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Garmin Denies Warranty for 430W

Will Bentley

Active Member
I am curious to know if anyone else has run into a problem such as this.
Last year I purchased a Garmin 430W from Eastern Avionics in Florida to
be installed in my 6A. I was informed that this unit has a two year warranty.
Eastern Avionics made up the harness for my unit. Bob Hart (salesman at
Eastern that sold the unit to me) stated that the warranty would be valid,
even though my local A&P tech installing my 430W was not a "Garmin Authorized
Repair Facility". Like I said, I made sure prior to purchase that the warranty
would be honored even tho the unit was not installed by an Authorized Facility.

Yesterday I called Garmin and informed them that I have a problem with
the display on my 430W. It seems the display is beginning to lose the
anti-glare property...it's just sort of crumbling off. Today I get word
from Garmin that they will repair the problem "this" time, but any further
warranty work will be disallowed due to the installer not being "authorized".
So, if I have a major problem in the next ten months I am out of luck.

I know many RV folks that have done their own installations and have yet
to hear that the warranty is invalid. The A&P that did my installation has
done a number of them and is a very good tech. Anyone else run into this
situation? Any advice? I am leaving to go overseas tomorrow and probably
won't have time to run all this by Eastern Avionics before I leave. I'll be gone
for six months.

Appreciate input any of you may have..

Thanks,

Bill
 
This is why competition is needed

To put an end to the Garmin's reign of tyranny

Since they are virtually the only game in town they can set all the terms. In general, "certified" flying costs way more than it should and Garmin is one of the reasons.

That's capitalism as it should be. The same rules allow a smart, efficient, and less greedy competitor to enter the game and give them a spanking.

I'll be cheering if that ever happens.
 
Sounds to me like you need to have a talk with Bob Hart at Eastern Avionics - the one you said told yout that the warrentee would be valid. Did he mis-represent? Will he make good on his promise?
 
That's capitalism as it should be. The same rules allow a smart, efficient, and less greedy competitor to enter the game and give them a spanking.
Until Garmin acquires them for an obscene amount of money, raises the price, then discontinues the line. Free market economics at its best :D


Bill,

Do you have the option of routing the unit back through Eastern if it requires warranty services again?
 
Changes coming for Garmin

We have been trying to become a Garmin dealer, since we'll be using Garmin radios in our new Skylark LSAs. As an aircraft manufacturer, they won't even talk to us about being a dealer until we are a FAA licensed avionics repair station, with a full-time licensed avionics technician. Then we have to buy a long list of specialized test equipment so we can do repairs to Garmin radios. All this because we want to install Garmin 496s, SL-40s, and GTX-327s in our Skylark LSAs.

It's really getting ridiculous. The only way we can proceed is to buy the units from existing authorized Garmin dealers and basically have no warranty on the equipment, unless we pay the dealer to do the actual installation also. When I spoke with the dealer manager at Garmin HQ this past week, he said that changes are in the works this year at Garmin to reduce the number of Garmin dealers nationwide.

We're really thinking about staying completely away from Garmin products because of it.
 
As a side note, my 496 screen started doing the "flaking" thing. I just thought it was from a lot of use, but I'm very careful not to let the screen touch anything. What I ended up doing is buying one of those little "acrylic plastic" screen savers. Very worth while investment. Looks great and no more flaking, and very tough. I got it on e-Bay.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Screen-Protecto...5|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318|301:1|293:1|294:50
 
Last edited:
Thanks, all. Sounds like Garmin or the folks I bought the 430W from
has done a number on me. I will contact Eastern Avionics first opportunity
(which I may not get to do until I return from mid-east in six months) and
see if I can get my 2 year warranty validated.

I will definitely invest in that little plastic screen saver to protect my
screen from any further depletion of the coating on the screen.

Bill
 
I don't want to kijack this thread, but is there a nice unit for VFR to operate also the ap for Dynon, that will give me also a flight log for me. I currently have the IQ3600a and love it. I've turned off most everything, terrain warning, you know junk like that. I love using the compass on the unit and goto, with the green track out from the runways, very nice. that's all I need. I guess I would be interested in weather for cross country as well. I to am pretty Garmined out at this point also.
 
No need for "Certified".......

Too bad MGL isnt certified:(

GPS in an experimental. If it was required, it would put the GPS in a completely separate world from everything else on an experimental airplane. That makes no sense.

There are functional and performance requirements to be met. That's all.

See TSO-C129a

I think that defines what the unit must do.

MGL Odyssey may do that already
 
New Garmin target Non TSO EFIS market

FWIW, Garmin will be aiming at the experimental EFIS market with it G3X system to be shown at SNF and based around the soon to be available GDU 370/375.

As a fan of AFS, GRT and Dynon, price and features are a key attractions in deciding on this kind of product, but the service provided by the Hickmans at AFS, Sandy and Carlos at GRT and all of the guys at Dynon is something Garmin may have a hard time understanding, much less ever providing.

Don't get me wrong, I think Garmin/Apollo provide a great product, but I too have encountered difficulties with both warranty service and paid services on several of my units.

The question is has Garmin forgotten us?
 
My RV7A has a 430W also. When I bought it from American Avionics I was told the warranty would only be valid if it was wired by a dealer or if I used an Approach Systems wiring hub. I had to buy the hub from American Avionics (the price was competitive with other sources) to prove a hub was used.

The unit was originally non WAAS. When I sent it in for upgrade (via the selling dealer) it came back with a new 2 year warranty. So far I have not needed warranty repairs. I did have an issue with my SL40 and had to send it back via the dealer to get the warranty honored. I think the issue here is that if the dealer sends it back to Garmin he was vouching for the installation.

Martin Sutter
building and flying RV's since 1988
 
Warranty issues

Will,
The two year warranty should be honored. Perhaps a little explanation to the field service engineer at Garmin is in order.

As a Garmin dealer and primary tech support person at Aerotronics, I am often the person calling Garmin on behalf of my customer to get a RMA number to return a unit for warranty. I want to say that Garmin is quite fair in regards to honoring it two year warranty, as long as the selling dealer has "Followed the rules". There is a list of equipment Garmin provides its dealers that is required by the dealer to "do the installation". We are required to build a harness in order to turn on and verify the equipment's operation. We refer to this as a prewire. I have been working at Aerotronics for over 10 years and have built harnesses for hundreds of 430's and sent them to the customer to do final physical install. I have never had Garmin deny warranty due to the customer installing the radio in an experimental plane.

Sounds to me like you need to get your avionics shop to call Garmin and confirm they provided you with a factory authorized dealer's harness. The fact that they said they would fix it "this time" tells me they have tagged your serial number on their computer system so the next time the unit is returned no warranty consideration will be made. Your dealer should be able to place a five minute phone call and get this cleared up.

Jason Smith
 
430W Harness and Warranty

I bought a 430W from a Garmin dealer who never mentioned the need to buy a harness, even though he knew it was going in an experimental. What do I need to do to protect my investment and ensure that warranty would be covered in the future - buy a harness from him?
 
Amazing. Garmin tries to protect the integrity of their product and ensure a high level of operational standards and they get bashed? I seem to remember a thread about intercoms where the manufacturer spent an ungodly amount of time and effort debugging a customers self inflicted problems only to find the customer unwilling to make a new harness and give up a 20 year old headset. This is America. If you don't like Garmin or the rules they set to purchase and install their product, vote elsewhere with your dollars. You have that choice. Better yet, buy something made in China, install it yourself, and feel free to enter the world of IMC. If the problem is the dealer, tell Garmin. I'm sure they're more anxious to fix that end than you are.
If you need a short term answer re. certified products and installation, ask Mrs. Elvis Presley how you can save money on something less critical, like facial rejuvenation.
Sorry. Hot button.
Terry, CFI
RV9A N323TP
 
Ethics and fair support

Terry,
I supported warrant repair for many years for several manufactures. If a warranty repair had a problem possibly relating to installtion I would question the warrant status. I may even deny it after contacting the customer and asking some questions to the installtion.
This was not only fair but prudent so the unit did not get broken again.
One thing we never did was drop the warranty status for a known warranty issue! You can bet that the was not the first screen surface warranty return. If the information in this thread is correct as to the way Garmin handles issues unrelated to installtion then I for one will not give them my business. Refusing the honor a manufacturing error to a customer who has paid the asking price is simply wrong.

I hope it is a simple misunderstanding. I will be checking back with the thread to see how things turn out.


Amazing. Garmin tries to protect the integrity of their product and ensure a high level of operational standards and they get bashed? I seem to remember a thread about intercoms where the manufacturer spent an ungodly amount of time and effort debugging a customers self inflicted problems only to find the customer unwilling to make a new harness and give up a 20 year old headset. This is America. If you don't like Garmin or the rules they set to purchase and install their product, vote elsewhere with your dollars. You have that choice. Better yet, buy something made in China, install it yourself, and feel free to enter the world of IMC. If the problem is the dealer, tell Garmin. I'm sure they're more anxious to fix that end than you are.
If you need a short term answer re. certified products and installation, ask Mrs. Elvis Presley how you can save money on something less critical, like facial rejuvenation.
Sorry. Hot button.
Terry, CFI
RV9A N323TP
 
Boy is this a weird thread......

I think Jason put it best. This really shouldn't have been an issue so something doesn't make sense. He's right all the way around.

Here are the facts.

1) If you purchase your units from a top notch shop and they are under warranty, things like this DON'T happen. I can guarantee you that had you purchased it from any of the top shops (including Aerotronics or myself) this would have been a non issue. Did you call the shop you purchased it from first? If not why not? With stuff like this you should always go back to the people you purchased it from. If they are not willing to fix it, then tell Garmin that and believe me they will have your back. If the dealer isn't supporting it, then shame on them. If you buy a new car and have issues, how many of you call up headquarters in Detroit with complaints about warranty issues without at least once talking to the dealer you bought it from first? If you purchase a TV from the big box retailer who gives you a warranty and it goes bad...you go back to them for the warranty, right? The fact that Garmin agreed to deal with you directly and not through the dealer is actually quite impressive on their part and a GOOD thing.

2) For mfgrs like Craig...this isn't a simple as what was presented and this is an incredibly complex subject. Since LSA mfgrs don't fall into the same guidelines as regular type certificates, suppliers like Garmin need to use something as a metric to ensure your facility is qualified to normally accepted standards and certifications. What else would you have them use to measure you as a manufacturer? Put yourself in their shoes....they get dozens upon dozens of calls regularly from people who are also either building or going to build an LSA. It's not out of line for them to require that you as the manufacturer meet generally accepted industry standards....having an FAA certificate tells them you are able to keep your processes, equipment, paperwork, people, facility and tooling at levels of accepted standards. Installing the stuff in the planes is one thing, but how do you propose to support it after the fact without being able to prove that you have the basic equipment, people, experience, skill, etc??? I know that if I was either a supplier or potential customer of your aircraft I'd expect nothing less. Being a dealer for avionics (or anything I suppose) is so much more than just simply selling or installing the stuff. I'm not harping on you, just trying to get you to see it from another standpoint. I deal with a whole lot of LSA mfgrs (most of them to some extent) at either an OEM or aftermarket level and it really isn't as bad or complex as you are making it sound. Garmin does support LSA's in a big way....I know this first hand. If you as the manufacturer are serious enough to invest in the items required to meet normally accepted standards, it shows them you are serious about your business plan. If you are unable or unwilling to invest in the items needed to meet those standards, then naturally the suppliers are going to wonder.

3) Noah: contact me off list. You do need to rectify your situation should future issues arise with your unit. As you sit, it's not good.

In the end I indeed am defending Garmin because this thread isn't fair to them. It's not fair to start a thread saying Garmin refused warranty when they didn't...and the person who started the thread evidently didn't try to go through the dealer they bought it from?!?!?! The problem stated in the initial post isn't normal...nor is the situation behind it. Obviously I don't know the whole story, but it doesn't add up, nor is it indicative of the many customers we have per year with Garmin equipment installed. I know that the story is the same for the many Aerotronics customers and the many Stark customers, so on and so forth. The fact of the matter is that Garmin does support homebuilders...but you need to try and work within their guidelines. They are not perfect, but I haven't met anyone or any company yet who is. I could go on and on about this subject because it's so much more complex than many of you would imagine but suffice to say I'm happy with Garmin. I'm also happy with most of the mfgr's out there...

My long winded 2 cent "dump" as usual....no flames intended! :)

Cheers,
Stein
 
Long ago I purchased an IFR GPS from Eastern and had them install it. They kept the plane for a week so I had to get home andthen go get the plane. When I picked the plane up the face of the GPS had a huge gouge in it. They replaced it with a new GPS but it had an old Database. This is back ewhen you had to fly an approach before they would sign the forms for IFR to carry in the plane. They wouldn't do it without a current data base. After much yelling and threatening they did the sign off. I no longer deal with Eastern.

Take Steins advice get Eastern to fix this problem.

I had an SL 30 that I totally fried by miswiring it. Sent it in with an admission of my guilt. It was fixed under warranty no further comment.
 
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