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  #11  
Old 10-02-2013, 01:35 PM
TomVal TomVal is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: SC & CA
Posts: 747
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Bruce,

With a glass cockpit, for back-up instruments, take a look at the features of the Stratus II interface with the I-pad (requires Foreflight installed). Sporty's Pilot shop has an excellent presentation of both portable devices and should answer most of your questions.

Btw...we are back in SAN...see you soon.

Tom
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  #12  
Old 10-02-2013, 04:02 PM
Ex Bonanza Bucko Ex Bonanza Bucko is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: San Diego, California
Posts: 291
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Thanks guys. I guess I should have added that I am not interested in Steam gages because I like them but because they don't fail like glass cockpits are bound to.

I guess I'm stuck with electronics in an S-LSA. If I buy an E-LSA there will be steam gages in it.
EBB
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  #13  
Old 10-02-2013, 05:40 PM
sandpiper sandpiper is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Independence, OR
Posts: 301
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ex Bonanza Bucko View Post
Thanks guys. I guess I should have added that I am not interested in Steam gages because I like them but because they don't fail like glass cockpits are bound to.

I guess I'm stuck with electronics in an S-LSA. If I buy an E-LSA there will be steam gages in it.
EBB
You might not be "stuck" if you buy SLSA. Call or write Vans and ask what their policy will be on issuing LOA's. Their answer will, of course, depend on the magnitude of the request. If you want to hang an o-200 on the front, the answer will probably be no. A canopy lock should be approved, maybe even with a fleet approval. A couple of steam gauges? Who knows. The biggest problem with LOA's, I would guess, is that they are not going to want a whole bunch of various modifications for the fleet just to suite the multitude of desires of a diverse bunch of owners. And, each LOA, no matter how simple, takes time and money.
All you can do is ask. The above is just my opinion which is worth exactly what you are paying for it.

And, if you are flying as a light sport pilot, no night or IFR, you should be able to get it down with a dark panel. A portable GPS with a simulated 6 pack would seal the deal.
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  #14  
Old 10-02-2013, 07:06 PM
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Bill_H Bill_H is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Peel, AR
Posts: 1,760
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Lets be clear here for the folks not very familiar he with the -12. In a Skyview installation (not the original D180) The static PORTS are in the tail compartment and route directly to the ADAHRS sensor back there. Wires run from the ADAHRS to the front panel.

The PITOT runs from the prop, back through the panel then aft to the ADAHRS. So you do have PITOT in the panel you could easily tee off from.

The AOA as usually implemented (no Vans SLSA option for that I know of) can be run a variety of ways aft from the left wing root with a quick disconnect there. It goes to the ADAHRs. Many use 1/8 tubing that can be easily routed, even aft under the pilot seat area and under the baggage floor area, below the transverse flaperon tubes, and into the tail to the ADAHRS.

So to get pitot & static both to the panel you only need one line new static line, from the tail up to the panel. If you are building E-LSA you could put in in during the build while it is easy and connect it later, like an extra wire. I don't know if 1/8 tubing would be adequate compared to the normal larger size, perhaps it would for the backup purposes.

Seriously, after time with the SV and realizing it is a VFR plane you will likely dismiss the idea of steam gauge backup. I had many similar ideas since the prior several years before the RV-12 I was also flying a Bonanza IFR. If I was concerned about redundancy, I would spend it on a Garmin 496 or AERA as an independent GPS source. They have the Panel Page display as well.

Shoot - since you have pitot in the panel, why not take static as ambient from the aircraft interior? How off could it be for backup purposes? That would make a good experiment, no tubing run necessary.
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  #15  
Old 10-02-2013, 10:57 PM
Mark Henderson Mark Henderson is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Napa, Calif
Posts: 274
Default Steam is easy

I have an early RV-12 with the D-180. After a total Dynon failure, a low fuel pressure alarm, and a friend with a total oil pressure indication failure, I added steam gauges. I had an altimeter, I bought a new UMA ASI with correct markings, and mechanical fuel and oil pressure gauges off Ebay. The latter 2 were also UMA, but new. The total cost was under $300, including the metal for a new right panel.

Have I needed them since, No! Did I have fun installing them, Yes! Would I do it again, Yes. In bright Calif sun, they are always easy to read. Dynon, not so good. There have been times that the Dynon seemed a bit optimistic, but the steam say they are right on.

A compass in Calif is not needed. The ocean is to the west, the Sierra Nevada mountains are to the east. North and south are not much more complicated. I do like knowing I have oil and fuel pressure. The ASI sometimes. If I had not had the altimeter I would not have bothered. But the bottom line, it was fun to install.

Just my 2 cents
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  #16  
Old 10-03-2013, 02:01 AM
crashley crashley is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: hazelwood north vic
Posts: 158
Default back up guages

I believe most problems with speed and altimeters are related to static and pitot tubes and ports so just teeing off to back up gauges is not really giving you true redundancy To give a true back up system you could install extra static and pitot tubes I am thinking of installing the a of a in the wing which would leave the original pitot in the spinner available for a back up airspeed indicator
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  #17  
Old 10-03-2013, 08:17 AM
Ex Bonanza Bucko Ex Bonanza Bucko is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: San Diego, California
Posts: 291
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Tom:
I have a spare Garmin Area 796 that used to be in the Bonanza. I think I'll put that in the new RV12 as a backup. It's really not needed with the newest D1000 Skyview but it would provide GPS derived altitude and airspeed in a failure of the Skyview. Obviously I ain't gonna fly IFR so the backup is probably not needed.....I've been flying by the seat of the pants for years and years anyhow:-).

EBB
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  #18  
Old 10-03-2013, 08:49 AM
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DonFromTX DonFromTX is offline
 
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Location: La Feria Texas
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I initially installed a backup altimeter and airspeed. I have since removed them and my backup is a Dynon D1 and an IPad.
Sure, no airspeed, but I can live with just GPS ground speed and a little common sense, plus the D1 even helps me to keep right side up if I get into a little haze or cloud..
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  #19  
Old 11-14-2013, 12:10 PM
Driftdown Driftdown is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Clearwater, Florida
Posts: 295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonFromTX View Post
I initially installed a backup altimeter and airspeed. I have since removed them and my backup is a Dynon D1 and an IPad.
Sure, no airspeed, but I can live with just GPS ground speed and a little common sense, plus the D1 even helps me to keep right side up if I get into a little haze or cloud..
Don,

Have you checked out the new D2?
Pretty good stuff.
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  #20  
Old 11-14-2013, 02:05 PM
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DonFromTX DonFromTX is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: La Feria Texas
Posts: 3,635
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No, I guess I feel ripped off. They dropped the price of the D1 from what I paid, and came up with the D2, before I even got to fly with my D1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Driftdown View Post
Don,

Have you checked out the new D2?
Pretty good stuff.
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A&P, PP-SEL, Pathological Flier, EAA Technical Counselor
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