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Etiquette

n5lp

fugio ergo sum
As I was preparing to put my airplane back in the hangar after a flight I was approached by an out-of-town RV owner. Good, I rarely see any fellow pilots at my airport, much less an RV owner. After chatting a while, 50 feet from the airplane, I made the mistake of walking over to it and opening the canopy for avionics comparison purposes.

It started sort of gentle. I can overlook a greasy arm resting on the canopy. That can be cleaned. Then the body resting on the fuselage, actually moving the airplane. Then I notice the metal bracelet on the wrist that is resting on the plexiglass. Wow! I don't understand the need to lean. The fellow appears competent to stand upright.

I decided I just needed to put the airplane away so started opening the hangar doors. He jumps in to "help". I repeatedly said that I "have it", knowing the any help with these particular doors means a lot of time and aggravation trying to get the doors back on the tracks. Shouldn't one admonition be enough?

Then I start pulling the airplane back in the hangar. Once again, he jumps in to "help" by pushing on the spinner. Aaaagh! Once again it took four requests to get him to stop helping by abusing my airplane.

I know, I'm pretty grumpy this morning, but I just don't get it. Is it some kind of dominance display? What is wrong with just looking or if one feels the need to touch something or "help", asking before doing it. I would have thought a fellow RV owner would have thought this out a little better.
 
Help

Maybe he's on VAF and will read your post.
Personally any time I am near any one else's airplane, my hands go into my pockets and I ask if they want help. My rule applies to my bird too. I always say, "hands in your pockets".
 
Maybe he's on VAF and will read your post.
Personally any time I am near any one else's airplane, my hands go into my pockets and I ask if they want help. My rule applies to my bird too. I always say, "hands in your pockets".

I was always told "If you can't pay for it, don't touch it."
 
I'm with you...I don't get the need to touch things. Wingtips, props, control surfaces. How about NOT touching my baby, and for sure don't jump in to "help" unless I ask you!

Even worse are the guys who, when you politely remind them to watch their belt buckles, watches, etc. (I'm reminding them because they're about to get said item close to my girl's paint job), they get snippy about it: "I know!" or "Yeah, I got it!" said with "that tone" of voice that would have gotten me smacked by my mom.

Grrrrr.....
 
Common sense just isn't too common anymore I'm afraid... As builders/owners we have every right to be proud and protective of what we have worked so hard to build and maintain. People can think what they want of me for telling them to keep their hands off.

I guess this topic hits home with me because I was taught from a very young age to be super respectful of property and don't mess with anything that isn't yours. I expect the same of others around my possessions.
 
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It seems like I always need to explain that its easier for one person to push my -A model backwards due to the castering nose wheel. The Cessna types always want to push on a wing.

I always let them know its appreciated, but not required on a 1000 lb airplane
 
It is aggravating for sure. That other people don't seem to "get it" is what is frustrating. I have had people sit on wing, lean on the wing tip or leading edge, thump a bottle cap towards the trash only to miss by a mile and hit the wing. The most popular one seems to be to sit a drink on the airplane wing or cowling. If I did those things to their airplane or automobile, I wonder how they would react. I have gotten to where I am not concerned about hurting someone's feelings in this regard. I tell folks that are not aviators to not touch anything in the hangar except concrete if you must. They usually laugh.
 
Personally any time I am near any one else's airplane, my hands go into my pockets and I ask if they want help.

I do the same thing. I try very hard not to touch anyone's airplane without an invitation to do so.

Of course, there was the day I very carefully ducked under the wing of a BD-4 to peek into the cockpit... did my admiring... then promptly stood up right into the bottom of the wing when someone startled me from behind :eek:
 
Caught my Dad (whos also a pilot) leaning on the wing of my plane (that I'm still building). 'Bout jumped outta my skin at him, but I bit my tongue. I think I'll name my plane "Dont lean on me".
 
About 12 years ago my hangar door was open, I come out of my home (hangar apartment)
And a guy 35 years old is taking photos of his kid 5 years old sitting on the horizontal stab of my luscombe, I am retired now but at the time was a houston police officer. So dumb dad got a ride to jail I let mom come get the kid. Dad got to spend some time in jail spend lots of money on legal and pay for the damage to my luscombe before I dropped charges. In Texas unlawful entry to a building is burglary and if that building is a home its a higher charge. Sorry the kid had to go through that,,, kids can't pick there parents.
 
I am always eager........

to help.

So i find myself approaching a plane to help out. Recently I became aware that I should ask" would you like some help?"

I think we as builders/ pilots need to be aware that many people simply want to help and unaware as to the dangers in bending something needed or awkward and make a bad mistake scratching something.

We need to simply say I am okay thanks and stop if they dont. Or show them the way , the proper way to help.

Mostly up to us. It is our plane, our lives at risk!

Dave
 
I had my plane up on jacks with the wheels retracted and the guy from the hangar behind me stopped by and started leaning on the cowling. I had to snap at him "Don't do that!". What's wrong with people?
 
Airshows. My brother caught some clown climbing up his Rocket by stepping and pivoting his foot on the wheel pant heading for the wing. Unbelievable! Had my RV6 at a small airshow and had to stand guard for the parents as much as the little kids. The airshow announcer told folks not to touch the cars but said nothing about the planes?? What the heck?
 
I always ASK to help when an airplane goes in or out of a hangar. Most of the time I am told no help is needed. When I get that answer, I put my hands in my pockets, step to one side of the hangar and watch to make sure nothing hits the side.
 
So check out today's front page: a little one, apparently unmonitored, pushing on a rudder and dangerously close to spilling a sticky drink on polished aluminum. Do all parents think their kids are too perfect to be disciplined?
 
...few into a breakfast last month, as I taxied the airport manager asked me over the radio if I would park front center at the breakfast hangar...after parking it took all of my attention police'n my bird. Then a man helped his kid up on the wing, I walked over, tapped the man's shoulder and asked if the boy would like to sit in the seat...then a line formed, many photos were taken, ... I left three hours later to fly home and clean inside and out for an hour.

BUT, it was fun and I met a lot of nice, appreciative people. I'm glad I took the positive response rather than another.
 
...few into a breakfast last month, as I taxied the airport manager asked me over the radio if I would park front center at the breakfast hangar...after parking it took all of my attention police'n my bird. Then a man helped his kid up on the wing, I walked over, tapped the man's shoulder and asked if the boy would like to sit in the seat...then a line formed, many photos were taken, ... I left three hours later to fly home and clean inside and out for an hour.

BUT, it was fun and I met a lot of nice, appreciative people. I'm glad I took the positive response rather than another.

That's awesome

It's a shame that pilots or hanger folks don't know etiquett. But always with new people some nice ground rules need to be set.
Face it, we have a cool hobby and people for the most part love aviation and cool airplanes.
I too have inappropriately approached and touched aircraft. It happens but immediately remember my place.
 
This seems to happen a lot...

I am the same. Whenever I walk around other peoples airplanes I put my hands in my pocket. This is as much for me to no accidentally touch anything as to show the owner if he is watching that I "got it" and am not touching anything.

I took a friend up for local flying 2 times and by the second time he got a bit to comfortable and and while I was walking around the tail doing my preflight thing he goes "what is this for" as he walks the trim tab on the Rudder of the 172!!! OH BOY. I just about bit his head of.
 
Bruce,

Was it your plane at the Pearson Young Eagle event a few years back when the lady helped her child into the plane while it was unattended?
 
I remember a rather nice Chipmunk that was parked at an airshow, where a man placed his 1-2 year old child on the wingtip, standing up, and then walked down to the wing root where he called to the child to run down to him. The owner saw this before the child moved and put a stop to it.

I know from experience that you can't take a polished airplane to a fly-in and expect to bring it home without needing another polish. Everyone and their dog seems to want to slobber over the leading edges, the prop, and the rudder.
 
I was picking a doctor up from a native reserve one time, and I was a bit early so I had some time to kill on the dock. A really nice young boy came along and asked a few questions about the plane. He was genuinely interested so I asked if he wanted to sit in the cockpit and I showed him how the controls work. Well, every kid in the town saw this and came running down to the dock. Next thing I know there was about 10 kids packed into a cessna 180 cockpit, kids jumping off the wings, hanging off the floats, grabbing the tail... I was pulling my hair out trying to keep them off and I was sure thankful when the doctor showed up for his flight home. No damage was done so I just had to sit back and laugh once it was all over.

Oh and I was berry picking day for the kids... So I had a lot of blackberry juice finger prints to clean off!

Alex
 
Look at it a different way

I know everyone is proud of their machines. All the hard work and effort to make it perfect. Of course you want to keep it perfect and looking good. However, it is a tool. It something you use to get something done. It might be traveling or acrobatics or entertainment or meeting new people that enrich your life. Maybe it lights the aviation spark in the young mind of one of those berry pickers. Anyway, if you step back and look at the big picture and worry more about the important things and worry less about a smudge or scratch, you will be a happier, more fulfilled person. (Safety of flight damage is another story) The older you get the easier it is to see what is really important in life. Just saying.
 
I know everyone is proud of their machines. All the hard work and effort to make it perfect. Of course you want to keep it perfect and looking good. However, it is a tool. It something you use to get something done. It might be traveling or acrobatics or entertainment or meeting new people that enrich your life. Maybe it lights the aviation spark in the young mind of one of those berry pickers. Anyway, if you step back and look at the big picture and worry more about the important things and worry less about a smudge or scratch, you will be a happier, more fulfilled person. (Safety of flight damage is another story) The older you get the easier it is to see what is really important in life. Just saying.


And thats just it. I've always been generous when it comes to letting people, especially kids, sit in or check out my plane. If it gets scratched or dirty during that process then so be it. But back to the OP's point, about a RV owner himself being negligent with someone else's aircraft, thats totally unacceptable.

My .02c ( or $5 canadian)

Alex
 
Some friends and hangar neighbors were asking me why I?m so hectic working on the plane. I couldn?t tell them but it is usually because I have to watch them any second trying to stop them in time leaning on the plane (with metal buckles of course), feeling the paint with their ringed fingers or putting things on the wings.
I too show anybody the plane when interested, let them sit in it or give them a ride. When it comes to cleaning the plane I "release" them from help. Even some pilots don?t know how to do it, some clean the wheel pants first then using the same sponge scratching the windshield.
We might be a little oversensitive but some people just don?t respect other`s toys.
 
I had a 16 y.o. "hoodlum" (friend of a friend visiting the hangar) start to write some graffiti into the light dust on my -4's canopy. Haven't seen either of them since. And that's all I have to say about that.
 
...
Personally any time I am near any one else's airplane, my hands go into my pockets and I ask if they want help. ....

I've explained this to other non-aircraft-owners as my "trick to looking at airplanes". All you have to do is sit in Ellie's and watch the RV guys who're eating breakfast with one eye out the window when a stranger approaches one of their airplanes for this to be self-explanatory.
 
So check out today's front page: a little one, apparently unmonitored, pushing on a rudder and dangerously close to spilling a sticky drink on polished aluminum. Do all parents think their kids are too perfect to be disciplined?

I appreciate the compliment, but I've yet to polish any part of my RV and that rudder is some of my roughest metal work on the whole airplane if you can excuse the 2 neighboring rivet gun smileys on the right aileron :D! The sippy cups did spurt a little chocolate milk/apple Juice on the cockpit rails and canopy due to the pressure differential at 12.5. I winced a tad when I saw it but it's no harder to clean up than the coffee dribbles from my leak-proof cup.

That Lil' dude had me wore out chasing him around the booths at OSH, I was hoping for a couple meaningful conversations with several vendors but they'll have to wait. We headed back to HBC camping early and waited for the airshow to start where we were both more comfortable.

I know he briefly touched others airplane's and left a few little fingerprints where they were unwanted, I try hard to keep a close eye on him and try to teach him to properly respect others' airplanes. Overall OSH 2017 was a success for us.

He's banged my ailerons to the stops, rode my wheelpants like a horse and has been disciplined many times as I try to teach him how to properly treat airplanes. This was the only airplane at OSH the Lil' Guy could touch, I think the pic shows that well. Hopefully by the time he's 5 he'll have more sense than the guy Larry mentioned in the first post. I too am guilty of trying to help push an airplane by the spinner at one time, recreation & education.
 
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Extreme reaction?

but at the time was a houston police officer. So dumb dad got a ride to jail. I let mom come get the kid. Dad got to spend some time in jail spend lots of money on legal and pay for the damage to my luscombe before I dropped charges.

This story bothers me. Clearly, there is more to this than you are letting on.
 
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Caught my Dad (whos also a pilot) leaning on the wing of my plane (that I'm still building). 'Bout jumped outta my skin at him, but I bit my tongue. I think I'll name my plane "Dont lean on me".

Good afternoon Sir.

It took every ounce of restraint not to unleash on this pleasant old fellow who felt the need to repeatedly stroke the paint on my rudder at a recent air Show!
 
I have had a Dad put his kid on my wing. I have had a kid run up behind my wing, engine running and Mom and Dad smiling while I get ready to taxi! I have had student pilots, on two occasions, Moncton NB, open my canopy get into my airplane and mess with the controls after hours when I was tied down!
However, if there are kids around, I ask the parent if I can lift their child into my seat and I show them what the stick does. I tell them to be very careful, and they are. These kids are the future of aviation even if they never fly a plane. They will be the public, the lawmakers, the noise complainers etc. They will remember the pilot who shouted at them for touching an airplane.
People are fascinated by airplanes, I was. If you do not want people to touch your plane you should probably leave it in the hangar.
 
Good afternoon Sir.

It took every ounce of restraint not to unleash on this pleasant old fellow who felt the need to repeatedly stroke the paint on my rudder at a recent air Show!

Q! You old dog! Shhhhhh. Dont tell the other guys we hang out with the enemy lol! ;)
 
Not quite the same but...

Last week I stopped for fuel at Big Bear and another plane taxies right up behind me in line. I'm thinking that now I'll have to pull my plane out by hand so I don't prop-blast this idiot and I've got a bad knee.

The guy gets out and walks up to me and asks if my plane is an RV-10. I confirmed that it is and then he informs me that he makes a fuel-quantity tester for my plane and wants to know if he can show it to me. After I agree, he pulls out this rather large glass tube with markings on it and sticks it in the fuel tank that I just filled and hadn't capped yet!

Nobody to blame but myself, but I sure learned a lesson!

-Marc
 
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Let them 'Help'.

Whenever someone wants to help me move my plane in or out of the hangar; I ask them to watch a wingtip to make sure I don't hit anything. Gives them something constructive to do,,, without touching anything.
 
In the real world most of us do far more damage to our planes than a kid could ever do.
1.Bad hard Landings
2.Slip of the screw driver
3.Flying in rain and knocking paint off
4.Hangar rash
5.Fuel nozzle
6.Bird strike
7.Taking cowl off
8.Ect....,

Lighten up share the joy if someone get to help you push your airplane in the hangar I'm sure it makes them feel proud and it might be the only time they ever get to help with an airplane.But if you don't no worry you will still be a jerk.
Bob
 
In the real world most of us do far more damage to our planes than a kid could ever do.
1.Bad hard Landings
2.Slip of the screw driver
3.Flying in rain and knocking paint off
4.Hangar rash
5.Fuel nozzle
6.Bird strike
7.Taking cowl off
8.Ect....,

Lighten up share the joy if someone get to help you push your airplane in the hangar I'm sure it makes them feel proud and it might be the only time they ever get to help with an airplane.But if you don't no worry you will still be a jerk.
Bob

If this is how you treat yours, you're not allowed to touch this jerks plane!:D And get off my lawn!
 
In the real world most of us do far more damage to our planes than a kid could ever do.
1.Bad hard Landings
2.Slip of the screw driver
3.Flying in rain and knocking paint off
4.Hangar rash
5.Fuel nozzle
6.Bird strike
7.Taking cowl off
8.Ect....,

Lighten up share the joy if someone get to help you push your airplane in the hangar I'm sure it makes them feel proud and it might be the only time they ever get to help with an airplane.But if you don't no worry you will still be a jerk.
Bob

That may be - but it's mine to tear up, not someone elses.
 
Many valid points here indeed. I'd like to share another one, a very recent experience.

Several weeks ago our EAA chapter held it's annual Fly In Breakfast. I had our Glasair Sportsman project all spiffed up, with all the avionics running and the doors wide open, sitting in our carefully roped-off hangar. The hangar doors were open and inviting. I spent the entire morning there talking to people. By the time I got done I think I had counted 20 kids that I had hoisted into the pilot's seat. Three of these showed particular interest.

Fast forward to this past Tuesday. I was able to take two of these kids up for flights as Young Eagles (in our flying airplane). The mom was insistent on paying for gas but I refused and later sent her a photo I had taken in flight. The photo showed her daughter flying the airplane all by herself, with the biggest smile on her face. She could hardly believe that she was flying the airplane. She did so with astounding smoothness, and followed up with a stream of thanks on the ground, as did her older brother following his flight.

Cost of that Young Eagles flight? 1 Big Smile. Paid in full!

Yes, we like to pamper our airplanes. In the grand scheme of things, if we're lucky one of those very inquisitive kids that leaves nose prints on the canopy will one day come to cherish the exhilaration and beauty of flight. I'll keep cleaning off the nose prints in hopes my airplane will be the one that lights a spark in the next generation.
 
More...

Once I had driven up to my hangar. Another car pulled up behind me.
I got out and walked up to my hangar door. I unlocked it and walked into the dark hangar (my light switch is on the left wall). A man (stranger to me) walked in behind me so close he was practically stepping on the backs of my shoes. He scared the living **** out of me. Never introduced himself. He was looking for our field mechanic and was told he was in my hangar.

Earlier the mechanic was in my hangar, but was long gone.

No introduction, no sorry for the intrusion, nothing. walked away miffed the mechanic was not inside. These are individual County hangars and I pay the rent and electric bill.

I thought that was crossing some boundaries.


We have another guy on our field, been a hangar renter for years. He keeps an aircraft and classic cars in his hangar. He obviously keeps nothing else because he borrows everything he needs from everyone. Wrenches, rags, sharpie markers, quart of oil, screwdrivers, creeper, wax, etc. you get the picture... Most of the time you never get the item back. If you try to make an excuse he gets miffed you aren't willing to rifle through your things to give him what he needs. Keep in mind I'm just a blue collar working man. I recently found out this man is a high paid attorney in a very high end part of town. He can obviously afford to buy his own.
 
Agreed...

In the real world most of us do far more damage to our planes than a kid could ever do.
1.Bad hard Landings
2.Slip of the screw driver
3.Flying in rain and knocking paint off
4.Hangar rash
5.Fuel nozzle
6.Bird strike
7.Taking cowl off
8.Ect....,

Lighten up share the joy if someone get to help you push your airplane in the hangar I'm sure it makes them feel proud and it might be the only time they ever get to help with an airplane.But if you don't no worry you will still be a jerk.
Bob

I certainly don't condone disrespecting others property, but I have to agree with Bob.

The contrast between this thread and the pictures of Vlad's visit to the grass strip in BC are interesting to me. People are climbing all over Vlad's airplane like ants. Several appear to be leaning against the wing in the group picture.

Draw you own conclusions.

Michael-
 
I've always been totally fascinated with anything that flys. Unfortunately I never had the means, nor the opportunity to participate. As I grew older, I went to every airshow I could, and would often just drive out to the airport to sit and watch airplanes. I read aviation books all the time, including the old Jeppesen training manuals, cover to cover, trying to learn as much as possible. I didn't know anybody that flew, and had no knowledge of how to even get started. All I knew was it took lots of money, and that was something I didn't have.
Finally, in my 30's I was able to take the plunge. I've owned several small aircraft since then, and have experienced many of the things so many of you guys are bitching about. It's attitudes like the ones displayed here, which in part, caused people like me to never have the opportunity to experience the very thing I had wanted to do since I was in diapers. Locked gates, locked doors, people who won't talk, and people who will readily treat you like some stray dog. I know your type.
I always had an interest in aerobatics, and many years ago when I owned my Cherokee, I flew it to a regional gathering. I had hoped to talk to someone about learning how to get involved. I spent a couple hours walking around trying to talk to people, and finally left disgusted. The only thing I came away with that day was a come on by one of the participants who told me I could go to some other airport, some other day, and pay for a demo ride. Needless to say, I never went back. I eventually made close friends with a former AF instructor, and probably learned more anyhow. I remember how I was treated.
An airplane is nothing more than a machine. It's gonna take some abuse, and if your hangar door is open, or you take it somewhere to show it off, abuse goes with the territory. Unlike many of you, if you come by my hangar I'll stop anything I'm doing to talk to you. I have vivid memories of how I would have given my left nut just to be able to touch an airplane. I hold a special place in my heart for kids who show any interest in airplanes.
Over the years I've given many first rides. It's my understanding that next year one of those kids is supposed to be entering the AF Academy. If you show an interest, anytime, anywhere, I'll answer any question, and talk to you for as long as you like. Last year a fresh AF Academy graduate, on his way to learn to fly cargo aircraft showed up at my hangar door, and needless to say, we had a fun with the RV.
I remember how I was treated back when I wanted to fly so badly, and some of you should be totally ashamed of yourselves.
 
...Yes, we like to pamper our airplanes. In the grand scheme of things, if we're lucky one of those very inquisitive kids that leaves nose prints on the canopy will one day come to cherish the exhilaration and beauty of flight. I'll keep cleaning off the nose prints in hopes my airplane will be the one that lights a spark in the next generation...

Greasy imprints on the canopy or polished prop are one thing; replacing a wheelpant because it looks like a good stepstool or replacing a spar because a mom thinks the stab is a convenient diaper changing station is quite another.
 
I've always been totally fascinated with anything that flys. Unfortunately I never had the means, nor the opportunity to participate. As I grew older, I went to every airshow I could, and would often just drive out to the airport to sit and watch airplanes. I read aviation books all the time, including the old Jeppesen training manuals, cover to cover, trying to learn as much as possible. I didn't know anybody that flew, and had no knowledge of how to even get started. All I knew was it took lots of money, and that was something I didn't have.
Finally, in my 30's I was able to take the plunge. I've owned several small aircraft since then, and have experienced many of the things so many of you guys are bitching about. It's attitudes like the ones displayed here, which in part, caused people like me to never have the opportunity to experience the very thing I had wanted to do since I was in diapers. Locked gates, locked doors, people who won't talk, and people who will readily treat you like some stray dog. I know your type.
I always had an interest in aerobatics, and many years ago when I owned my Cherokee, I flew it to a regional gathering. I had hoped to talk to someone about learning how to get involved. I spent a couple hours walking around trying to talk to people, and finally left disgusted. The only thing I came away with that day was a come on by one of the participants who told me I could go to some other airport, some other day, and pay for a demo ride. Needless to say, I never went back. I eventually made close friends with a former AF instructor, and probably learned more anyhow. I remember how I was treated.
An airplane is nothing more than a machine. It's gonna take some abuse, and if your hangar door is open, or you take it somewhere to show it off, abuse goes with the territory. Unlike many of you, if you come by my hangar I'll stop anything I'm doing to talk to you. I have vivid memories of how I would have given my left nut just to be able to touch an airplane. I hold a special place in my heart for kids who show any interest in airplanes.
Over the years I've given many first rides. It's my understanding that next year one of those kids is supposed to be entering the AF Academy. If you show an interest, anytime, anywhere, I'll answer any question, and talk to you for as long as you like. Last year a fresh AF Academy graduate, on his way to learn to fly cargo aircraft showed up at my hangar door, and needless to say, we had a fun with the RV.
I remember how I was treated back when I wanted to fly so badly, and some of you should be totally ashamed of yourselves.

You are talking about something entirely different. What you wanted, and failed to receive, was a simple human one-on-one pleasant interaction. I believe nearly everyone here would engage any visitor or curious passerby in a nice conversation, discussion of flying, showing off the plane, etc., and many would offer to take the person for a ride.

What others are describing is just flat-out lack of respect and courtesy on the part of the other person. If you bought a brand-new Porsche or Corvette or whatever, how do you think you'd feel if someone let their kid climb on the hood and run up and down on it? Or if they just opened the door and climbed in, or put their kid in? Maybe used the back seat to change their baby's diapers?

If someone is interested, pleasant and respectful of my property, then I'm all for chatting with them, getting to know them, showing them the plane, talking about flying, etc. If they're a decent sort who respects something I spent many years of blood, sweat and tears building, chances are they'll get an offer for a ride.

But be rude, or inconsiderate, or disrespectful, or "hard of hearing" when told not to touch something/etc., and I'll suddenly have a lot to do and it was nice meeting you have a nice day gotta get back to work...
 
If you bought a brand-new Porsche or Corvette or whatever, how do you think you'd feel if someone let their kid climb on the hood and run up and down on it? Or if they just opened the door and climbed in, or put their kid in? Maybe used the back seat to change their baby's diapers?

It would be incredibly rude and inconsiderate. And I guarantee it would happen, over and over again, unless I roped it off AND stood there to chase people off. If you don't believe me, go visit your local museum and see how they protect the stuff they have on display. The glass cases, ropes, docents, guards, etc. are only there because they are needed. Some people are just thoughtless, some are inconsiderate, some are ill-mannered, some are giant jerks, and a lot just don't know any better. Wishing it different won't make it different.
 
You are talking about something entirely different. What you wanted, and failed to receive, was a simple human one-on-one pleasant interaction. I believe nearly everyone here would engage any visitor or curious passerby in a nice conversation, discussion of flying, showing off the plane, etc., and many would offer to take the person for a ride.

What others are describing is just flat-out lack of respect and courtesy on the part of the other person. If you bought a brand-new Porsche or Corvette or whatever, how do you think you'd feel if someone let their kid climb on the hood and run up and down on it? Or if they just opened the door and climbed in, or put their kid in? Maybe used the back seat to change their baby's diapers?

If someone is interested, pleasant and respectful of my property, then I'm all for chatting with them, getting to know them, showing them the plane, talking about flying, etc. If they're a decent sort who respects something I spent many years of blood, sweat and tears building, chances are they'll get an offer for a ride.

But be rude, or inconsiderate, or disrespectful, or "hard of hearing" when told not to touch something/etc., and I'll suddenly have a lot to do and it was nice meeting you have a nice day gotta get back to work...

Agreed- Nobody here has said we aren't interested in talking to anyone, or promoting our love of flying in the younger generation.

I was a young eagle. When I got my license I came back and flew for young eagles, renting a flight school machine on my own dime. Now I'm an airline transport pilot flying dash 8 q400's. The gentleman who took me up for my young eagles flight is giving me advice on wiring my RV. I can't wait to take him up for a ride. Pretty neat I'd say, and I would love to have one of my young eagles do the same.

All we ask, and it's not much to ask, is that people have enough respect for our equipment to not cause PHYSICAL damage. Fingerprints, dirt and grease is just par for the course.

Alex
 
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It would be incredibly rude and inconsiderate. And I guarantee it would happen, over and over again, unless I roped it off AND stood there to chase people off. If you don't believe me, go visit your local museum and see how they protect the stuff they have on display. The glass cases, ropes, docents, guards, etc. are only there because they are needed. Some people are just thoughtless, some are inconsiderate, some are ill-mannered, some are giant jerks, and a lot just don't know any better. Wishing it different won't make it different.

I don't think people actually let their kids run up and down the hoods/tops/trunks of strangers new cars, or use someone else's car to change their kid's diapers, or any of the myriad other things they seem to do to airplanes, though.

For some reason, and I don't know why this is, even people who *should know better*, like other pilots, just can't help themselves...gotta push, pull, lean, swipe, scratch, etc., EVEN WHEN TOLD things like "no, I don't need any help, thank, though" or the like...
 
I don't think people actually let their kids run up and down the hoods/tops/trunks of strangers new cars, or use someone else's car to change their kid's diapers, or any of the myriad other things they seem to do to airplanes, though.
That may be because you don't hang out on car or motorcycle enthusiast web forums and listen to their horror stories about the incredibly inconsiderate, stupid things people do to their precious beloved babies. :)

People can do some really ignorant things. Maybe they're just used to "airplanes" being those virtually indestructible Boeing or Airbus things... they don't know that our planes are a lot more delicate. Anyway, I'm certainly not defending the stuff people do, just saying that it's going to happen if someone is not there to prevent it.
 
That may be because you don't hang out on car or motorcycle enthusiast web forums and listen to their horror stories about the incredibly inconsiderate, stupid things people do to their precious beloved babies. :)

People can do some really ignorant things. Maybe they're just used to "airplanes" being those virtually indestructible Boeing or Airbus things... they don't know that our planes are a lot more delicate. Anyway, I'm certainly not defending the stuff people do, just saying that it's going to happen if someone is not there to prevent it.

I like the guy who posted and said to the "it's just a _______" folks...go sit on some guy's Harley next time you see a bunch of them parked and see what happens. Try telling him "it's just a motorcycle!" and see how he reacts.

:)
 
I've been in the classic/custom car world my whole life and while I am certain that there are stories of inconsiderate people out there, "car show" attendees are FAR more considerate than "air show" attendees on the whole. I've had people do things to my airplanes right in front of my face that would warrant a punch in the face if done to my car in the Walmart parking lot. There is just something about airplanes that seems to invite stupidity in spectators.

Attendance for me at an aviation open house is now a guarantee of stress and never turning my back on my airplane for a second... Not because I'm worried about fingerprints or even a scratch or two - but because I'm sure I'll find a Coke can shoved in the cowl inlet, a broken wheelpant bracket or footprints all the way out to the wingtips. I find it much less work just to stay home.
 
Planes

Its a wonder Vans Aircraft demo planes even have wings on them and those other people (those ground bounders) have not tore the tail and wings off the demo planes after going to hundreds of air shows.How is it possible for that RV6 to still be flying?
Bob
 
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