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Normal takeoff

Mike Coady

Well Known Member
Question about normal takeoff. I flew my RV7A for the first time four days ago. Subsequently I've had two more flights . On each takeoff, I notice a real tendency for high nose up pitch at rotation. I've flown about a dozen or more types of aircraft and this seems more noticable in the RV. I flew another friends RV noticing the same. Upon liftoff, I have to nose it over pretty good as to not over rotate. In cruise flight, climb,etc , all is excellent hands off. I am 245lb with half tanks of fuel. Cg is nearly centered. Anybody else notice this? Ideas? Or is it simply an RV trait?
 
Question about normal takeoff. I flew my RV7A for the first time four days ago. Subsequently I've had two more flights . On each takeoff, I notice a real tendency for high nose up pitch at rotation. I've flown about a dozen or more types of aircraft and this seems more noticable in the RV. I flew another friends RV noticing the same. Upon liftoff, I have to nose it over pretty good as to not over rotate. In cruise flight, climb,etc , all is excellent hands off. I am 245lb with half tanks of fuel. Cg is nearly centered. Anybody else notice this? Ideas? Or is it simply an RV trait?

Take off trim setting, whatever you're using, is too nose up.
 
And in the climb out aim for around 110-115 knots, not 85.

The secret is to get to about 50 knots and apply just enough back pressure to take the weight but not let the nose come off. As the speed builds more the aircraft is in the flying attitude and it will gracefully leave the runway. No need to yank it off.

Now the actual speed I have no idea, I do it by feel, but you will get the feel soon enough. In the RV10 this is about 60 knots, and it flies about 70?or near enough depending on weight. The -7 is about 10 less.

Enjoy the new machine??..no doubt you still have the RV:D
 
When I started to learn to fly my -7 I felt some of the same tendency, however, it was me wanting to pull the plane off the runway. I was so used to flying Cessnas (310s, 210s, 182s) that my first reaction was to yank it off the runway. The controls are so light comparing to other planes that I've flown that I had to tell myself for the first 50 or so take offs that just let it come off the ground. Make sure you don't skip the part of your check list to ensure Trim setting are set to neutral. Hold that neutral attitude and the -7 will fly off the ground gracefully at 50knots. If your CG and Trim are correct you should be able to keep the same attitude to cruise climb speed, if not, you will obviously trim the nose down....:p
Congrats and keep flying that awesome machine, you will get used to it in short time.
 
OK,

No Flaming......

I fly a 7 - tailwheel.

We are not performance limited but operate off 2700' of tarmac.

Take off power is done to a slow count of 3.

No swing, gentle on the motor, less noise.

Set a trim around neutral, let the force be strong and it will levitate when it is good and ready.

Don't yark it off - there is no need, we are at one with our airplane and the enjoyment of flight begins.

For the rest, ask another question..... :D

I guess it is a Zen thing.
 
Mike, the other Mike is flying a nose wheel------totally different style of takeoff.

Mike
 
As taught by Mike Seager.........

On each takeoff, I notice a real tendency for high nose up pitch at rotation.

"Rotation" is the problem, start with the stick in your lap, apply power, ease off the back pressure as the nose comes off, keep the nose wheel just above the runway and hold that attitude -------the plane will do the rest.
 
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Still works on a nose thingy watchacallit....

Zen rules

I admit, that with a trainer wheel, there is less swing.

I find on the A330, there is virtually no swing at all when 137,00lbs of thrust is applied :eek:

However... If it goes wrong below 100kts - Oh My......

Pay attention.
 
Not really. Either way, get the 3rd wheel off the ground a few inches, hold attitude, let it fly itself off.

So, you also start with the stick in your belly as you apply T/O power?? And then ease off the back pressure as the tail comes up??
 
"Rotation" is the problem, start with the stick in your lap, apply power, ease off the back pressure as the nose comes off, keep the nose wheel just above the runway and hold that attitude -------the plane will do the rest.

Plus 1 Mike. Every takeoff of mine is a soft field exactly as Mike describes. I fly off a 2,000' grass strip but use the same technique on pavement.
 
Takeoffs RV7A

Thank you all for the advice. I'm finding that it just takes less back pressure. As I lift the nose early in the run, it feels heavy but can quickly go from heavy to Launch. I'm finding that just a little pressure and holding It Let's it come off a little flatter and then I'm trimming for proper climb. What a fun plane this is. During the five years of building there were times I almost quit. Wow! I am soooo glad I stuck with it. This is going to be the best plane I've ever flown I believe. Can't wait until the next flight!
2.9 hrs in N771MK
years to go
Mike
 
Thank you all for the advice. I'm finding that it just takes less back pressure. As I lift the nose early in the run, it feels heavy but can quickly go from heavy to Launch. I'm finding that just a little pressure and holding It Let's it come off a little flatter and then I'm trimming for proper climb. What a fun plane this is. During the five years of building there were times I almost quit. Wow! I am soooo glad I stuck with it. This is going to be the best plane I've ever flown I believe. Can't wait until the next flight!
2.9 hrs in N771MK
years to go
Mike

Ya, RV's are very light on the controls. Finger tips is all you need. If you've been flying most average GA a/c, what you're used to as far as pull back for take off, in an RV is really just a slight tug with two fingers.

Enjoy. They really are about as close as you can get to the feel of a fighter without the fuel bill.
 
So, you also start with the stick in your belly as you apply T/O power?? And then ease off the back pressure as the tail comes up??

Yep, that is how you fly any airplane, TW or NW. The only difference is that you might push forward to lift the tail at the start of the roll but then set up the nose up/tail low attitude for the rest of the takeoff roll.
 
I'm finding that just a little pressure and holding It Let's it come off a little flatter and then I'm trimming for proper climb.

Take the time to figure out proper climb trim so you can set it before takeoff so the plane will be stabilized as climb is initiated.

Have fun!
 
I apparently do my hard runway takeoffs in the -6 very different than the rest of y'all... I start with the stick full back plus crosswind input, smoothly add power over three or four seconds. When airspeed comes alive, I push forward and bring the aircraft level, then at 70kt I ease back just a hair and it flies right off.

On the few occasions I've flown off grass, I'll use half flaps, keep the tail low, and let it lift off into ground effect, and accelerate from there.
 
Thanks, been waiting for tail wheel folks to admit they push the stick on takeoff.

The only difference is that you might push forward to lift the tail at the start of the roll

I push forward and bring the aircraft level,

And that is exactly the difference I was referring to in my post on the first page that got this nonsense started.

Nose wheel ----------- pull back.

Tail wheel------------push forward.

Mike, the other Mike is flying a nose wheel------totally different style of takeoff.

Mike
 
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I apparently do my hard runway takeoffs in the -6 very different than the rest of y'all... I start with the stick full back plus crosswind input, smoothly add power over three or four seconds. When airspeed comes alive, I push forward and bring the aircraft level, then at 70kt I ease back just a hair and it flies right off.

That method is a more mechanical "numbers" method. That works. Takeoff technique is purely a matter of style is doesn't matter much. Raising the tail a few inches and holding an attitude until it's ready to fly appeals more to my aesthetic, "artful flying" values. I bet that sounds snobbish. :) No need to put your eyeballs inside the cockpit, and the airplane will fly when it's ready - no matter the W&B or density altitude conditions. Or you can jack the tail high, run along on the mains, watching the ASI until well above flying speed and then lift it off. That gets the job done too.

Thanks, been waiting for tail wheel folks to admit they push the stick on takeoff.

Whew, glad we finally got that resolved. :) I was wondering why the nose gear never came off the ground last time I flew a trike. :D
 
So, you also start with the stick in your belly as you apply T/O power?? And then ease off the back pressure as the tail comes up??

I put power, and immediately pull full down. tail wheel starts up i release back pressure just enough to keep tail wheel up the wait for it to rotate.
 
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I put power, and immediately pull full up. Tail wheel starts up I release back pressure just enough to keep tail wheel up then wait for it to rotate. Just so smooth. As a matter of fact that's pretty much the same thing with my 172. Power, full up, raise nose wheel, release some back pressure, rotate. You're correct, they are pretty much the same.;)

Huh? If you pull full up, the tail wheel will never come up!
I think you mean "push forward" (down elevator).
 
Might as well chime in...

From transition training w/ Mike Seager, it was

Stick all the way back while taxiing to keep the nose wheel light (we'll defer discussion of quartering headwinds and tailwinds and all that for now)
On the runway, stick back, a little power to start the roll *and straighten out the nosegear*, then smoothly apply power (quick cross-check of gauges), and at the same time
Stick to neutral, and almost immediately just slightly aft for some nose-up (again, keep it light on the nosewheel); nosewheel comes up a bit, hold that and let it fly off.

Easy peasy lemon squeezy. :)
 
Tailwheel RV-6 here... Unless doing a soft/rough field takeoff, I always just hold the stick neutral and when it lifts off , a bit of forward stick to level it off in ground effect until speed builds up past Vy. The wing knows when it's ready to fly better than I do.

For soft/rough fields, I put in ~ 10 degrees of flaps (flap == to aileron full down deflection) and hold the stick full back, and when it lifts off, stick forward to hold it in ground effect to build speed, then climb initially at Vx and retract flaps before I get past Vfe, then resume climbing "normally" (whatever speed that may end up being, depending on conditions).
 
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And in the climb out aim for around 110-115 knots, not 85.

The secret is to get to about 50 knots and apply just enough back pressure to take the weight but not let the nose come off. As the speed builds more the aircraft is in the flying attitude and it will gracefully leave the runway. No need to yank it off.

Now the actual speed I have no idea, I do it by feel, but you will get the feel soon enough. In the RV10 this is about 60 knots, and it flies about 70?or near enough depending on weight. The -7 is about 10 less.

Enjoy the new machine??..no doubt you still have the RV:D

+1 here, 90% of my take offs are from grass,
Stick all the way back while taxiing to keep the nose wheel light
 
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