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New Dual Band ADS-B Receiver from Dynon and AFS

Dynon

Well Known Member
Advertiser
New from Dynon: The SV-ADSB-472 Dual Band ADS-B Traffic and Weather Receiver. With a smaller footprint, lower price, and reception on both 978 MHz (UAT) and 1090 MHz ADS-B frequencies, the SV-ADS-472 offers superior ADS-B reception for SkyView and AF-5000 pilots.

Already own an SV-ADSB-470? We have an affordable trade-in program if you'd like to upgrade.


SV-ADSB-472Dual-07.png

SV-ADSB-472Dual-01.png


Michael Schofield
 
Kudos to Dynon for coming out with an improved product at a reduced price. I love the new size too.
 
SV-ADSB-472 with AF-5000 screens

This is an EFIS screen capture from the other night flying with the new SV-ADSB-472 . I have found that the traffic around KHIO works a lot better with the dual band receiver.

33457653902_c19e561ac4_o.jpg


Rob Hickman
Advanced Flight Systems
N402RH RV-10
 
Just in time

Yay! I just ordered my ADSB-470 2 days ago. </sarcasm>

Luckily Pacific Coast Avionics was out of stock and backordred one. I called back today, and they are making the swap.

I totally understand why companies don't "pre-announce" products, but I sure wish Dynon would, similar to what they did on the HDX. It made the world of difference to me. Had they not done that with the HDX I would have felt very burned.

I have to say that their upgrade program is pretty nice.
 
Chuck,
Our solution to not pre-announcing was that all orders since Dec 1st get a free upgrade, so that nobody that ordered one in the last 100 days feels burned.
 
Michael,
Question: would I get the full dual-band benefit of this unit even though I have the older SV GPS? Or does it require the Skyview ADSB-out GPS to enjoy full functionality?
 
Yes. And an aircraft equipped with an SV-GPS-250 (and SV-XPNDR-261) will still "wake up" the ground stations so that you receive non-ADS-B-equipped traffic that radar picks up. This is more valuable than single vs dual band, incidentally, as there is WAY more traffic that is not ADS-B Out equipped at all than you'll see with either a single or dual band receiver alone. The only difference is that after 2020, the SV-GPS-250 won't be a compliant position source for use in ADS-B rule airspace. The SV-GPS-2020 will.
 
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Thanks, Michael. KELLI GIRL goes into her annual airworthiness look-see in two weeks. Pick out a really good dual-band unit: I'll send you my old box that week for the trade-in deal.
 
Ping buddy

Galin, how did you determine it was a Pingbuddy?. Probably allowed them to get a dual band ads-b rcvr to market faster. I know Dynon relabeled their transponder from a Trig model.
 
Why Upgrade?

I'm trying to understand the benefits of upgrading from my current 470. I appreciate Dynon's generous trade-in program but, what benefits do I get for $295. I'm pasting the FAQ reply from Dynon's website below for easy reference.

If I understand correctly the only benefit of a 472 over a 470 is that I'll see aircraft with 1090 out signal directly even if I'm not in a ground station coverage area. That sounds like a very limited advantage though since the ground station coverage is supposed to be 100% above 1800 feet and much better than that in most places. Am I missing something?

From the Dynon Website FAQ:


The SV-ADSB-470 and SV-ADSB-472 receive identical weather, as weather is only sent over 978 MHz, and both products receive on 978 MHz.

For traffic, the SV-ADSB-472 receives traffic via both ADS-B frequencies - UAT/978 MHz & 1090 MHz. The SV-ADSB-470 receives traffic via UAT/978 MHz only. While one might think this makes the SV-ADSB-472 superior, they are closer in capability than many realize.

Neither product (nor any other ADS-B receiver) can see aircraft that is are not equipped with ADS-B Out. Although more aircraft will equip as 2020 approaches, a sizeable percentage of the fleet will choose to not equip at all (they?ll need to avoid ADS-B rule airspace after 2020). The FAA?s ADS-B network of ground stations are designed to deal with this issue, and when your aircraft is talking to a ground station via ADS-B Out, both the SV-ADSB-470 and SV-ADSB-472 receive the same traffic information back. When you are ADS-B Out equipped, and are in a radar coverage area, the ADS-B ground stations relay all traffic targets that are around you. If you are in range of a ground station but not in a radar coverage area, the ground stations will still relay all other ADS-B Out equipped traffic. This means that whenever you within range of a ground station, you see all possible traffic with either receiver. The only time the SV-ADSB-272 (or any dual band receiver) has an advantage is when you are flying in an area that is not covered by an ADS-B ground station station. This is most likely to be the case in mountainous terrain, or very near the ground (the ADS-B system is designed to cover almost the entire US at 1800?, with coverage beginning much lower in most places). Even in this situation, the advantage of a dual band receiver is slight: In this case, the SV-ADSB-470 will see UAT equipped aircraft, while the SV-ADSB-472 will see both UAT and 1090ES equipped aircraft. However, NEITHER receiver will see aircraft that aren?t equipped with ADS-B Out. Because many aircraft - especially in remote areas - are not ADS-B equipped, and these are NEVER visible to any ADS-B receiver if you are not in range of a ground station. All of that said, if you?d like to upgrade your SV-ADSB-470 for an SV-ADSB-472, we do have a generous trade-in program available.
 
How about aircraft in the pattern,? Aircraft in mountainest terrain, ground radar goes down so only get air to air, wonder if it also plans is up aircraft taxiing on the ground nd?
 
I'm trying to understand the benefits of upgrading from my current 470. I appreciate Dynon's generous trade-in program but, what benefits do I get for $295. I'm pasting the FAQ reply from Dynon's website below for easy reference.

If I understand correctly the only benefit of a 472 over a 470 is that I'll see aircraft with 1090 out signal directly even if I'm not in a ground station coverage area. That sounds like a very limited advantage though since the ground station coverage is supposed to be 100% above 1800 feet and much better than that in most places. Am I missing something?

Even in the busy and fully ADS-B covered D/FW airspace, there are plenty of times I have not seen an airplane show up on my Skyview, typically while I'm at pattern altitudes....making me question if I'm truly in full reception of the ground station(s)....or if they are simply not ADS-B OUT equipped yet.

However, if spending $295 helps me see and avoid even one 1090 OUT equipped airplane that I might not otherwise see, then it's worth it to me. Just my 2 cents.
 
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The largest concentration of airplanes and thus the greatest collision hazard is in an airport traffic pattern. And some traffic patterns are below ADS-B ground station reception altitude. Suppose that 10 SkyView equipped airplanes are in the traffic pattern at one of those airports for a fly-in. They are all transmitting on 1090. If you are only receiving 978, none of the traffic will show up on your display.
 
The ground coverage is SUPPOSED TO BE 100% above 1800' - but personal experience suggests that figure is highly optimistic.

I sent in my upgrade request this morning. I want to see the traffic in the patterns, especially when I'm out in the boonies away from the major cities where the ground station coverage is "less than optimal."
 
I will be upgrading. One advantage I see is not losing coverage in Mexico like I have been in the past. Well done Dynon.
 
Myron! Mexico! We need to go together one of these days. I need to update my currency on street tacos and mangos on the beach at Rocky Point.
 
Just do remember that a dual band ADS-B receiver can only pick up other ADS-B OUT planes if there is no ground station in range. You will not see Mode C/S targets. This will get a lot better as 2020 approaches, but right now only about 12% of aircraft are ADS-B OUT.

When you are in range of a ground station, you are sent the radar targets as well which is how you see all traffic. In this case, dual band doesn't make a difference.
 
Just do remember that a dual band ADS-B receiver can only pick up other ADS-B OUT planes if there is no ground station in range. You will not see Mode C/S targets. This will get a lot better as 2020 approaches, but right now only about 12% of aircraft are ADS-B OUT.

When you are in range of a ground station, you are sent the radar targets as well which is how you see all traffic. In this case, dual band doesn't make a difference.

What I'm seeing, and others may or may not agree, is that the FAA's description of Ground Station Coverage does not match up to reality. Being the natural skeptic that I am about government efficiency, I think the ADSB equipage is going to happen for the majority of the fleet long before the ground coverage approaches nominal, in which case the 472 does help.

Quit arguing with us! Take our money! Ship us boxes! :D
 
Pushing weather and traffic with WIFI?

Dynon Support - will the system be able to push ADS-B weather & traffic via WIFI to Foreflight?
 
The Dynon and AFS wifi data streams include ADS-B. It's now up to the EFB companies to read it.
 
Regarding in-pattern utility, I have a Xion XRX )or whatever it's called) and if an airplane's transponder is on, it picked them up. I fly from a non-tower field within the Denver 30 mile radius, and while there are hits in the pattern, I've learned not to waste time looking at it. I simply keep my eyes out - that's MUCH more reliable for locating traffic.

Away from the pattern, yes, it's helpful.

I'll be getting my certified plane in for its ADS_B installation shortly, and plan to have an audio mute switch installed, so I can shut the thing off in the pattern.

Dave
 
To Dynon--

Michael,
Aside from the box's installation footprint being slightly different, are all other connections the same? Same SV network connections?
 
All the connections are the same as the SV-ADSB-470, it took me less than 15 minutes to upgrade to the new unit.

Rob Hickman
Advanced Flight Systems
 
I'm trying to understand the benefits of upgrading from my current 470. I appreciate Dynon's generous trade-in program but, what benefits do I get for $295. I'm pasting the FAQ reply from Dynon's website below for easy reference.

If I understand correctly the only benefit of a 472 over a 470 is that I'll see aircraft with 1090 out signal directly even if I'm not in a ground station coverage area. That sounds like a very limited advantage though since the ground station coverage is supposed to be 100% above 1800 feet and much better than that in most places. Am I missing something?

From the Dynon Website FAQ:


The SV-ADSB-470 and SV-ADSB-472 receive identical weather, as weather is only sent over 978 MHz, and both products receive on 978 MHz.

For traffic, the SV-ADSB-472 receives traffic via both ADS-B frequencies - UAT/978 MHz & 1090 MHz. The SV-ADSB-470 receives traffic via UAT/978 MHz only. While one might think this makes the SV-ADSB-472 superior, they are closer in capability than many realize.

Neither product (nor any other ADS-B receiver) can see aircraft that is are not equipped with ADS-B Out. Although more aircraft will equip as 2020 approaches, a sizeable percentage of the fleet will choose to not equip at all (they?ll need to avoid ADS-B rule airspace after 2020). The FAA?s ADS-B network of ground stations are designed to deal with this issue, and when your aircraft is talking to a ground station via ADS-B Out, both the SV-ADSB-470 and SV-ADSB-472 receive the same traffic information back. When you are ADS-B Out equipped, and are in a radar coverage area, the ADS-B ground stations relay all traffic targets that are around you. If you are in range of a ground station but not in a radar coverage area, the ground stations will still relay all other ADS-B Out equipped traffic. This means that whenever you within range of a ground station, you see all possible traffic with either receiver. The only time the SV-ADSB-272 (or any dual band receiver) has an advantage is when you are flying in an area that is not covered by an ADS-B ground station station. This is most likely to be the case in mountainous terrain, or very near the ground (the ADS-B system is designed to cover almost the entire US at 1800?, with coverage beginning much lower in most places). Even in this situation, the advantage of a dual band receiver is slight: In this case, the SV-ADSB-470 will see UAT equipped aircraft, while the SV-ADSB-472 will see both UAT and 1090ES equipped aircraft. However, NEITHER receiver will see aircraft that aren?t equipped with ADS-B Out. Because many aircraft - especially in remote areas - are not ADS-B equipped, and these are NEVER visible to any ADS-B receiver if you are not in range of a ground station. All of that said, if you?d like to upgrade your SV-ADSB-470 for an SV-ADSB-472, we do have a generous trade-in program available.

Not quite correct, see the Powerflarm. This captures all matter of transponder information and proceeds to forward it to the AFS units. That being said, look at the pricing????

Big difference in price for outcome.

https://flarm.com/products/powerflarm/product-comparison/
 
Connections are the same but antenna connector on back side of box now instead of on same side.



To Dynon--

Michael,
Aside from the box's installation footprint being slightly different, are all other connections the same? Same SV network connections?
 
Not quite correct, see the Powerflarm. This captures all matter of transponder information and proceeds to forward it to the AFS units.

PowerFlarm is not an ADS-B receiver when it picks up Mode C/S targets. It does this via other RF tricks and can only roughly estimate the location and direction of an aircraft, whereas ADS-B gives exact position. It's better than nothing, but it's far from the accuracy that ADS-B gives you.

This makes a lot more sense in non-USA countries where they have no way to get accurate Mode C/S traffic. In the USA, we get great coverage of Mode C/S enroute via ADS-B, just not when close to the ground, and our near-ground coverage gets better every day as more aircraft equip with ADS-B.
 
I'm Confused

OK - I'll admit to ADS-B overload and slow brain numbness by way too many data sources.

I have an AFS-4500-equipped -8A. Is this stuff compatible? If so, what do I have to do? If not, what can I do?
 
I also have an RV-8 with AFS 4500.

I have an AFS-4500-equipped -8A. Is this stuff compatible?

No. I don't think the SV-ADSB-472 Dual Band ADS-B Traffic and Weather Receiver is compatible with the AFS 4500.

If not, what can I do?

Its not a dual band ADS-B solution, but if your AFS 4500 is equipped with the compatible S-CPU then the NavWorx ADS600 series ADS-B equipment can be directly interfaced to your AFS 4500. The ADS600 UAT receiver displays ADS-B information including TIS-B traffic and FIS-B weather. Less optimal considering the issues recently with NavWorx.

If you want just traffic on you AFS 4500 the Garmin GTX-330 provides Traffic Information Services (TIS) interface but no WX as far as i'm aware.

If you want the dual band solution offered here in this thread I think you're going to need to change out your AFS 4500 for the 5000 series or newer Dynon.

They offered a trade in at one time, not sure if they still do.
 
I also have an RV-8 with AFS 4500.



No. I don't think the SV-ADSB-472 Dual Band ADS-B Traffic and Weather Receiver is compatible with the AFS 4500.



Its not a dual band ADS-B solution, but if your AFS 4500 is equipped with the compatible S-CPU then the NavWorx ADS600 series ADS-B equipment can be directly interfaced to your AFS 4500. The ADS600 UAT receiver displays ADS-B information including TIS-B traffic and FIS-B weather. Less optimal considering the issues recently with NavWorx.

If you want just traffic on you AFS 4500 the Garmin GTX-330 provides Traffic Information Services (TIS) interface but no WX as far as i'm aware.

If you want the dual band solution offered here in this thread I think you're going to need to change out your AFS 4500 for the 5000 series or newer Dynon.

They offered a trade in at one time, not sure if they still do.

I would be surprised if AFS doesn't offer a trade-in from 4500 to a 5400. I think they told me they basically use parts of the 4500 to build it into a 5400.

I did the upgrade after a CPU failure. Yes, would have been nice to upgrade to a 5500, but I just didn't have the space in my 8 to squeeze anything bigger.

I also had already put a "freeflight' system for adsb out which is tied to my GTX330 (ES upgrade $1200).
 
I upgraded my 4500's to 5400's about 2 years ago. They are fantastic, and run all of the great 5000 series s/w.

Vic
 
Last weekend I was flying at 2500 feet and had a flight of F-15s pass at my 12 o'clock 2 miles low. After the show, I saw I did not have ADSB coverage, (full up-to-date Dynon Skyview suite)
So would the new (on exchange order) dual band given me a warning of their fly-by? Assuming they were squawking.
 
It's doubtful you would see the F-15. Very few military planes are ADS-B equipped, and the military has said they will miss the 2020 deadline.

Dual band is only useful to see ADS-B OUT equipped planes when not in ground coverage areas.
 
Anyone installed one of the new ADS-B units yet? Any issues or problems with the install or operation?
 
I filled out the form on Dynon's site to upgrade my ADSB unit. I have not heard any feedback. There is no rush but I am curious if my documentation is in the right queue. Is this typical?
 
I inquired just yesterday by email since I had not heard either. They are working on the list, I will probably be contacted next week to begin the process. I submitted early so i am sure you will hear something soon.
 
They will contact you when your unit is ready to ship.

I received my unit last week. Note that I signed up within the first hour of announcement.
 
Just got mine

I filled out the form on day 1 or 2 after the announcement and just received my new unit. Will swap it out this weekend and send the old one back to Dynon. Dynon called, verified address and credit card info and shipped it out. Great service as always.
 
I got my ADS-B 472 from Dynon last week and just flew it a couple days ago. Works fine and seems to update the weather faster. I did order the Skyview ADS-B bracket (F-00045C) from Vans rather than make one. Cost about $5.00

My coax (WH-00095) to the ADS-b was just a bit short to attach to the side of the new box so I had to make a 3 inch extension to connect up.

Mitch Garner
N2ET flying
 
I did order the Skyview ADS-B bracket (F-00045C) from Vans rather than make one. Cost about $5.00

What is this bracket you speak of? Not finding it on Van's.

I have my 472 on the way. Thinking of how to easily modify for the different footprint.
 
You have to call Vans and ask for it.... or just make an adapter from stock aluminum sheet.

Mitch Garner
 
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