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  #21  
Old 10-07-2017, 04:23 PM
Nova RV Nova RV is offline
 
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Location: Leesburg, VA
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I don't understand why someone asks for data from actual users of a product has his thread filled with sales pitches and testimonials for a different product which is "better"? Can't we limit that to A vs. B threads? I am thinking of going with 2 P-Mags and would love to see more actual responses about P-Mags.
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Leesburg, VA
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  #22  
Old 10-07-2017, 06:47 PM
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Toobuilder Toobuilder is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nova RV View Post
I don't understand why someone asks for data from actual users of a product has his thread filled with sales pitches and testimonials for a different product which is "better"? Can't we limit that to A vs. B threads? I am thinking of going with 2 P-Mags and would love to see more actual responses about P-Mags.
Chris, this forum is about information good and bad. If your mind is made up, then why are you looking at this thread? Are you seeking further justification for your choice?

I've flown behind P-mags for 600+ hours with zero reliability issues. Is that all you want to hear? Should the limitations of a product be avoided just to avoid hurting someones feelings?
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WARNING! Incorrect design and/or fabrication of aircraft and/or components may result in injury or death. Information presented in this post is based on my own experience - Reader has sole responsibility for determining accuracy or suitability for use.

Michael Robinson
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Harmon Rocket II -SDS EFI instalation in work
RV-8 - Flying
1940 Taylorcraft BL-65 -flying
PA-20-inspired "family truckster" -in work
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  #23  
Old 10-07-2017, 07:51 PM
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tommylewis tommylewis is online now
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
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Default My experience

My RV7a flew in April 2007 with dual PMAGs and on our flight up to NE last week we turned over 1600 hours on those dual PMAGs. I have had all the updates made during those years and have never been stranded anywhere. I would use them again if I were making the decision again this year.
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  #24  
Old 10-07-2017, 08:45 PM
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N941WR N941WR is offline
 
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Location: SC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nova RV View Post
I don't understand why someone asks for data from actual users of a product has his thread filled with sales pitches and testimonials for a different product which is "better"? Can't we limit that to A vs. B threads? I am thinking of going with 2 P-Mags and would love to see more actual responses about P-Mags.

I have to agree with this post.

The anti P-mag posts have gotten to the point where I am reluctant to reply to any P-mag thread.

The OP asked about P-mag reliability and we get multiple posts about how product X is better and verbal attacks on P-mag users.

The P-mags are great ignitions and way ahead of magnetos. Do they extract maximum performance out of an engine, no; however, neither does the ignition in your car or truck.

What they are is easy to install, improve engine performance, and have developed into a reliable ignition.

For that you trade in the ability to custom tune them for every MAP/RPM setting available and fewer parts and connections, which are prone to fail.

Because of the recent attacks on proponents of P-mag ignitions, this long time VAF contributor has simply stopped contributing.
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Bill R.
RV-9 (Yes, it's a dragon tail)
O-360 w/ dual P-mags
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Last edited by N941WR : 10-08-2017 at 09:25 AM.
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  #25  
Old 10-07-2017, 09:12 PM
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N941WR N941WR is offline
 
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You are a perfect candidate for one of our EIC's. It would have picked up the shaft bearing issues and allowed you to test different configurations.

-4.2 degree shift is what I typically recommend for a "stock" angle valve engine. Did you also reduce your max advance by the same amount?


Quote:
Originally Posted by schristo@mac.com View Post
I like them. I started with traditional mags, switched to one Pmag after 300 hours, then swapped the second out after another 100. Now, with over 1600 hours, I have quite a bit of time evaluating them.

The early issues that were uncovered as the number in the field increased have been addressed with minor modifications and a few program updates. Rather than adding timing features they have chosen to keep the product stable with reliability focused updates. I use the windows EICAD program with a laptop to adjust the parameters but it would be nice to have more options for managing the advance.

One of my old units had started to give an occasional 'magnet out of range error' that prompted my need to get a replacement in hand in a bit of a scramble right before Reno...

Comparing the new one to the old ones... most notably, both of the old units have developed quite a bit of shaft play. I look forward to seeing what the serviced unit looks like when it makes its way back shortly.

I have had an an occasional (perhaps four times) boot up failure that is reportedly addressed with v40+ firmware. Each time it was resolved by shutting down and re-timing.

One coil pack developed a dead post... I received a replacement.

Much later, one coil pack, on two posts, started arcing a bit with the plug wires... this eventually led to an intermittent spark. I suspect that the root issue was a combination of a lack of dielectric paste and a loose attachment. After replacing the plugs, wires, and cleaning the posts it all worked fine. I use dielectric grease now and ensure that the plug end is firmly attaching to the post.

I have spent quite a bit of time with the advance in search of any top end speed... my advance is set at -4.2
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Bill R.
RV-9 (Yes, it's a dragon tail)
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Build the plane you want, not the plane others want you to build!
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www.repucci.com/bill/baf.html
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  #26  
Old 10-07-2017, 11:44 PM
Bevan Bevan is offline
 
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Before first flight, my mid time engine was modified with for fuel injection and dual pmags. 150+ hrs now troublefree. I like the performance, ease of install and maintenance, less weight, and customer support. I've called the factory twice in two years. On the first call, the owner gave me almost an hour of his time on the phone as I had install questions and he gave copious amounts of background for the design and evolution. I thought this was very nice and unexpected. The second call was the result of a fault code which he suggested sending both in for the V40 upgrade and checkup. This was a no cost to me including return shipping despite being out of warranty as I bought the p-mags from another builder. I love my P-mags.

Bevan.
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  #27  
Old 10-08-2017, 12:04 AM
Captain Avgas Captain Avgas is offline
 
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Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nova RV View Post
I don't understand why someone asks for data from actual users of a product has his thread filled with sales pitches and testimonials for a different product which is "better"? Can't we limit that to A vs. B threads? I am thinking of going with 2 P-Mags and would love to see more actual responses about P-Mags.
I'm sorry but the above statement is inappropriate . The OP in fact was asking for information by which he could evaluate several systems. He was not asking solely for P-MAG reviews. Therefore a comparison between other systems is entirely appropriate in this thread. I refer to his post:

I’ve priced out 3 options.

2 Slick Mags - $2500
2 P-MAG’s - $3200
G3I Ignition - $4600
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Last edited by Captain Avgas : 10-08-2017 at 12:12 AM.
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  #28  
Old 10-08-2017, 01:13 AM
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Toobuilder Toobuilder is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Avgas View Post
I'm sorry but the above statement is inappropriate . The OP in fact was asking for information by which he could evaluate several systems...
Absolutely. Any search of this forum would show that I'm a long time P-mag user and supporter. The company is great and I couldnt be happier with thier customer service. BUT, times change and so does customer expectation. P-mag has been great to me but the fact is there is now a better product out there. After all, Dynon does not soldier on with the D-100 line in the face of Garmins onslaught, right? P-mag was a great ignition once but that stagnation has simply been overtaken by SDS. Not my fault that P-mag is resting on their laurals... Its their choice. If Ross decides to kick back and coast on his existing product then he will eventually be eclipsed... Simple fact of life. If someone is searching for an ignition, I'm going to point them in the "best" direction.

I've burned a lot of avgas testing P-mags and CPI and if the P-mag comes out second, thats not "P-mag bashing" thats just reporting the facts. If someone doesnt like my reporting, they are certainly free to produce contradicting evidence or ignore my posts. No skin off my back, I know the truth.
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WARNING! Incorrect design and/or fabrication of aircraft and/or components may result in injury or death. Information presented in this post is based on my own experience - Reader has sole responsibility for determining accuracy or suitability for use.

Michael Robinson
______________
Harmon Rocket II -SDS EFI instalation in work
RV-8 - Flying
1940 Taylorcraft BL-65 -flying
PA-20-inspired "family truckster" -in work
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  #29  
Old 10-08-2017, 02:27 AM
SHIPCHIEF SHIPCHIEF is offline
 
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For CPI to fit the OP's bill, you would have to add a redundant power source, and I don't mean a back up battery.
A B&C vacuum pad alternator would 'almost' fit the bill, but it is a single power source, so it's still a little short of the 'self powered' spec for dual ignitions.
CPI single unit ($1170) dual unit ($2275?)
B&C SD-8 with PMR1C-14 and 504-1 (14v) ($545.00)
Total: Single: $1715 dual: $2850
Still in the ball park price-wise, The Dual CPI option is a better price, but if it's a 'one casing device' might lack the redundancy the OP desires.
I run a Pmag and a Bendix mag on my RV-8 and my T-18, a noticeable improvement over 2 mags.
I'm also slowly accumulating parts for a Ford EDIS (possibly with MegaJolt) system. I would probably add the B&C SD8, because I also use dual automotive electric fuel pumps to AFP mechanical fuel injection. I probably have added risk with a single battery system.
An interesting discussion.
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  #30  
Old 10-08-2017, 04:41 AM
WAM120RV WAM120RV is offline
 
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Location: Coventry. England
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Default Ignition choices and P Mag reliability

Mags...... Whe you have run on mags and have the ability to use EI they are chalk and cheese. My original set up was one mag and a Lightspeedaviation. On the mag the engine was very rough compared with the LS. Less power more fuel consumption poorer starting.

When my LS started playing up I initially ran one Pmag and a mag, I was back to where I was before, smooth on th Pmag drop in power when just on the mag, no drop in power or performance when just on the p mag,

I then went to two PMags and set up the most advanced curve. I now had an engine that was smooth on both ignitions if run independently and was happy.

I then added Bills EI commander and on his recommendation moved to the less aggressive curve. There was a noticeable increase in power, EGT and CHT were slightly better, not that they were bad before. Reliability is spot on!

Why did I not go for the crank sensor type of ignition again, well in my view the failure of a single crank sensor could leave you struggling to make it home to the airfield. The failure of a single p mag would still have the engine running smoothly till you got home.

Is the P mag curve totally optimum, probably not but its light years ahead of mags. Do I want to be able to fine tune it myself, well I can because of the EIC but would I want to in flight...like most pilots the answer is no.

To be frank what Michael is doing is well beyond the capability and interest of most pilots, all they want is a good reliably ignition and P Mags are exactly that.
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Steve Arnold
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In completion stage of Loehle P5151
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