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  #11  
Old 03-29-2017, 11:43 AM
sumitku sumitku is offline
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Victoria, BC
Posts: 30
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Jerry, thanks for the tip and noted. The videos work for non-members. In reviewing them now it's very helpful. The one thing I'm noting is that most of the rib warps I'm seeing in the videos that are corrected by fluting seem to start in the opposite way to what mine look like untouched.

I think I'm probably deep into the over thinking category here.
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  #12  
Old 03-29-2017, 01:06 PM
60av8tor 60av8tor is offline
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Richmond Hill, Ga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sumitku View Post
The one thing I'm noting is that most of the rib warps I'm seeing in the videos that are corrected by fluting seem to start in the opposite way to what mine look like untouched.

I think I'm probably deep into the over thinking category here.

This is one of those topics that is difficult to describe on the internet, but could be grasped very easily in person if there is a fellow builder near by. Excuse my crude drawing, but I'm travelling and had to use paint, so the lines aren't the best, but I think they will explain the scenario. You said your flange is bent in the opposite direction as the one in the video - not really. It is if you're looking at the lower blue line. To fix that you could probably just bend it slightly by hand as there is a large break in the flange in the middle. The part you are trying to correct are the two upper red lines that are, in fact, bent in the same direction as the flange in the video - just not as much. You want the rib to lay flat, but more so, you want the holes - the rivet line - to be straight, so you're not forcing clecos into the work with undo pressures. Think about what's happening when you flute that flange - the slight divet you make in the flange is effectively shortening it's length, which will pull up both ends (red arrows) and align the rivet holes in the flange. As a previous poster mentioned, easy does it. A little bit of fluting goes a long way.


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  #13  
Old 03-29-2017, 01:19 PM
sumitku sumitku is offline
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Victoria, BC
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Jon,

Really grateful for time taken to explain at length and draw something for me. Hope I can pay this all forward someday!

Yes you hit it spot on. I wasn't doing a great job with words, but indeed the red upper lines are bowed in the same direction as the videos showing the fluting will correct those, and the blue line is the opposite overall trend in the rib which looks like it's all caused by the web right at the midpoint.

So I will (1) try to bend out the blue line curve by hand, probably against the edge of a bench where I'll be bending the actual web of the rib to reverse the blue line, and then (2) lightly flute to aim for the red line curves.

I need to deburr that rib first and will give it a go and then post my results.

Thanks again,

Sumit
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  #14  
Old 04-11-2017, 01:53 PM
sumitku sumitku is offline
 
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Location: Victoria, BC
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Guys,

Here's where I ended up. I did ping Van's and they said I can straighten the web in the middle and then flute or just flute and let the clecos straighten that inverse bend.

I did try a bit of work on the web, but got to diminishing returns on that being able to totally correct the blue profile which I'm now not convinced isn't just twist or something else. I didn't want to go too far so left them and focused on the red profiles correctable by fluting.

What do you guys think?

Thanks!





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  #15  
Old 04-11-2017, 02:13 PM
E. D. Eliot E. D. Eliot is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: San Pedro
Posts: 808
Default Get a mentor!!!

I started my RV-12 build a year ago. Progress was slowwwww. Primarily because I was somewhat afraid to 'just do it'.

Found a person who was willing to tutor me at home in my garage where I am building my 12.

Fluting is just about the simplest skill to learn during your build. There are much greater challenges ahead - I consider a mentor to be absolutely necessary for me and recommend the idea to all beginner kit builders. You will finish faster and the aircraft will be better built. You will ruin fewer pieces of aluminum and consequently, not have to send Van's $$$ for replacement parts.

Recently, I became aware of a partial kit that was 'put together' by someone who either did not know better or (did not give a d**n) - the riveting was pathetic. Those parts were ugly and obviously not airworthy. Can't help but think that a mentor would have helped this guy a lot. As it was, he had about $20 of scrap aluminum in what he was calling a wing and empennage parts - really pathetic and sad.
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  #16  
Old 04-11-2017, 06:27 PM
JDA_BTR JDA_BTR is offline
 
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Location: Baton Rouge, LA
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For me, I find that a steel ruler will show if the holes along a flange are in a straight line. The forming process usually causes an arc and the holes sweep away from the web. Fluting makes the outside edge shorter, bringing the holes back toward the web. Flute carefully so the holes are in a good straight line. Overfluting will be seen as a hole too close to the web. Ultimately if all the holes are lined up with the piece they mate too it is done right.

Most of my pieces don't lie flat on the table after fluting - that isn't the goal really. Straight lines for the holes is the main goal. The web can be flexed one way or the other and in assembly that gets straightened out; it won't lay flat because of that sometimes.
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  #17  
Old 04-12-2017, 10:47 AM
sumitku sumitku is offline
 
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E.D. thanks for the advice and noted. I did give that some thought to this point and have struggled to find someone local. We don't have an EAA chapter anywhere nearby. I think I'll reinvigorate that effort the next time I find myself stumped.

JDA, thanks for the explanation and yes I think I've reached the conclusion also that the web may not lay flat and keeping the flange holes straight is the only goal. With that said, from the pics do you think I've achieved that? To my eye, and with a straight edge laid across, they look fairly well aligned.
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  #18  
Old 04-12-2017, 11:05 AM
alpinelakespilot2000 alpinelakespilot2000 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E. D. Eliot View Post
Fluting is just about the simplest skill to learn during your build. There are much greater challenges ahead - I consider a mentor to be absolutely necessary for me and recommend the idea to all beginner kit builders. You will finish faster and the aircraft will be better built. You will ruin fewer pieces of aluminum and consequently, not have to send Van's $$$ for replacement parts.
Ditto this advice, but I would go a step further. You're going to spend at least $60K to build an airplane, why not invest one weekend (or even one day) and one or two hundred bucks on a basic build course. Yes, you may have to drive a couple hours to get to one, and maybe spring for one night in a hotel, but I would argue the amount you are going to save in parts that you will not have to replace will more than make up for it. Moreover, you'll also be then able to build a better (and safer) airplane. Good luck, and have fun.
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  #19  
Old 04-12-2017, 12:49 PM
JDA_BTR JDA_BTR is offline
 
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Cleco it to the skin and see if the holes line up. You are your best quality control.
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  #20  
Old 04-12-2017, 12:59 PM
sumitku sumitku is offline
 
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Will do, and note to self "stop looking for spoon feeding!"
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