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  #1  
Old 04-04-2017, 12:51 PM
RV7a Newbie RV7a Newbie is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Ireland
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Default RIVETING ISSUE Advice gladly taken

Hi folks

Recently riveted my HS skeleton together, noticing about 4-5 rivets that needed redoing

The problem i have is that I drilled out a corner rivet that keeps the hs0005 and the doubler and the spar and the support bar together, when the rivet came out Ive noticed that ive distorted the hole and the rivet is not as snug

Whats the best way to approach this, Ive tryed another rivet, but it doesnt seem to set aswell as the rest

Appreciate the help

David , Ireland
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  #2  
Old 04-04-2017, 01:20 PM
BillL BillL is offline
 
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Without a picture to judge it would be hard to say either here or at Vans. A close up of both sides with a scale will help. You might also send it to Vans Support, especially since it is in the doubler. This is an important area. I was performing the SB and resulted in using a -5 rivet as the -4 hole had become a -4.7 after drilling.
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  #3  
Old 04-04-2017, 01:54 PM
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wirejock wirejock is offline
 
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Default Rivet hole

Also, a measurement with a caliper accross the widest point. Rivet holes have a maximum dimension.
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Old 04-04-2017, 02:07 PM
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JonJay JonJay is offline
 
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Before you go any further, resource AC-43-13-1b and/or the Mil Specs on Vansaircraft. They list the acceptable hole size for a given rivet. If it is within spec, drive a rivet and move on.
Also, search this site on how to properly drill out a rivet. You should never have a damaged hole if your technique is good.

As far as the riveting is concerned, 90% of the time bad rivet sets, if your shooting them, are a result of not clamping the work down solidly. As Bill mentions, pictures might help diagnose.
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  #5  
Old 04-04-2017, 04:33 PM
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ppilotmike ppilotmike is offline
 
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Default Oops rivets..

..might be the answer for you too. The idea is that you drill out the hole to the next larger size #30 and then set an "oops rivet," which has the same head as a -3 rivet, but the shank of a -4. I'm not sure if they make oops rivets for universal head, but they definitely make them for flush heads...
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  #6  
Old 04-04-2017, 04:54 PM
BobTurner BobTurner is offline
 
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It's the spar: call or email Vans and ask them. Send a photo.
If there's sufficient edge distance they may just say to re-drill, going up one size in diameter.
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Old 04-04-2017, 08:31 PM
rapid_ascent rapid_ascent is offline
 
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One thing that I've found helpful when drilling out rivets is to use lower air pressure. The drill has less torque and it's easier to get started in the right spot. Also the drill will drill slower and this let's you stop before you have a big problem. If you do end up off center you can correct a little by angling the drill before the hole gets too deep. Then straighten up the drill once you have corrected.

Having a good drill helps. I have a Souix 1412 and it has a good trigger. I started with another cheaper brand and I couldn't feather the trigger very well. It required too much pressure to get the drill spinning. I recently had to go back to that drill while my Souix was being serviced. It reminded why I hated it in the first place.:
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  #8  
Old 04-05-2017, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobTurner View Post
It's the spar: call or email Vans and ask them. Send a photo.
If there's sufficient edge distance they may just say to re-drill, going up one size in diameter.
I didn't catch that it's part of the HS spar assembly. Probably the rivets are -4 universals already then, so an Oops rivet is not an option. It's likely, if there is enough edge distance, that they will up-size the rivet to a -5 shank.

Yup. Time to call Vans for direction...
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  #9  
Old 04-05-2017, 11:15 AM
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When I did the SB on the HS I measured the rivets that I took out, (clean) removal, I discovered that when you set a rivet, the rivet will expand and fill the hole, and will expand that hole slightly, I was seeing on the average of .008 to .010 increase with a -4 rivet and that hole.
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Old 04-05-2017, 11:17 AM
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JonJay JonJay is offline
 
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You don't need to call Vans if the hole is within spec. There are ready resources out there that everyone should have at hand;

Builders Manual
VansAircraft Web Site with links to Mil Specs
AC-43-13-1b

Again, if the hole meets spec, drive the rivet and move on. If it doesn't, then yes, a call to Vans on a repair strategy would be in order on any spar.
There is quite a bit of tolerance in what is acceptable regarding the hole. You may need to "preset" the rivet slightly to swell it prior to the final drive. That helps.

Perhaps I was lucky, perhaps "back in the day" we didn't know what an OOPS rivet was, but I don't have a single one in my airframe. Not bragging. I messed up plenty, just didn't use an OOPS rivet as a strategy for a repair.
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