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Manual flap -6 or am I dumb?

punkin

Well Known Member
I posted a question earlier about converting my rv-6 back to manual flaps...didn't get any replies.

Today, I asked an RV-8 builder at the airport (a guy I respect a lot!) and he told me the RV-6 was never built with manual flaps.

Am I all wet? We all make mistakes (I make more than most), but I thought for sure the -6 had manual flaps with a lever between the seats?

If it never existed, I really don't want to invent it...but if it did, I'd like to figure out how to put mine back that way.

Thanks!
 
The -6 models did indeed come with manual flaps. Even though most conversions have been from manual to electric, there is no reason why you can't make the move back to manual if you purchase the required parts. Take a look at a set of -6 plans to get the part numbers you need and order from Vans. Or....post your request here on VAF, there may be some -6 owners who saved the old flap lever and associated parts when they made the conversion to electric.
 
I've had manual flaps for 10 years in my RV6. Wouldn't put a motor on them if you held a gun to my head.
 
Well...I may be crazy, but not because of this.

Glad to know it's an option.

I'll toss an ad in the classifieds to see if anyone is sitting on the parts. Thanks guys!
 
When I built my -6, it was manual flaps, manual trim, tail wheel, and tip-up canopy. No other options.
All that "modern" stuff came later. None of which interested me!

I have an extra manual flap weldment, but not interested is getting rid of it. I could send you dimensions but I think they are depicted in the plans.
 
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Thanks Mel

If it's handy and you could shoot a photo and dimensions that'd be cool.

I suppose I ought to buy a set of plans anyway, since you guys seem as familiar with them as I am with my kids!
 
If it's handy and you could shoot a photo and dimensions that'd be cool.

I suppose I ought to buy a set of plans anyway, since you guys seem as familiar with them as I am with my kids!

Scott the plans are on two sheets page 40 & 42 of the RV6 plans set.
PM me your address and I'll send you the pages if you like. I looked up the part numbers on Vans site and they came up blank so you may not be able to get them anymore. But if your skilled in metal working and mechanically handy you could easily build the parts from the plans. It's a very simple setup.
 
I posted a question earlier about converting my rv-6 back to manual flaps...didn't get any replies.

Today, I asked an RV-8 builder at the airport (a guy I respect a lot!) and he told me the RV-6 was never built with manual flaps.

Am I all wet? We all make mistakes (I make more than most), but I thought for sure the -6 had manual flaps with a lever between the seats?

If it never existed, I really don't want to invent it...but if it did, I'd like to figure out how to put mine back that way.

Thanks!

Probably a good idea to see if anyone in the region has one you can fly, if even from the right seat, just to get a feel for what you will have.

It is obviously a personal preference - I've had zero issues in 1600 hours with my electric flaps. I did fly a couple hours in a 6A with manual flaps, but didn't care for them. For me, it was an awkward maneuver.
 
Electric or manual..... kind of like what paint color you like best.

There are plus's and minus's to both.

Manual flaps can be an added distraction to someone new to an RV equipped with them.

It the hands of someone that knows what they are doing they can provide some added capability that an electric flap RV doesn't have.

If you gave me an electric flap kit for my 6A I would sell and and by gas.
 
Deployment speed

I don't have a problem with my 'lectric ones...I just would prefer to be able to deploy and dump them much quicker for short field work.
 
The only problem with my manual flaps is when the passenger (especially my 6 year old son in his car seat) interferes with my ability to move the lever. I have yet to find a car seat that doesn't take up the entire width of the passenger seat and then some.

Otherwise, I love 'em. Wouldn't add the extra weight, maintenance, and delay factor for anything.
 
I made four changes when I installed my manual flaps that made a big differance in how they worked.

1. Shortened the handle to lay flat on the floor, but up just enough to get your fingers under to pull.

2. Filled in the release button and then ground it down so it would slide into the tube and NOT pinch your thumb.

3. Cut a ramp out of the second notch so you just pull for full flaps.

4. Installed hexagon links instead of the tubing..... far easier to adjust and tighten.

Manual flaps need "butt" space to work comfortably. If you have the space, then there is one less thing to go wrong during the life of your plane, and is maintenance free except for a little lube........ K.I.S.S.
 
Probably a good idea to see if anyone in the region has one you can fly, if even from the right seat, just to get a feel for what you will have.

It is obviously a personal preference - I've had zero issues in 1600 hours with my electric flaps. I did fly a couple hours in a 6A with manual flaps, but didn't care for them. For me, it was an awkward maneuver.

This is excellent advise. I flew my RV-6 with manual flaps for three years and it was a seamless transition from the Warrior (manual flaps) I had flown previously. However, I too often found deploying the manual flaps was an awkward maneuver that was preceded with requesting a portly passenger give me a bit of room around the flap lever. I then proceeded to poke them in the ribs with my elbow as I pulled the lever.

The electric flaps are so much easier to use, I have the flap switch on the panel where I can use it with my hand on the throttle. Retracting electric flaps after touchdown during a max performance landing is as efficient as dumping manual flaps (if good short-field technique is used) and I don't have to take my right hand off the flight controls.

I have no desire to make the move back to manual flaps in my 1999 RV-6.
 
Check your email

Scott , photos of the plans are in your email box. I think you can read them well enough help to make your decision. If you would like the originals just PM me with your physical address and I'll get them in the snail mail. Only my 2 cents but I think you already have the best control already installed. :)
 
This is excellent advise. I flew my RV-6 with manual flaps for three years and it was a seamless transition from the Warrior (manual flaps) I had flown previously. However, I too often found deploying the manual flaps was an awkward maneuver that was preceded with requesting a portly passenger give me a bit of room around the flap lever. I then proceeded to poke them in the ribs with my elbow as I pulled the lever.

The electric flaps are so much easier to use, I have the flap switch on the panel where I can use it with my hand on the throttle. Retracting electric flaps after touchdown during a max performance landing is as efficient as dumping manual flaps (if good short-field technique is used) and I don't have to take my right hand off the flight controls.

I have no desire to make the move back to manual flaps in my 1999 RV-6.

I did leave one thing out in my above list..... my seat backs are only 12 inches wide. That makes a nice gap between the seats to reach for things behind the passenger seat. It also provides a space for my elbow as I pull in full flaps. Between that and the lever being lower to the floor and shorter, it all works fine.

I also came from a Warrior and do like the manual flaps. But, I did make many changes for the manual flaps. I do like the elbow space on each side of my seat. It allows me to get things out of my pockets and reach things that were restricted.

If I had a choice of Van's stock manual flaps with no alterations...... I would install the electric flap kit and move on.

I do not like the flap motor between the seats. Van just chopped off the handle and installed a L/A as a flap motor. He did move the weldment to the backside of the bulkhead, but created a doghouse between the seats. I would move the flap motor over to the right cargo wall and install it to mount on the seat bulkhead right behind the armrest. No doghouse to make, it takes longer to install the doghouse than the system itself.
 
I would move the flap motor over to the right cargo wall and install it to mount on the seat bulkhead right behind the armrest. No doghouse to make, it takes longer to install the doghouse than the system itself.

Now that is a good idea. Are you reading this Allan Nimmo?
 
This is excellent advise. I flew my RV-6 with manual flaps for three years and it was a seamless transition from the Warrior (manual flaps) I had flown previously. However, I too often found deploying the manual flaps was an awkward maneuver that was preceded with requesting a portly passenger give me a bit of room around the flap lever. I then proceeded to poke them in the ribs with my elbow as I pulled the lever.

The electric flaps are so much easier to use, I have the flap switch on the panel where I can use it with my hand on the throttle. Retracting electric flaps after touchdown during a max performance landing is as efficient as dumping manual flaps (if good short-field technique is used) and I don't have to take my right hand off the flight controls.

I have no desire to make the move back to manual flaps in my 1999 RV-6.

I forgot to mention that my flap handle was shortened so it would roost against the floor. That gets it out of the way when the flaps are retracted but does require more effort to deploy the flaps.

finish18.jpg


But I didn't do the mod to prevent a nasty blood blister when you get pinched by the handle plunger.... :mad:
 
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My project came with electric flaps, and as it was unbuilt at the time, I gave it some serious thought to sell the electric and make it manual flaps. I flew cessna 180's on floats a lot during the first part of my career, and really learned to love the manual flaps when your trying to get every inch of performance out of an aeroplane. However as I do not intend on doing serious bush flying with my RV I opted to stick with electric to save myself the space in the cockpit.

Just my 2 cents!

Alex
 
There is at least one -7 out there that was built with manual flaps. (As stated above, electric flaps were an option for the -4 & -6.)

I believe the -7 and above all have electric flaps by default.

When I built my -9, I looked into installing manual flaps and was told that due to the length and design of the slotted flaps, I wouldn't have the strength to deploy them. So, electric flaps it is.

I have had issues with the electric flaps. Early on, some of the motors had too much grease in them and they would stop working at random times.

The fix was to clean out the motor and reassemble it. Since doing that I haven't had an issue.

Not all is sunshine with manual flaps though. During my transition training in a friend's -6, we were on short final with all the flaps deployed. All of a sudden the flaps retracted one notch. I must not have set them properly. We were lucky and other than a minor surprise, we landed normally.
 
I do not like the flap motor between the seats. Van just chopped off the handle and installed a L/A as a flap motor. He did move the weldment to the backside of the bulkhead, but created a doghouse between the seats. I would move the flap motor over to the right cargo wall and install it to mount on the seat bulkhead right behind the armrest. No doghouse to make, it takes longer to install the doghouse than the system itself.

I have seen this mod. before. It is very similar to the system on the RV-8 with one exception. The fuselage is much wider so the torsional load on the torque tube is much higher and it will cause a slight asymmetric flap deployment (because of twist in the tube) unless a heavier wall tube is used.

I forgot to mention that my flap handle was shortened so it would roost against the floor. That gets it out of the way when the flaps are retracted but does require more effort to deploy the flaps.

finish18.jpg


But I didn't do the mod to prevent a nasty blood blister when you get pinched by the handle plunger.... :mad:

The button has been redesigned so that it no longer has the relief notch which solves the finger pinch problem.
 
One more opinion...

I adopted my RV6A w/tip-up canopy from the original builder 4 years and almost 400 hours ago. I asked a friend who was very familiar with this airplane if there was anything he would change on the airplane. He said the first thing he would do is replace the manual flaps with electric. I looked up the parts and IIRC, the total came to about $600.00. My first priority was to add a fuel flow transducer to the GRT EIS4000 engine monitor. By the time I got around to thinking about replacing the flaps, I decided I'd rather spend the money on AVGAS. The only issue I have is if my right seater is on the larger size, they have to pull their left arm over in front of them so I can work the handle. I have several hundred hours in Cherokees so a manual flap handle didn't bother me.
I should say that the guy who suggested changing to electric flaps built a 6A with a slider so I shouldn't have been listening to him anyway. :) ***Flame Suit On***
 
I have seen this mod. before. It is very similar to the system on the RV-8 with one exception. The fuselage is much wider so the torsional load on the torque tube is much higher and it will cause a slight asymmetric flap deployment (because of twist in the tube) unless a heavier wall tube is used.


The button has been redesigned so that it no longer has the relief notch which solves the finger pinch problem.

I did go to the next size tube. It just fit over the stock tube. I just cut off the ends and heliarc'ed them onto the bigger dia. tube, bored out the bearing blocks and dropped it in. I also had to weld a saddle tab to receive the end of the L/A. For support I mounted the top of the L/A right behind the armrest.
Due to the shorter throw in that configuration, I did install a limit switch.
 
Keep the manual flaps

If the -7 had a manual flap option, I would have definitely done that instead of electric, FWIW.

Advantages to manual flaps:

- Less stuff to fail
- Much faster extend/retract
- Less expensive
- Lighter(?)
- Save a wire run
- Better for certain STOL techniques
 
Manual flaps

My 6,8102C has manual flaps. Wouldn't have it any other way. They are quick ,simple and easy to get on and off. Also no mistake knowing where they are. That's the way I built it 22 years ago.
 
I don't think it is a dumb idea. 90% of my flying is solo and my back side is small so operation of the handle is easy. I enjoy the feedback as you engage them.
I put in electric flaps because "that is what you did" as you had to have all the options right?
I have no issues with electric. I also don't operate in any conditions that manual would be impactful. RV's are very capable either way. I wouldn't go through all the work on a flying airplane to change but I understand if someone wants too. I also wouldn't change to electric if I had manual.
 
I'm 6' 4" with a 36" sleeve length and find manual flaps in an RV6 nearly impossible to use because my elbow hits the seat back before I can fully lift the flap handle. I like manual flap and manual trim where practical but, for me, not in a 6. Concur with advice above: fly before your buy (or decide).
 
I've thought about switching to electric flaps once in a while, mostly to get the flap handle out from between the seats. But then I go fly and every once in a while appreciate the quick response of the manual flaps, and that makes me forget about electric.
 
Scott,
All early RV6's were ONLY available with manual flaps, later Van offered the electric option and a retrofit kit. I loved the manual flaps on my -6 so much that I built them into my -7. They are simple and reliable. As others have stated, you need to acquire a -6 weldment for the retrofit. You will also need the internal button and spring parts. No big deal installing this setup, although some fabrication will be required for the latching arm and internal mechanism. You will also need to shorten the actuator arms (hex is way to go), also you can shorten the handle to your liking. Since you mentioned that you are not a "builder", you may want to get some assistance from an RV guy.

Good Luck.
Jake
 
Elect. Flaps

Hi I have a RV-6 with Manual flaps and I would be interested in your elect. flap components. If you'd like to do a straight across trade feel free to call me at 626-893-1774

Gabe
 
Elec. components

Hey gabe, I went ahead and converted with stuff I built after a kind VAF?r sent me the page from the plans that detailed the manual flap setup.

I had several people tell me they were interested in the elec. setup, but no one actually pulled the trigger after I pm?d them.

No clue what it?s worth; I?ve never had the issues with the motor that some have had, but I do believe it to be original (plane first flew in 1994).

Motor, sheet metal ?cover?covered in vinyl, and part I cut off for actuator attachment...

I?m in Ecuador again until the 3rd of Abril, but feel free to shoot me a pm and let me know what it?s worth to ya. I don?t believe the sheet metal pieces will fit in a usps large flat rate box, but I?d be happy to try. :)
 
One more thing...

I love the setup. I actually 3d printed the button and slotted part of the plunger from ABS, and used a piece of aluminum between them. works like a champ. followed (I think it was Mel’s) advice and set the notches at roughly 13/26/39 degrees. I used this time to do what my a&p has been chiding me to do and swapped the actuator doohickeys from the homemade round ones to hex threaded ones, and adjusted to where I actually get a true zero degree flap now instead of about 1.5*.

For my style of flying (learning) in and out of short, rough, fields...it has been PERFECT! Love the manual flaps.
 
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I love the setup. I actually 3d printed the button and slotted part of the plunger from ABS, and used a piece of aluminum between them. works like a champ. followed (I think it was Mel?s) advice and set the notches at roughly 13/26/39 degrees.
For my style of flying (learning) in and out of short, rough, fields...it has been PERFECT! Love the manual flaps.

Yep, That's my settings! Been flying that way since 1993 and wouldn't change a thing. BTW, I'm about to put my flaps up for sale. I'll even throw in the rest of the airplane as a bonus.
 
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