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  #1  
Old 08-02-2017, 07:08 AM
dweyant dweyant is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: 07TS
Posts: 440
Default Misinformation!

Not trying to start something, but a friend of mine just sent this to me:

http://www.121five.com/admin/Feature...aintenance.pdf

This contradicts a lot of what I "thought" I knew about experimental and what I can and can not do. I'd like some feedback on the article please.

Thanks,

-Dan
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RV-9A N96KD
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  #2  
Old 08-02-2017, 07:19 AM
Mel's Avatar
Mel Mel is offline
 
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Location: Dallas area
Posts: 10,091
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Unfortunately much of this article is "Hogwash".

ANYONE can perform maintenance and or modifications on an Experimental Amateur-Built aircraft. Remember, Part 43 only applies to the condition inspection because it is referenced in the Operating Limitations.

The reference of the 120 hour repairman course for Light-Sport is applicable to SLSA, not ELSA. For ELSA the Repairman Certification (Inspection) is a 16 hour course and only applies for the condition inspection. Since an ELSA is Experimental, no repairman certificate is required for maintenance.
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Mel Asberry..DAR since last century
A&P/EAA Tech Counselor/Flight Advisor/Nat'l Test Pilot School
Specializing in Amateur-Built and Light-Sport Aircraft
<rvmel(at)icloud.com>
North Texas (8TA5)
RV-6 Flying since 1993, 172hp O-320, 3-Blade Catto (since 2003)
Legend Cub purchased 12/2017
FRIEND of the RV-1
Eagle's Nest Mentor
Recipient of Wright Brothers "Master Pilot" Award
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  #3  
Old 08-02-2017, 07:20 AM
tspear tspear is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Boston Area
Posts: 135
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dweyant View Post
Not trying to start something, but a friend of mine just sent this to me:

http://www.121five.com/admin/Feature...aintenance.pdf

This contradicts a lot of what I "thought" I knew about experimental and what I can and can not do. I'd like some feedback on the article please.

Thanks,

-Dan
Yes it is BS. The author missed a critical aspect. Part 43 does NOT apply to experimental aircraft.
https://www.eaa.org/en/eaa/aviation-...er-maintenance

Tim

Edit: See Mel's more complete answer.
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  #4  
Old 08-02-2017, 07:26 AM
Auburntsts's Avatar
Auburntsts Auburntsts is offline
 
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Location: Dumfries, VA
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I would also go as far as to say that even if you didn't build it, if a Repairman's Certificate has not been issued for that specific aircraft, you could still apply for the certificate provided you had the requisite experience and knowledge and could demonstrate that to the FAA (eg you've built other E-AB's but decided to buy this one). IOW it's not tied to the build itself -- that's just the usual way us non-A&P types get the required experience and knowledge.

EDIT: the above is incorrect -- it is tied to the build.
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Last edited by Auburntsts : 08-02-2017 at 07:48 AM. Reason: I was wrong.
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  #5  
Old 08-02-2017, 07:34 AM
dweyant dweyant is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mel View Post
Unfortunately much of this article is "Hogwash".

ANYONE can perform maintenance and or modifications on an Experimental Amateur-Built aircraft. Remember, Part 43 only applies to the condition inspection because it is referenced in the Operating Limitations.

The reference of the 120 hour repairman course for Light-Sport is applicable to SLSA, not ELSA. For ELSA the Repairman Certification (Inspection) is a 16 hour course and only applies for the condition inspection. Since an ELSA is Experimental, no repairman certificate is required for maintenance.
Thanks Mel, I was hoping you would see this and reply.

-Dan
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  #6  
Old 08-02-2017, 07:35 AM
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Mel Mel is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auburntsts View Post
I would also go as far as to say that even if you didn't build it, if a Repairman's Certificate has not been issued for that specific aircraft, you could still apply for the certificate provided you had the requisite experience and knowledge and could demonstrate that to the FAA (eg you've built other E-AB's but decided to buy this one). IOW it's not tied to the build itself -- that's just the usual way us non-A&P types get the required experience and knowledge.
Actually it is tied to the builder. ref; "65.104(a)(2) Be the primary builder of the aircraft to which the privileges of the certificate are applicable;"
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Mel Asberry..DAR since last century
A&P/EAA Tech Counselor/Flight Advisor/Nat'l Test Pilot School
Specializing in Amateur-Built and Light-Sport Aircraft
<rvmel(at)icloud.com>
North Texas (8TA5)
RV-6 Flying since 1993, 172hp O-320, 3-Blade Catto (since 2003)
Legend Cub purchased 12/2017
FRIEND of the RV-1
Eagle's Nest Mentor
Recipient of Wright Brothers "Master Pilot" Award

Last edited by Mel : 08-02-2017 at 07:43 AM.
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  #7  
Old 08-02-2017, 07:44 AM
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Auburntsts Auburntsts is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mel View Post
Actually it is tied to the builder. ref; "65.104(a)(2) Be the primary builder of the aircraft to which the privileges of the certificate are applicable;"
Whoops-- I stand corrected. Although I guess you just have to be part of the build as the definition of "primary builder" seems to be very flexible in the case of group builds.
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RV-10 N728TT - Flying!
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  #8  
Old 08-02-2017, 08:00 AM
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Mel Mel is offline
 
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Location: Dallas area
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auburntsts View Post
Whoops-- I stand corrected. Although I guess you just have to be part of the build as the definition of "primary builder" seems to be very flexible in the case of group builds.
Yes, it is very flexible. Most FSDOs are very lenient on this, but you do need to be listed as a builder.
__________________
Mel Asberry..DAR since last century
A&P/EAA Tech Counselor/Flight Advisor/Nat'l Test Pilot School
Specializing in Amateur-Built and Light-Sport Aircraft
<rvmel(at)icloud.com>
North Texas (8TA5)
RV-6 Flying since 1993, 172hp O-320, 3-Blade Catto (since 2003)
Legend Cub purchased 12/2017
FRIEND of the RV-1
Eagle's Nest Mentor
Recipient of Wright Brothers "Master Pilot" Award
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  #9  
Old 08-02-2017, 08:56 AM
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Mel Mel is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xxxxxxxx View Post
So I'm confused.....
So if I didn't build my plane, can I completely replace the panel? What if I damage my tail, can I build a new one and replace it?
Or do I have to have an A&P do it?
Richard
If your aircraft is an experimental amateur-built aircraft, you can do anything you want except for the condition inspection.

Looks like you have an RV-10, so you are good-to-go. Just remember, what is legal is not necessarily prudent!
__________________
Mel Asberry..DAR since last century
A&P/EAA Tech Counselor/Flight Advisor/Nat'l Test Pilot School
Specializing in Amateur-Built and Light-Sport Aircraft
<rvmel(at)icloud.com>
North Texas (8TA5)
RV-6 Flying since 1993, 172hp O-320, 3-Blade Catto (since 2003)
Legend Cub purchased 12/2017
FRIEND of the RV-1
Eagle's Nest Mentor
Recipient of Wright Brothers "Master Pilot" Award

Last edited by scrollF4 : 08-03-2017 at 02:34 PM.
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  #10  
Old 08-02-2017, 09:00 AM
rv7charlie rv7charlie is offline
 
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Location: Pocahontas MS
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Write the guy & tell him the error of his ways. I just did, with a link to EAA's experimental maintenance page.

Charlie
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