Install rear rudder pedals in flying RV-8

Hi,

I recently acquired a flying RV-8 and need rear rudder pedals for transition training. I've got a rear pedal kit and the install seems straight forward except for one thing: The outboard bolts that attach each idler bracket (F-8118-L/R) to F-802H-L/R (sorry, I don't know the name for this, but it's the weldment at the base of each gear tower in the forward cockpit) on drawing OP-5 is impossible to reach! I can't get a wrench/socket/gripping tool on the nut inside the tower. Besides being way down in the worst case corner, each target nut is flanked by nuts that enter perpendicularly, for instance, that block access from most directions. Further in the left tower the fuel lines make it look impossible, which made me laugh after sweating on the right tower then deciding to see if the left would be easier.

After spending an embarrassing number of hours playing contortionist, I've spent a similar amount of time searching the forums here. Though I've read every post I could find on the matter, I only found one other person mention this challenge (and they concluded "IMPOSSIBLE") in a thread about modifying the gear tower with access covers.

Can any of you folks school me in the wizardry involved in removing/replacing said nuts? Or, is the only solution modifying the gear tower by cutting larger access holes, etc.? Or is there something else entirely people do, like fashion a different idler bracket? (Or, Did I miss the magic thread?)

Thanks! By the way, after reading through the forum, this has to be one of the most genteel spots on the internet...pretty refreshing!

R/Tony

Do you have a 12 year old or access to one? Child labor rates still have a good value proposition. Start now and they can also help torque the two bolts inside the gear towers for a few years.

It must be possible because I installed them in my QB fuselage and all that hardware was already in place. I do recall having to back some hardware off, install and then re-torque and it was a specific sequence.
Full disclosure, I did the gear tower mod that opens up the access to the towers so that might be why I was able to do it and didn't seem to be that big a challenge aside from the puzzle of getting the fasteners installed and tightened in the right order.

Idler

Wish I could add something, but I did the exact thing you did. I bought the kit and spent an afternoon trying to get the same bolts out. Finally decided there was no way I could do it. I thought about attaching the brackets to the floor, even thought about Velcro for them. Then I had an epiphany that I really didn't need those pedals after all.

I was putting them in to give my wife a checkout. My solution was to sit in the back with just a stick and talk her through the flights. She knew how much power to add if we were getting low or how hard to push on the rudders by the tone of my voice. High pitched squeals from me with the general vocal patterns of, "power!" would generally suffice to get said response. Rudder movement was about the same. We're still married and she can fly it now, so I guess that's a success, even if I do have a few more grey hairs after the experience!

Good luck in whatever you do.

I was finally able to remove the two bolts in question. I did this by using a machined-down 3/8" crowfoot adapter connected to a 1/4" to 3/8" drive adapter (so I could use a smaller ratchet which is the only thing that would fit) and a 1-1/2" extension....that and a lot of sweat, some expletives, and planking.

@cjhammes: no 12 year old takers
@xblueh2o: I believe it would be much easier with the access mod. I didn't have to sequence any hardware to get it out, the challenge was just to reach the nut (pretty much every other nut inside the gear tower is easier to get to). An access cover was my next plan, and may still have to happen to replace the hardware!
@oaklandaviator: That's pretty brave of you and your wife!

What do folks think about replacing the bolts so that the nut is on the outside and using a guide wire to pull the bolt through from the inside after machining a groove in the end of the bolt to facilitate tightening/loosening from outside the gear tower? (sorry about the ROS)

finished

For anyone that wants to add rudder pedals to a flying RV-8, and doesn't have very small hands and twiggy arms here's what ultimately worked for me:

I removed the bolts mentioned at the top of the thread with a crowfoot adapter as described in my previous post.

After match drilling the idler brackets per Van's instructions, it then tried to replace the bolts. On the right side I was able to get a nut started on the bolt, on the left side it was impossible to do this because I just couldn't fit my hand in with all the fuel lines, static lines, battery cable, etc.

So, I reversed the bolt and put the head in first. Before re-installing, I cut a slot in the threaded end of the bolt adequate to accept a straight-bladed screw driver to facilitate reaction torque needed to secure the fastener later. I then took a 1-foot length of vinyl electrical tape and wrapped one end around the threads so that the axis of the bolt was aligned with the length of the tape. A piece of safety wire was fished through the hole from the outside of the gear tower, then easily retrieved and pulled through the one of the large openings in the tower. This wire was then secured to the other end of the electrical tape. I used this to pull the bolt thread-end first into the hole in the weldment that mates with the idler bracket. Once this was done, the idler bracket was placed over the bolt and then the washer and nut were threaded on with a screwdriver in the newly added slot and a box-end wrench to tighten the assembly. I was careful that there was at least two threads exposed past the nut and beneath the slot.

The whole thing took a few minutes. If I had it all to do again, I would just drill out the bolts instead of spending many hours trying to get a wrench on the nuts inside the gear tower (although, if you do have a 12 year old, it would probably work for this step), then just do the above process to re-install.

R/Tony