RV6, RV7 or something else?

I am still in the early stages of planning my next aircraft purchase. I initially thought that I would go with an RV6 as it checks most of the boxes but I was somewhat disappointed to learn of it?s limiting aerobatic gross weight. I then turned to the RV7 but it seems to be limited by a substantially higher purchase price versus the 6 Although I do not have a lot of data points on the 7. So far I?m only seeing very well equipped IFR 7s for sale. What price should I expect to pay for a well built but basic VFR, fixed pitch RV7?

The mission for this plane is going to be weekend sport flying, basic sport aerobatics & occasional cross country for work when VFR prevails. The configuration needs to be side-by-side as I have a child who I would like to keep a very close eye / hand on in the cockpit. I was hoping to have enough money left over after this purchase to partner up on a ?family plane? so we can all fly together occasionally. Perhaps I could should consider partnering up on a more capable aerobatic plane and purchasing the family cruiser...

First order of business is to figure out what I should expect to pay for a basic VFR 7 if there is anyone who can help give me a range that would be fantastic.

Thx

Just a data point for you. I have my -7A insured for 90k. If someone offered me 100k, I'd probably turn it down.

It is still unpainted but has a nice Dynon panel with AP, dual AD-AHRS, SV1000T screens, each with a backup battery and dual GPS receivers. Single VHF COM. Lots of other details in my signature.

Raymo said:

Just a data point for you. I have my -7A insured for 90k. If someone offered me 100k, I'd probably turn it down.

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Be careful underinsuring your aircraft. Conceivably, you could have a minor claim, the insurance company could "total" the aircraft and buy it for the insured value. I've seen this happen with cars.
If you wouldn't sell it for $90K, you probably shouldn't insure it for $90K!

Mel said:

Be careful underinsuring your aircraft. Conceivably, you could have a minor claim, the insurance company could "total" the aircraft and buy it for the insured value. I've seen this happen with cars.
If you wouldn't sell it for $90K, you probably shouldn't insure it for $90K!

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I would guess that the sentimental value and enjoyment factor accounts for the difference, which the insurance company doesn't care about. I have my RV insured for what I think it would cost to replace but that doesn't mean I would sell it today for that much. The value of the fun I get flying a plane I built means that somebody would have to offer significantly more to give that up - more than anybody would ever offer me (they’re welcome to try though - I’m thinking RV-10 money )The insurance company, however, is just interested in replacement value.

Chris

YellowJacket RV9 said:

I would guess that the sentimental value and enjoyment factor accounts for the difference, which the insurance company doesn't care about. I have my RV insured for what I think it would cost to replace but that doesn't mean I would sell it today for that much. The value of the fun I get flying a plane I built means that somebody would have to offer significantly more to give that up - more than anybody would ever offer me. The insurance company, however, is just interested in replacement value.

Chris

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Correct! I could build another for a little less than the insured value or buy one that is similarly equipped. It's the fun and "I built it" factors that would keep me from accepting more. It's just not for sale

Just bought a very very clean build last March IFR EFIS Autopilot for 120K feel like I was super lucky.

To the OP,

Just typed a longer message, but my computer ate it.

Short version: I'll let others debate legalities and wisdom, but *if* you know what you're doing, you can fly pretty much all the 'gentleman's acro' positive maneuvers in an RVx at well under 3.5 Gs. (The 'acro limit' weight is for 6 Gs.)

If hard core acro is your goal, an RV probably isn't the plane you want.

FWIW,

Charlie

Now I have only been around for a couple of years and I'm still building but it seems that most people who build an RV-7 go with a constant speed prop so finding your fixed pitch is going to be a little tougher but probably still doable. I haven't seen many fixed pitch prop 7s listed but the typical listing I have seen over the past few years is EFIS, autopilot, constant speed non IFR for around 110-120k. IFR seems to be listed more closely with 130k+. Now what the difference between listing and selling prices are I have no clue, I would venture though that it's not much since there isn't very many on the market at any given time. Hopefully some people with more experience chime in.

RV7 price?

When was the 7 first offered? About,, 2000. Ish?

An RV7 could be 18 years old. If I have that right. Or could be new.
Airplane value is in the engine time. The airframe value is fairly constant, if hangered, and un damaged.
So if you find a new RV7 with 200 TT SNew everything, the price might be near it’s cost to build. $100,000 up to a $145,000 IFR plane. Probably worth the money

A RV built in 2002 with a field overhauled engine 200 SMOH buy “shade tree engine builders”? The value is a bit harder to pin down.
Idle engines rust.
Was it hangered? By the sea shore? Climate controlled hanger?
Any damage history?
Buy that one for $70,000 and risk an engine over haul.

The new airplane for $100,000 seems like a better value to me.

to what RV7Charlie wrote.

rv7charlie said:

To the OP,

Just typed a longer message, but my computer ate it.

Short version: I'll let others debate legalities and wisdom, but *if* you know what you're doing, you can fly pretty much all the 'gentleman's acro' positive maneuvers in an RVx at well under 3.5 Gs. (The 'acro limit' weight is for 6 Gs.)

If hard core acro is your goal, an RV probably isn't the plane you want.

FWIW,

Charlie

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Thx, I doubt I will be pursuing any hard core acro but if I do it wil be in something else. “Gentleman’s acro” is a good description of what I am after right now. It is always nice to be able to go out and loop / roll something without it falling apart.

Looks like the RV6 to 7 cost difference is substantial. For my mission I’m not sure that I should pay $40k+ more for an extra 125bs of gross aerobatic weight allowance.

I'd have to agree, and since any -7 you're likely to find will be loaded up with more empty weight, the weight benefit could be even smaller.

I'm sure I'm not the only person who's flown lots of 2-up acro in a -4, and I'm also sure that it happens in -6s pretty frequently, too. You just have to 'know your limitations'.

Charlie

rv7charlie said:

I'd have to agree, and since any -7 you're likely to find will be loaded up with more empty weight, the weight benefit could be even smaller.

I'm sure I'm not the only person who's flown lots of 2-up acro in a -4, and I'm also sure that it happens in -6s pretty frequently, too. You just have to 'know your limitations'.

Charlie

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100% agree.!

The first two times I was in a 6 we went upside down. (Pre-RV7).
One was with a Vans employee.

However, I deny any knowledge of me doing any of that

I did not eyeball the plane but it was online. It looked nice, $42K for an RV-4. It looked nice. I think it had a Dynon D-10 and mix of mechanical gauges... It had a fixed sensenich, recall 160HP... The RV-4 flies as well or better than later model RV's. Yes the cockpit is smaller but so what. Unless you are up there in the bubba scale it's not bad. Yes it has less fuel (unless you put in aux tanks). Dave Anders has a 244 MPH RV-4.

An RV-6 is but basically a clip wing RV-7 (shorter wing span) with less fuel. The fuselage is the same. The big change was the RV-7 had the pre punched parts, the RV-6 layout and drill your own holes...

RV-3,-4,-6 have been out for +30 years, The RV-8 and RV-7 have been out for over 20 years I believe. You want a bargain don't expect an Oshkosh award winner with a full GX3 panel, 2 axis autopilot and custom show paint job... Older models with tired paint, analog panels are the best deal. Everyone is demanding glass, autopilot... which is about $12,000 to $20,000 or more, not including installation (which I assume you would do yourself).

Then there is the prop and engine. Most people want 180HP or 200HP or more. A 160HP RV-4 scoots along very nicely. Prop? I am a C/S fan, so that would be on my list. Of course engine condition, compression, hours is critical as well. On the other hand buy a used RV and leave it as is, with less than perfect paint and panel... fly and have fun....

gmcjetpilot said:

...

An RV-6 is but basically a clip wing RV-7 (shorter wing span) with less fuel. The fuselage is the same. The big change was the RV-7 had the pre punched parts, the RV-6 layout and drill your own holes...
...

Just a different point of view.......

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The -7 has a longer fuselage than the -6, in addition to the longer wing. It also has a larger VS and rudder.

The center section is significantly different between the two as well

The -7's tend to be more uniform in their construction as the come from pre-punched match hole kits; whereas, the -6 is built in a jig created by the builder.

The -6 was designed for the O-320 150 HP and O-360 180 HP engines. The 180 HP engine was considered the "big" engine and aircraft with this engine tend to be on the heavier side. The -7 was designed to accept engines ranging from the 160 HP O-320 to the 200 hp IO-360 angle valve engine. The 180 HP (I)O-360 parallel valve engine has become the "standard" engine of choice, with some builders installing larger or smaller engines based on their finances and desires.

I have a theory that the average builder only has about 2200 hours in their soul. The early builders have simpler planes because it took longer to build the basic structure and the newer models have more complexity (and weight) because they spend less time in the structure and more time on their panels, options, and interiors.

Good luck finding what you want / desire.

Aerobatic Gross

Kooshball said:

Thx, I doubt I will be pursuing any hard core acro but if I do it wil be in something else. ?Gentleman?s acro? is a good description of what I am after right now. It is always nice to be able to go out and loop / roll something without it falling apart.

Looks like the RV6 to 7 cost difference is substantial. For my mission I?m not sure that I should pay $40k+ more for an extra 125bs of gross aerobatic weight allowance.

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Actually, the -7 has 225 higher gross aerobatic weight than the -6.

1600 vs 1375.

Skylor
RV-8