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Join the flight levels club

airguy

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Since we've got the "200 knots" club and it's been around for a while, I thought we should have this one as well. I know quite a few of us have been up there with our RV's, and a couple of us have gone WAY up there.

Anyway, here's my entry, coming back home from Reno 2018, was picking up a trace of ice in the top of a layer at 17,000 so requested FL190 to get clear.
oPd.png
 
Fair enough, Matt.

I did not switch to standard pressure because ATC was waiting for me to reach that altitude and then clear me for my descent and to Plymouth. I guess I was too hasty and should have continued to climb in order to make it an official 18000 at standard pressure.

:cool: CJ
 
Of course, this assumes NA airspace. In the rest of the world, reaching ?flight levels? is much easier. :)
 
Flight Levels begin above 17,500 msl. When the altimeter setting is below 29.92 FL180 is unusable.
 
Flight Levels begin above 17,500 msl. When the altimeter setting is below 29.92 FL180 is unusable.

What Rich was sayin is that "Flight Levels" in other parts of the world begin much lower than FL180. For instance, in France and Germany the first Flight Level could be FL60 (6000'). In the UK it could be FL70.

I think Greg was shooting for our Flight Levels which as you indicated, begin at FL180.
 
What Rich was sayin is that "Flight Levels" in other parts of the world begin much lower than FL180. For instance, in France and Germany the first Flight Level could be FL60 (6000'). In the UK it could be FL70.

I think Greg was shooting for our Flight Levels which as you indicated, begin at FL180.
Don't even have to go that far away. The Flight Levels start at 6,000' over the Bahamas.

:cool:
 
Been at FL 190 in my -10, the DA was 20,800?. She had more if I had wanted to milk her for higher.
 
Dynon EFIS? That's more information displayed than a B757 or B767...

Need O2 at 10,000-12,000 feet more than 30 min or above 12,000. FL190 would be a must... Hypoxia makes your thinking dull and feel slightly euphoric... then incapacitated. Finger nails turn blue. Nothing to screw around with.

What O2 system are people using the most? Mountain High pulse demand looks like the way to go.

In class A airspace (above FL180) requirement is: IFR flight plan, two way com, transponder mode C + ADS-B. Check.
 
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Dynon EFIS? That's more information displayed than a B757 or B767...

Need O2 at 10,000-12,000 feet more than 30 min or above 12,000. FL190 would be a must... Hypoxia makes your thinking dull and feel slightly euphoric... then incapacitated. Finger nails turn blue. Nothing to screw around with.

What O2 system are people using the most? Mountain High pulse demand looks like the way to go.

In class A airspace (above FL180) requirement is: IFR flight plan, two way com, transponder mode C + ADS-B. Check.

I believe you?re quoting the regulations for commercial ops. For part 91 O2 rules are above 12,500? (PA) more then 30 minutes, any time above 14,000? (PA). Not that being a little conservative isn?t a good idea.
 
Dynon EFIS? That's more information displayed than a B757 or B767...

Need O2 at 10,000-12,000 feet more than 30 min or above 12,000. FL190 would be a must... Hypoxia makes your thinking dull and feel slightly euphoric... then incapacitated. Finger nails turn blue. Nothing to screw around with.

What O2 system are people using the most? Mountain High pulse demand looks like the way to go.

In class A airspace (above FL180) requirement is: IFR flight plan, two way com, transponder mode C + ADS-B. Check.

Cannulae are not allowed above 18000'. Full mask is required by the FAA.
 
and...

...and Hypoxia affects each individual differently.

It is an eye opening experience to see what happens to yourself...
 
Once I get my oxygen tank filled, I am intending on testing my new toy to see how high and what kind of performance I can get up there.

I am a bit surprised by the oil temp and other temp unless this picture was taken right after the climb was completed.
 
We breathe DA

Just a reminder, your motor performs based on density altitude and so does your body. At higher than standard temperature, you are breathing less oxygen. You may be at 9,500? and think you are ok without O2 but the density may be over 11,000?.

A lot of factors contribute to our personal performance on any given day such as hydration, nutrition, and stress. I like to use a small amount of O2 on any longer flights when above 7-8000?. The wife and I agree that we both feel better, much less fatigued.
 
In class A airspace (above FL180) requirement is: IFR flight plan, two way com, transponder mode C + ADS-B. Check.

And an oxygen mask, not just a cannula. I use a cannula below FL180 since it's quite a bit more comfortable.

I've got Mountain High with the big D-size bottle in my plane and use it on most flights.

I am a bit surprised by the oil temp and other temp unless this picture was taken right after the climb was completed.

Yes, it was. Notice I was still running 2550 rpm for the climb, was just getting stabilized. Fuel flow was still LOP but a bit richer at 5.9 gph, once I settled down it came back to 5.6 gph.

As noted - high altitude affects people differently and is not something to be treated lightly. Make sure you are properly equipped and know how to use it. It's a very unforgiving place to be careless. I highly recommend taking a ride in the FAA hypoxia altitude chamber, the results can be quite interesting.
 
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As Greg has mentioned, going for a ride in the altitude chamber is a great experience. The FAA sets it up at Oshkosh almost every year. I have gone for four rides. I learn something each time. I strongly recommend it.

Here is another video that I took while in the chamber.

https://youtu.be/fZdOcasg-FA

;) CJ
 
Preaching to the choir, but the altitude chamber experience provided by CAMI in OKC was invaluable. I?m much more ?in tune? with my early signs of hypoxia as well as how useless you become when experiencing hypoxia.

I?ve semi-permenantly relocated my wife?s fingertip pulse oximeter to the airplane, I preflight it along with the O2 and airplane before flights I plan on using O2, lots of them for $25-$30. The higher I am (shorter time of useful consciousness) the more often I check my O2 % with the oximeter.

I use the Mountain High O2D2-2G pulse demand with the AL-647 cylinder because I?m too cheap to fill up on the road. In addition I don?t normally stop at airports that can fill my tank, or perhaps their O2 and gas is too expensive.

I?m hoping the ?holy smoking crosswinds? (Thanks BillL) will eventually pay for my O2 system, if I count engine reserves into the equation with quicker ETE?s it pays off sooner. So far it?s given me more options over higher terrain along with turning a headwind into a tailwind over the flatlands.....and adding time between potty stops.....and arriving less fatigued at your destination because you were on O2 at 10K.

Do be careful with your passengers, my dad was with me and got hypoxia. It was his 3rd flight on O2 with me over several years. My dad was dozing since we took off and continued dozing in the mid-teens. My pulse demand O2D2 was buried between the seats of my 7 under winter coats. I had been happily monitoring my O2 levels via the pulse oximeter for over an hour when my dad stirred from his nap and started talking incoherently. I dug out the O2D2 and his O2 alarm was going off, I believe he was either mouth breathing or not breathing deliberately enough through his nose while snoozing and I missed the alarm on the O2D2 and consequently was hypoxic. I was able to get him to start breathing through the cannulas again shortly and back to normal. I failed to keep the O2D2 visible and audible by burying it under coat sleeves, I also let my elder napping dad just sleep and be comfortable. Fly and learn.
 
Just a reminder, your motor performs based on density altitude and so does your body. At higher than standard temperature, you are breathing less oxygen. .

While it may seem logical, this is false. An engine?s power depends on how much O2 enters the cylinders. The human body also depends on getting sufficient O2, but it needs to cross a membrane in the lung, and that depends on (partial) pressure.
This is one area where the FARs got it right - ?cabin pressure altitude?, not density altitude, is what?s important.
 
So for those that routinely go up to higher cruise altitudes..

Which onboard O2 systems do you guys like and why.

Thanks
 
Refill

I also struggle with finding a good place to refill the tanks. Maybe we can extend the threat to best way to refill the tanks
 
Welding tanks...

I have 2, 120cf welding tanks. They cost about $18 each to fill. I transfer to a medical bottle from them. Works fine and is cost effective. I have an E size medical tank attached between the seats in the baggage compartment. Tall enough to see the gauge and reach the regulator from either seat, and enough O2 to last till I get back home to refill.
 
I also struggle with finding a good place to refill the tanks. Maybe we can extend the threat to best way to refill the tanks

Refill the tanks yourself. They sell trans fill adapters and all you need to do is buy the oxygen in bulk.

Check out this article about using welders oxygen. Oxygen is oxygen he says and that's what we have been using. I'm not dead yet.

https://www.avweb.com/news/pelican/182079-1.html

I have the mountain high 02 D2 system and I love it. I use very little oxygen And it works very well.

:rolleyes: CJ
 
Refill the tanks yourself. They sell trans fill adapters and all you need to do is buy the oxygen in bulk.

Check out this article about using welders oxygen. Oxygen is oxygen he says and that's what we have been using. I'm not dead yet.

https://www.avweb.com/news/pelican/182079-1.html

I have the mountain high 02 D2 system and I love it. I use very little oxygen And it works very well.

:rolleyes: CJ

I've got about 200 hours in my RV sucking oxygen, and refill my own tanks.
 
Breezy....

Since we've got the "200 knots" club and it's been around for a while, I thought we should have this one as well. I know quite a few of us have been up there with our RV's, and a couple of us have gone WAY up there.

Anyway, here's my entry, coming back home from Reno 2018, was picking up a trace of ice in the top of a layer at 17,000 so requested FL190 to get clear.
oPd.png

Greg,
Many moons ago I nursed my 150HP, wood propped, non painted, built for under $20K RV4 with flea market steam gauges and ECO Trex Hiking GPS to 20K. Darn near froze to death, heaters weren’t a big priority in FL. :). Heaters are overrated anyway



Your winds were light at 190. Here’s what the winds were descending today near Chicago at FL300...not in an RV.
Would be a LONG day in an RV headed West..:)

V/R
Smokey
 
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Pressure or Density Altitude

While it may seem logical, this is false. An engine?s power depends on how much O2 enters the cylinders. The human body also depends on getting sufficient O2, but it needs to cross a membrane in the lung, and that depends on (partial) pressure.
This is one area where the FARs got it right - ?cabin pressure altitude?, not density altitude, is what?s important.

You have it correct! Also, pulmonary oxygen level is not significantly impacted by air temperature because respirated air is pretty much warmed or cooled to constant temperature (body temperature) by the time it reaches the alveoli.

Skylor
 
Greg,
Many moons ago I nursed my 150HP, wood propped, non painted, built for under $20K RV4 with flea market steam gauges and ECO Trex Hiking GPS to 20K. Darn near froze to death, heaters weren?t a big priority in FL. :). Heaters are overrated anyway

Your winds were light at 190. Here?s what the winds were descending today near Chicago at FL300...not in an RV.
Would be a LONG day in an RV headed West..:)

V/R
Smokey

Nicely done. As posted, I wasn't motivated by the winds, but rather to escape trace-to-light icing conditions in the top of a layer. Secondary to that was the need/desire to fill in some data in my econ-cruise spreadsheet for 21k DA conditions.
 
Another potential member

It was so cold my fingers and brain missed the altimeter adjustment by .01. Hope this and the dirty screen is forgiven.
Flying home from Arizona last weekend.
I should have also turned into the wind, slowed to approach speed and flew backwards, but I was too cold so I pushed on and around the weather. You can see my deviation from the flight plan to avoid further weather.
 
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It can get cold up there for sure, and our RV heaters are not known to be all that good. I bought one of those 12-volt heated jacket liners a while back that the motorcycle and snowmobilers use and wore that under my regular jacket for the recent trip KMDD-KHOT, at 17,000 the OAT was variable between +12 and +8 F and after about 20 minutes the cold started to soak into me pretty good. I plugged in the jacket and turned it on and it nearly roasted me on high, I kicked it down to the lowest setting and it was right on target, that made it completely comfortable.
 
Also happy with the Mountain High O2D2

+1. It's a tremendous gadget, really cuts down on the O2 usage. Looks like they recently introduced an improved model, as well.

I was pondering getting my own setup to fill O2 tanks but discovered that my local scuba guy (been buying stuff from him for years....) will fill my cylinder for $10. And with the O2D2 a cylinder lasts a loooong time. So I just go the scuba route.

I have the mountain high 02 D2 system and I love it. I use very little oxygen And it works very well.
 
My new altitude record in an RV

I took my RV-14A up to FL 23,340 today. I was cleared to FL 250, but this was all I could (safely) get out of the airplane. Note that the AOA green indication is creeping up to the yellow, and there just wasn't enough margin left with the wing to keep the climb going. This is my personal record in a normally aspirated piston aircraft.

Some things really impressed me about the RV-14. First, it's nice and warm inside. OAT was - 26C / -14F, but in the cockpit I didn't even need to open up the heater outlets. In fact, I cracked open the vent because it was getting a little too warm inside. No joke. I was in a long sleeved shirt, no coat, no gloves. This is quite different from the times I've flown the RV-8 and RV-7 up in the high teens +.

Climb performance was very nice. I climbed at 500 FPM until FL 180, then 400 FPM to FL 200, then I hand flew the rest of the way to 23,340 because the Dynon autopilot kept pushing forward stick due to the low IAS. (I did engage the autopilot again so I could take the photo).

I descended at 500 FPM, and left the throttle (WOT) and prop alone. I modulated mixture to keep my CHTs as high as possible, but I couldn't get them any higher than 280F until I got below 17,000ish MSL.

I can't think of any good operational reason to fly this high, unless you're trying to fly the "Hump" from India to China. It's interesting to test out the airplane to see what it can do, but the sweet spot for efficiency--even with a screaming tailwind--is definitely not up that high. Fun for bragging rights though. :)

oCw.jpg
 
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A good reason

In March 2006 Steve Hammer set a world speed record class c1b San Diego to Jacksonville non stop at 258 m/h. Initial altitude was fl190, 210 at Wink TX and 230 at Mobile. Glasair 1.
 
Well yes, in a Glasair of course. But with the RV-14?s TAS sharp drop off above FL 180, you?re trading speed for altitude. Different wing, different mission, apples and oranges.
 
In March 2006 Steve Hammer set a world speed record class c1b San Diego to Jacksonville non stop at 258 m/h. Initial altitude was fl190, 210 at Wink TX and 230 at Mobile. Glasair 1.

His Glasair isn't exactly "stock" either.
 
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