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  #1  
Old 11-08-2018, 09:09 AM
dabney dabney is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: valencia, ca
Posts: 156
Default Flight training in ELSA. IS IT ALLOWED?

I am on the verge of buying a RV12 ELSA for the purpose of teaching my daughter to fly. I am a sport pilot instructor.

Yesterday I read that the FAA has, or is about to, release a NPRM to allow flight training in ELSA .

1. Can I give my daughter flight training leading to her Sport Pilot airplane certificate?

2. If so, are there DPE’s who will give the check ride in an ELSA?
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  #2  
Old 11-08-2018, 10:42 AM
rocketman1988 rocketman1988 is offline
 
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Location: Sunman, IN
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Default Not sure it is what you want...

"...The FAA has released a notice of proposed rulemaking (NPRM) that supports a crucial EAA ultralight and sport pilot training initiative. The NPRM amends 14 CFR 91.319(e)(2) to allow compensated flight training in experimental light-sport aircraft (E-LSA) in certain circumstances under a letter of deviation authority (LODA).

EAA has long sought an expansion to the FAA’s LODA policy that will allow for more types of training in experimental aircraft, including limited primary training in certain “low mass, high-drag” types to address a lack of available aircraft for sport pilot and ultralight training. The reform to the E-LSA rule will allow a small number of “grandfathered” operators to continue to provide training, and reverses the removal of E-LSAs from the training fleet, as long as the training is conducted under specific, approved conditions.

“The successful publication of this rule and the accompanying policy change will create new opportunities in ultralight and sport pilot training,” said Tom Charpentier, EAA government relations director. “We see ultralights and light-sport aircraft as an increasingly important pathway into aviation, and we are working with the FAA in a variety of ways to remove unnecessary barriers to access. This is one small but important step in that overall process.”

The revised LODA policy will also improve access to amateur-built aircraft transition training. EAA is working with the FAA to publish the policy as soon as practical, possibly in advance of the final E-LSA training rule. Those wishing to comment on the NPRM may do so before November 23..."
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  #3  
Old 11-08-2018, 11:02 AM
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Mike S Mike S is offline
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Location: Dayton Airpark, NV A34
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Default My $0.02

Quote:
Originally Posted by dabney View Post
I am on the verge of buying a RV12 ELSA for the purpose of teaching my daughter to fly. I am a sport pilot instructor.
As I understand it, if it is your plane, and no payment is offered, you should be good to go.
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  #4  
Old 11-08-2018, 11:56 AM
rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Hubbard Oregon
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike S View Post
As I understand it, if it is your plane, and no payment is offered, you should be good to go.
More specifically.... As long as there is no compensation to you for use of the airplane, there is no problem in doing what you want to do. Specific limitations are spelled out in the operating limitations that are part of the 8130-7 (airworthiness certificate) for E-LSA aircraft.

You could receive compensation as a flight instructor while giving training though.

The NPRM you mentioned is related to compensation for use of the aircraft (charging rental fees), and more specifically, for aircraft types were there are no SLSA examples for flight schools to use. An example would be 2 seat ultralights that were originally converted to ELSA's during the transition period, so that they were legal aircraft under the new rules.
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Last edited by rvbuilder2002 : 11-08-2018 at 11:59 AM.
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  #5  
Old 11-08-2018, 12:09 PM
Jimd Jimd is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Central Iowa
Posts: 316
Default Sort of...?

Related to this topic a bit...

Has there been a change to the single pilot restriction during phase I testing that allows two pilots? What if the second pilot is there for dual instruction? I had a query to provide flight training in an owner provided Airplane but it has NOT flown yet.

Sorry for borrowing your thread...


Jim
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  #6  
Old 11-08-2018, 12:37 PM
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Mel Mel is offline
 
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Location: Dallas area
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimd View Post
Related to this topic a bit...
Has there been a change to the single pilot restriction during phase I testing that allows two pilots? What if the second pilot is there for dual instruction? I had a query to provide flight training in an owner provided Airplane but it has NOT flown yet.
Sorry for borrowing your thread...
Jim
Read FAA AC 90-116 carefully. It defines addition pilots who can be on board during phase I. It is restrictive. Flight training is NOT a part of Phase I. This AC also must be listed within the operating limitations for the aircraft.
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  #7  
Old 11-08-2018, 06:55 PM
dabney dabney is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: valencia, ca
Posts: 156
Default Sport pilot checkride in ELSA

Has anybody encountered a problem finding a DPE to perform a sport pilot initial checkride in a RV12?
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  #8  
Old 11-08-2018, 07:53 PM
BlndRvtr BlndRvtr is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: NE Where
Posts: 193
Default DPE and RV12

The only issue I know of regarding a DPE giving a flight check in an RV12 was that the FSDO having jurisdiction over the DPE required the DPE to have 5 hrs. PIC in the make and model of each experimental aircraft they were going to use for a flight check.

Anyone else run into such a stipulation?

George
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  #9  
Old 11-08-2018, 08:11 PM
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DaleB DaleB is offline
 
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Location: Omaha, NE (KMLE)
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlndRvtr View Post
The only issue I know of regarding a DPE giving a flight check in an RV12 was that the FSDO having jurisdiction over the DPE required the DPE to have 5 hrs. PIC in the make and model of each experimental aircraft they were going to use for a flight check.

Anyone else run into such a stipulation?

George
Yes. I flew with the DPE to get his five hours in, so he could give my co-owner his Sport Pilot check ride in the same airplane. Fortunately he didn't need dual instruction... just stick time. In fact, he taught me how to fly from the right seat, and I'm toying with the idea of becoming a Sport Pilot CFI. Little to no practical use for that right now, but if I time it right maybe I can do that to stand in for my next flight review.

Dale
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  #10  
Old 11-08-2018, 09:56 PM
hook hook is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Niceville, FL
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dabney View Post
Has anybody encountered a problem finding a DPE to perform a sport pilot initial checkride in a RV12?
I had a guy do his initial CFI (Subpart-H) in my S-LSA RV-12.
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