall the three screws. You move the GPS antenna connection from the main unit to the doghouse (blind side of the image in the flier). You unplug the aircraft harness from P1 and plug it into the doghouse connector. You plug the doghouse ribbon connector into the P1 plug on the main unit. Then you load software version 7.0.

What you don't want to do is load software 7.0 without having installed the GPS doghouse, because the software is designed for the new hardware.

Software 5.0 is not for the EXP unit. That's for the certified unit.
 
Thank you David for clearing up the issue on where the gps antenna attaches.
And, I'm happy to hear the doghouse attaches using the existing screws & holes on the main housing.
 
Saw this posted on the Dallas Avionics website regarding ordering & shipping of the new 600EXP gps module.

https://www.dallasavionics.com/cgi-bin/navworx.cgi?faction=ads600exp

Here's the text.
Experimental Aircraft ADS-600EXP System:

In order for Experimental Aircraft with our ADS-600EXP Systems to comply with AD all Systems must update software to new revision (when released anticipate 8/15/17) and must install EXP GPS Module (we anticipate to begin to take orders 8/7/17 and begin shipping in 8/15/17).

GPS Module Price is $299.00

GPS module will install in aircraft and will not require any additional wiring changes. Module will be "Daisy Chained in Series" with existing system utilizing existing EXP system wiring and connectors.

All orders will be through Dallas Avionics, Inc. Orders will be accepted on 8/7/17.

Note: Experimental owners with ADS-600B System must comply with ADS-600B criteria.
 
Dan, thanks for the link.

"Dog house" ordered this morning. I will be glad to get and install it to (hopefully) close another chapter on ADS-B installation. I'm not into drama...I just want it to work.

Larry
 
Report after install please!

Jaws,
Let us know how the reinstall and functionality checkout go!
The rest of us are interested in what functionality was added / promised but still missing.

Thanks!
 
Ordered mine as well. Im also adding wire to accomodate a recently new to me GTX 327. Does anyone know where to find the navworx "console" to be able to reconfigure the 600exp when i get this done.? I didnt find it on the navworx site. Im removing the transmonSPE. Not sure why, it seem to work fine.
 
You should be able to use the iOS app to configure it via WiFi. (Is there an Android app? Never looked .. ) My 600EXP is connected to my 327, no problems works great.
 
Not to be a downer, but, when you all ordered the gps unit, will there be a hard copy document included from the FAA that states the unit will now really, really be in 2020 compliance?
Or is there a promise ?
 
Dan - -

Fully appreciate your concerns. I waited a long time too. Dallas Avionics is listed as having 264 employees. Can't imagine they need a major size problem like that. Not sure how the FAA will know, but I plan to take pics and have paperwork ready if asked.
 
roadrunner20 said:
Not to be a downer, but, when you all ordered the gps unit, will there be a hard copy document included from the FAA that states the unit will now really, really be in 2020 compliance?
Or is there a promise ?
Click to expand...

All just verbal across the counter at OSH. They said they were awaiting FAA approval before the "dog house" is mfg. Said it would have a SIL 3 when the 7.0 software was loaded. That should be good to go for 2020 in an experimental. " He said" . Fool me once , fool me twice, I've sill got one more to go!!!
 
DennisRhodes said:
Ordered mine as well. Im also adding wire to accomodate a recently new to me GTX 327. Does anyone know where to find the navworx "console" to be able to reconfigure the 600exp when i get this done.? I didnt find it on the navworx site. Im removing the transmonSPE. Not sure why, it seem to work fine.
Click to expand...

The console is a chunk of software from NavWorx - you connect some wires to a DB9 RS-232 connector to a computer with a serial port and configure it remotely...wiring diagram in the manual...might be different for the EXP boxes!

Need more help - let me know...I have this wired in mine...
 
The 600EXP uses a downloaded block of software that was found on the Navworx site the first time I did this. After downloading it specifically for the 600EXP it connects up with that unit via the Wi Fi and allows the set up to be done. I was thinking it was called " UAT Console EXP installer" I could be wrong. I'm currently looking on my older laptop for that software . Someone said it was available on an apple app not sure about android. I did however find a UAT config app on android but chose not to pay $10 for it. Still looking.
 
EXP Firmware updates

There are (potentially) two ways to update an EXP unit: Windows PC or Apple iOS app. Bill (Moffitt) has not yet made the new firmware available or supplied me with a revision history document. I do not know when this will happen.

If you have a PC laptop and can run it at your plane you should be able to download (free) the Console app to do the firmware update from navworx.com. If you prefer using an iPhone or iPad, you can download the ADS600EXP Config App from the App Store for $0.99. Bill had me charge a buck for it to discourage accidental downloads.

NOTE for iOS/Apple users:
When Apple released iOS 10 they broke support for WiFi connection with certain internet IP subnets. There was nothing wrong, technically, with this subnet but Apple seems to think otherwise and interprets it as "no connection". This is probably greek to some readers... so keep reading.

Due to the early (pre 5.7.x) firmware using the WiFi subnet that Apple does not like, the app will not update the EXP unit from < 5.7 firmware unless you are using an iPhone or iPad that has iOS 9 on it. Your choices are to use the PC console one time to get to at least 5.7, or to borrow an older iPhone (4S or 5) or older iPad that is still running ios 9.

I have a few iOS 9 iPhones lying around and plan to make these available when the navworx update firmware comes out. I'm willing to mail these to conveniently located EAA chapters or friendly VAF'ers so planes can make a short hop to centrally located airports and update. A mail-forward of the devices may work too. I'm trying to leave this up to Dallas Avionics to stage manage when the time comes but I suspect I'll be helping to organize it.

The app will usually let you listen to the EXP unit and see the current firmware version number. This will help you determine if you need to go the PC route or find an orphan Apple device on which to run the app.

Hope this helps clarify the upgrade mechanism for the -EXP units.
 
Navworx GPS Module

Anticipated ship date for the GPS module was 8/15

Has anyone received the unit from Dallas Avionics?

Don B
 
Don,
The expected software release date was also published as 8/17.
No software yet either.

My understanding is that Bill and the NavWorx team had to get AMOC's for their hardware and software changes - and they're not willing to ship until they have full approval from the FAA to prevent a repeat.

There are a number of 'other' AMOCs and AMOC amendments in the pipeline as well!

Someone else can verify this.....
 
Just received a FAA Safety email.

FAA Safety Team | Safer Skies Through Education
It’s not too late to reserve your ADS-B Rebate! NavWorx avionics now eligible!
Notice Number: NOTC7328

Attention pilots and aircraft owners: The ADS-B Rebate Program will now allow aircraft owners with NavWorx ADS600-B avionics, part numbers 200-0012/0013, to apply for a rebate.

To be eligible, rebate applicants who purchased and installed these NavWorx units after September 19, 2016 must comply with section (e)(1)(iv) of the recent Airworthiness Directive (AD 2017-11-11), or use an FAA-approved Alternative Method of Compliance.

The FAA is offering a $500 rebate for new ADS-B installations in fixed-wing, single-engine piston aircraft. The last day to make a rebate reservation is September 18, 2017, if reservations are still available. Once the reservation is established, you will still have up to 150 days to complete the remaining steps in the process.

Are you eligible for a rebate? Please visit faa.gov/go/rebate/ for details.

Questions? For questions about the ADS-B rebate program, please contact [email protected].
 
EXP Software

I have been watching the NAVWORX site for the promised EXP Version 6.0.0 and 7.0.0 software and haven't seen it. Would like to purchase the EXP GPS fix but wanted to see that the software promised 8/15 is available first.

Next question, has the FAA approved the use of the new GPS and version 7.0.0 software as a remedy for the AD?

Thanks,

Ron
 
Swoda said:
I have been watching the NAVWORX site for the promised EXP Version 6.0.0 and 7.0.0 software and haven't seen it. Would like to purchase the EXP GPS fix but wanted to see that the software promised 8/15 is available first.

Next question, has the FAA approved the use of the new GPS and version 7.0.0 software as a remedy for the AD?

Thanks,

Ron
Click to expand...

In working with the FAA to get the AMOCs that were published last week, I was told that they really were impressed with Bill's submission and technology. They couldn't say anything more due to NDA.

I know that ours were held up a week or so to ensure that they would be eligible for the FAA rebates. I would suspect that Bill is having to deal with similar opportunities.

While I don't really know anything more than what I've shared, I would suspect that everything will be available shortly. The FAA doesn't publish dates or set any expectations on when they'll complete tasks. Mentioning a date may not have been the best decision for Navworx. I would give them a few more weeks to allow the FAA to do their stuff.

While I have an AMOC to make me legal again, I am still going to upgrade. I just don't want to be in the front of the queue.
 
Hi all,

Can any of you that has one of these confirm or deny whether it works with ForeFlight at all? I got an unconvincing "well, it's an app so it should work" answer from someone at Navworx, however I have been unable to get a response from anyone else there who knows for sure. I'm trying to make a decision on what's next, e.g. GTX-327 now w/ Navworx in a month or two when they ship, or just bite the bullet and go with a more expensive all-in-one option that I know will work. As my current transponder has failed and I need Mode C to fly here, I need to decide quickly.

Thanks!
 
keep the 327 and go with the new Garmin GDL82. Cheaper and problem solved. I would never in a million years recommend Navworx. Not that it doesn't work, but the whole way everything went down the FAA was sketchy, at best.
 
Timberwolf said:
keep the 327 and go with the new Garmin GDL82. Cheaper and problem solved. I would never in a million years recommend Navworx. Not that it doesn't work, but the whole way everything went down the FAA was sketchy, at best.
Click to expand...

As I read his post his current transponder has failed.
If he doesn't mind used, 327's are going for $400., a great deal.
If only new equipment, some mode S-ES transponders are now in the $2K price range, e.g., Trig TT22.
Like you, I wouldn't touch navworx with a ten foot pole. Besides, there are now less expensive options.
 
ADSB and ForeFlight

rforsythe said:
Hi all,

Can any of you that has one of these confirm or deny whether it works with ForeFlight at all? I got an unconvincing "well, it's an app so it should work" answer from someone at Navworx, however I have been unable to get a response from anyone else there who knows for sure. I'm trying to make a decision on what's next, e.g. GTX-327 now w/ Navworx in a month or two when they ship, or just bite the bullet and go with a more expensive all-in-one option that I know will work. As my current transponder has failed and I need Mode C to fly here, I need to decide quickly.

Thanks!
Click to expand...

We installed the Appareo Stratus ESGi Transponder with 2i; which gives you a 310 watt WAAS Mode ES transponder; with ADSB IN/OUT on 1090 & 870 Plus weather into Foreflight on our IPad Mini. Easy installation & never looked back.
 
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So, different feedback than I was anticipating, but useful. Bob is correct, my current transponder ate it a few weeks back, so I am exploring options. An avionics shop I am working with suggested the 327+Naxworx combo, but I have a couple criteria including ForeFlight, so I don't know if that'd even work. They also suggested using a portable box alongside the Naxworx for 'In', but I want a fixed In receiver and less clutter. I use a stratux already. Plus, having to augment a device that already provides something with another device to do the same thing is just ... silly.

The one and only real drawback with the Appareo is lack of an output which can feed data to other avionics. It works with the iPad fantastically, however, and meets all other criteria.

With Garmin, it appears the only way to get single-box In/Out with wifi and future direct avionics connectivity is a GDL88 if I paired a 327, and at that point I may as well just stick a 345 in there, or go really nice and get a Lynx.

I was liking the Navworx concept - Out/In, wifi, ARINC+RS-232, WAAS, all in a box for about $2100 plus a cheap GTX-327 to drive it. But based on a lot of feedback in places like VAF, plus my own inability to even get a simple feature question answered, I am tending to agree other options will likely be better (even if more expensive up front). Garmin and L-3 aren't cheap, but they are always available on the phone.

Thanks for the input!
 
roadrunner20 said:
Just received a FAA Safety email.

FAA Safety Team | Safer Skies Through Education
It?s not too late to reserve your ADS-B Rebate! NavWorx avionics now eligible!
Notice Number: NOTC7328

Attention pilots and aircraft owners: The ADS-B Rebate Program will now allow aircraft owners with NavWorx ADS600-B avionics, part numbers 200-0012/0013, to apply for a rebate.

To be eligible, rebate applicants who purchased and installed these NavWorx units after September 19, 2016 must comply with section (e)(1)(iv) of the recent Airworthiness Directive (AD 2017-11-11), or use an FAA-approved Alternative Method of Compliance.

The FAA is offering a $500 rebate for new ADS-B installations in fixed-wing, single-engine piston aircraft. The last day to make a rebate reservation is September 18, 2017, if reservations are still available. Once the reservation is established, you will still have up to 150 days to complete the remaining steps in the process.

Are you eligible for a rebate? Please visit faa.gov/go/rebate/ for details.

Questions? For questions about the ADS-B rebate program, please contact [email protected].
Click to expand...

Ralph, Phil, and I just received updated General Appliance AMOCs that cover just about every certified Garmin GPS to be used as a position source. They were posted to the AOPA site yesterday. If you used one of the original AMOCs, they're still good. The new ones just added more 4xx, 5xx, 6xx, and 7xx models, as well as fixing a FAA omission to include the 200-0012 for the Garmin 480.

While I would still recommend getting the Navworx upgrades. The AMOCs are a good stop gap to address the AD in the short term and to get a rebate for those that may be eligible.

bob
 
rforsythe said:
Hi all,

Can any of you that has one of these confirm or deny whether it works with ForeFlight at all? I got an unconvincing "well, it's an app so it should work" answer from someone at Navworx, however I have been unable to get a response from anyone else there who knows for sure. I'm trying to make a decision on what's next, e.g. GTX-327 now w/ Navworx in a month or two when they ship, or just bite the bullet and go with a more expensive all-in-one option that I know will work. As my current transponder has failed and I need Mode C to fly here, I need to decide quickly.

Thanks!
Click to expand...

For many of us, we can't confirm the Foreflight support until 5.0 is released for the ADS600-B. There is a bug in 4.1.0 in which display port 2 doesn't function properly when display port 1 is serial attached to an EFIS. The symptom is that the iPad sees the SSID, recognizes the Navworx unit, but no traffic is transmitted. According to Bill, this is fixed in 5.0. The same symptom also is present with WingX.

You don't mention what else is in your panel. That would must likely cause me to sway one way or another on the recommendation. I personally like the Trig OEM transponders that Dynon and AFS are selling. Of course, you can get them from Trig too. With most of the non-Garmin EFIS, it would allow remote control and mounting and complying with the ADSB mandate. They tend to run about $2k.
 
BobTurner said:
As I read his post his current transponder has failed.
If he doesn't mind used, 327's are going for $400., a great deal.
If only new equipment, some mode S-ES transponders are now in the $2K price range, e.g., Trig TT22.
Like you, I wouldn't touch navworx with a ten foot pole. Besides, there are now less expensive options.
Click to expand...

I would agree if purchasing new. For those of us that already have sunk cost in a Navworx unit, the decision point is a little different for each of us.

In my case it's stick with the AMOC and use my 327 and the 650 as a position source, but risk future software updates may not support the original platform (costs $0.00), upgrade to the new boards and GPS ($600), or install a new transponder (Trig) and an ADSB receiver (Dynon/AFS) ($3,000).

What option I prefer and what option I can afford are different. Just like most things in life. :D
 
The one and only real drawback with the Appareo is lack of an output which can feed data to other avionics.
Click to expand...
The Appareo Stratus ESG has GPS data out. Or do you mean it does not have traffic and weather? I like the fact that the Appareo is just one box, not dependent on other brand equipment. If two different brands are connected together and there is problem, each manufacturer will blame the other, leaving you caught in the middle. I would rather just have one box to fail, not two.
 
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