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IFR

bhassel

bhassel

Well Known Member
I understand that there have been at least several folks thinking about the possibility of having an IFR panel. While I don't plan on flying IFR weather in the 12, I do want to become a better pilot and getting my IFR ticket is one way to do that and something I'd like to do.

I sent an email to Stein about what would it take to get there in a 12 (after the pink slip of course). I really want to go with a Dynon Skyview system.

The cheap route is a Nav/Com swapped for the Com. No worries about power. Or just add a NavCom (power issues) and a switch to swap the radios into the intercom. I may a little confused here. The expensive direction is a Garmin certified GPS 650/625 (not counting used equipment) and again power issues.

What are those of you who are considering this route doing?

Thanks,

Bob
 
Ex Bonanza Bucko said:
I think if the RV12 is flown as an LSA you can't fly it in IFR or at night.
EBB
Click to expand...

That would be a sport pilot restriction, not an aircraft restriction.

If the pilot is qualified, has a current medical, and the aircraft meets 91.205, all is fine.
 
Please clarify: Do you want to be able to train for and get your ifr rating, all the while flying under the hood in vfr conditions? Or do you want to fly in IMC?
If the latter:
1. IMHO You need a backup EFIS (or round gauges) that runs off an independent battery.
2. You'll want MBs and a second VOR, although one SL-30, with its two VOR capability, would work. You'll be shut out of all the gps-only airports, and the 'ADF required' ILSs, but it's a good start.

If you just want the rating, add an SL30, find an airport with an ILS that uses a VOR cross fix for the FAF, and train in vfr.
 
Rotax restriction

Probably a minor detail but Rotax in their documentation restricts the engine to VFR flight conditions only.
Dick Sipp
RV4 sold
RV10 sold
RV12
 
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I just installed this used marker beacon receiver to establish OM/FAF for ILS's in case of GPS failure. You can easily do the same for less than $500. The antenna can go in the wingtip. Wiring is easy. John
 
I built mine mainly for IFR training and to deal with the occasional pop-up IFR situation. Panel space is tight on the -12, here is what I have: complete Skyview setup (incl ARINC-429), Avidyne IFD-540 WAAS GPS/Comm, GTR-200, PM3000 + 3 position switch for COM1, COM2, NAV, and panel space for iPad-mini mount or SV-D700. This is a one piece panel and I ended up with a custom radio rack mounting bracket. I also installed a dual battery, triple buss electrical system. Other pains were adding three more antennas and a heated pitot on the wing.

If I were doing it again today, a GTN-650 and PMA450 Audio Panel would be a good alternative to the IFD-540 and PM3000 with 3-way Comm switch.

John Salak
RV-12 120116/N896HS
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BobTurner said:
Please clarify: Do you want to be able to train for and get your ifr rating, all the while flying under the hood in vfr conditions? Or do you want to fly in IMC?
If the latter:
1. IMHO You need a backup EFIS (or round gauges) that runs off an independent battery.
2. You'll want MBs and a second VOR, although one SL-30, with its two VOR capability, would work. You'll be shut out of all the gps-only airports, and the 'ADF required' ILSs, but it's a good start.

If you just want the rating, add an SL30, find an airport with an ILS that uses a VOR cross fix for the FAF, and train in vfr.
Click to expand...

I would like to get my IFR rating. I'm not looking to go into serious weather in an LSA. It would be nice to get on top in the mid-west or above the marine layer on the coast.

Bob
 
I put in a VAL VOR/ILS unit for training, proficiency and to address the legal issue if I want to file. I would not file "hard IMC" with this minimal equippage, but it's great for going IFR in congested areas during VMC.
 
I think people are kidding themselves with "light" or "not heavy" IFR. You can never be sure how thick that layer is. If you don't have backup attitude information, then you're betting your life that your one box won't die at the wrong time.
 
John, how many amps does your heated pitot pull? I thought they are usually about 10 and would therefore push total load towards/beyond alternator capacity.

Jack Moore
 
John Salak - what an accomplishment! I assume the extra battery gives you the heated pitot and you are still with the stock Rotax electrical supply?

Where is the cabin heat handle? What is the round thing below the throttle?

Thanks!
 
The power budget is one thing I realize I'll have to deal with. Outside of using the 2nd alternator (who knows what demons lurk there for the cowl, etc.) we're limited on what we can do.

Swapping out the GTR200 for the GNC255 is probably the easiest way to go without impacting the power situation in a major way. However, as others have mentioned it limits you to non-GPS approaches.

I'm not sure what the impact of the of replacing the radio with a GTN650 or GTN625 would be.

I'd probably have to give up my second Skyview.

Bob
 
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I sure hope that I am wrong on this one, but wouldn't a certified indicator also be required, in order to file, even a VOR, or Localizer approach?? If not, I'm going shopping..

Tom
 
todehnal said:
I sure hope that I am wrong on this one, but wouldn't a certified indicator also be required, in order to file, even a VOR, or Localizer approach?? If not, I'm going shopping..

Tom
Click to expand...

For operations under part 91, the simple answer is no. Look at all the people who use a CDI as part of their non-TSO'd (I presume that's what you meant by "certified") EFIS. Under part 91 the only nav equipment that must "meet the standards of" a TSO are an IFR GPS; transponder; and, starting in 2020, an ADSB-out unit. Your VOR, ILS, ADF, or DME box does not have to carry a TSO.
 
Jack/Bill

As you can see below, I did not build my -12 with a Rotax, so I do not have to put up with the electrical power limitations. With fuel injection, I wanted a dual buss power system for the primary/secondary ECUs and A/B fuel pumps. The 65 amp ND alternator should be able to handle the load, which is 23 amps max so far (Nav/Landing lights not on).

The round gauge below the throttle is a Air-Fuel ratio meter, I also wired a serial input to the Skyview from the same sensor. I have not installed the heater door cable yet, still have some work to do on finding a heater core I like. The blue handle is for the Matco parking brake.

John Salak

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