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Do I have the wrong nutplates?

madmaveric

madmaveric

Well Known Member
Hi all,

As the saying goes ... long time reader here.

I've started building an RV12 a few weeks ago (uk builder) and so far have been having fun but now I find I need some advice.

I came to do the skin nutplates on the empennage (page 06-06) where you have to dimple the nutplates but I'm not sure I have the correct ones, mine have thinner flanges on them.

I noticed that the nutplates I had looked slightly different when unpacking. Luckily I had another build available when I set the other different ones in the spar (he confirmed they were fine and that vans probably changed them since doing the drawings) but now I don't want to continue with the K1100-8 ones until I know they can be dimpled safely (and have enough strength with the thinner flanges on them).

I took some pics (below) to show the ones I have. hopefully this shows the issue of dimpling the rivet holes in the flanges of these (not much metal to dimple on them).

Being new I had to work out which nutplates were which by counting them in the packet as they looked different.

The nutplate and dimple instruction
1_zps0gdwzxux.jpg


Close up of the K1100-08
K1100-08.2_zpstcb9rjov.jpg

K1100-08.1_zpsmxukd87e.jpg


The other nutplate that was different (although I'm happy using this one as it has more metal rather than less).
K1000-3.1_zpsrydrm7uf.jpg

Both of the ones that are different to the drawings
nutplates.1_zpsmoo30yhs.jpg


Is it possible that when packing them the sorter got the flanges mixed up. So the K1000-3 ended up with the flange type expected on the K1100-08 and visa versa?

The main question I have though, are these safe to dimple and use or should I be requesting new ones from Vans.
 
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No worries mate! You got the weight savings version! Actually, just another mfg version of the same thing. In reality, the legs don't do anything but keep the nut plate from turning since you can't get a wrench on it. Otherwise they serve no purpose (well they keep the plates in place until you put a screw into it). Its the threaded part of the nut plate that does the work, just like a regular nut. Build on MacDuff!;)
 
Thanks for the quick reply,

I was hoping that would be the answer but wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something. Being new to this I'm trying to avoid making assumptions :)

maniago said:
No worries mate! You got the weight savings version! Actually, just another mfg version of the same thing. In reality, the legs don't do anything but keep the nut plate from turning since you can't get a wrench on it. Otherwise they serve no purpose (well they keep the plates in place until you put a screw into it). Its the threaded part of the nut plate that does the work, just like a regular nut. Build on MacDuff!;)
Click to expand...
 
BTW, good job being complete with your question. Shows good foresight. I predict you'll do well. Share what you learn often; pay it forward.

Cheers!
 
Nice tip I'll get the highlighter ready for that.

That one solved I now find one of my bags of washers has an odd number of items in it. Should be 40,6 and 1 count but I have 42,5 and 3 of them. Must have been packaged late Friday night lol.
I'll wait to check the others before calling vans in case I need other items.
 
Always double check

Always double check the nut plate thread sizes, you notice they are differences from different manufacturers and sometimes the wrong ones get in the bags from Vans tier2 baggers.

Also, consider using NAS rivets for your nut plates. An NAS rivet has a smaller head than the standard. It is very common for builders to use them for nut plates. I just use the deburring tool, spin it 7 times (your count will vary) and the countersink is perfect, even on .025" material. No need to use (damage) your expensive dimple dies on steel parts.

Check this link http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=56010

This will save you many hours in your build!
 
Another thing to watch out for is nutplates with no threads. I had one or two nutplates that the screw would not thread into. Close examination revealed no threads. It can be difficult to replace a nutplate in some locations.
 
Thanks for all the fast responses guys, it's been fun reading the forums over the last year, to finally be building is even better :D

Hopefully as time goes on I may even get to the point where I can help other out.

I now have the nutplates dimpled and in place thanks to you guys (otherwise I would have been waiting for Vans to open tomorrow to ask them).

IMG_1192.jpg


I went on to start on the R-1203 rib riveting ... possibly my first vans spare parts order coming up depending how the rivet drilling goes. At least removing the rivets is fairly easy (I've done a couple already lol).

I just couldn't seem to stop the rivets expanding between the rib and spar no matter how hard I tried to hold them together (tricky on these ones), I'm going to try the plastic tube trick when I have drilled out the ones I don't like and hope it works better, if not I will set them the other way round (head on the inside, thinner rib part, if I have to).

One other issue I had today was the following bag (there are 42 of the big bunch for those not wanting to count). I guess this one was packaged up on a Friday afternoon, hopefully I will have enough to finish the build. I will ask if I need more on my next order as it's only one short and I guess they add some extras in.

IMG_1181.jpg
 
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Jon,

Get yourself an assortment of clamps. Various sizes and types. Even old fashioned "C" clamps, the type you screw in. When riveting two (or especially more) parts together be creative about using your clamps to hold the pieces tightly together, as close to the rivet as possible. Sometimes clecos are just not enough.

Secondly, when you put photos in your forum messages, reduce the size so they fit on a page. Makes it much easier for us to see them without scrolling the page.

Hope this helps.

John
 
Threads

Mich48041 said:
Another thing to watch out for is nutplates with no threads. I had one or two nutplates that the screw would not thread into. Close examination revealed no threads. It can be difficult to replace a nutplate in some locations.
Click to expand...

Also bad threads. I run a screw into every one. I made a jig to bold the so I can run a screw in. I've found a couple bad ones.
 
Good tip on checking the threads. I hope the 18 ones I put them in yesterday are all ok. I'll look at getting some 'C' style clamps that might be able to get into the tighter areas to make these ones easier.

The photos looked ok on my PC but then I have a large monitor. I'll try and remember to size them down more in future.
 
Reference Picture

The last picture of the OP looks like an excellent Vans reference for the different nutplates. Where did that come from? I'm building a -10 so it may be different, but I don't remember that in the paperwork.

Just thinking it might help prevent a mis-installation.
 
TFeeney said:
The last picture of the OP looks like an excellent Vans reference for the different nutplates. Where did that come from? I'm building a -10 so it may be different, but I don't remember that in the paperwork.

Just thinking it might help prevent a mis-installation.
Click to expand...

It is in Section 5, on page 05-30 of all RV construction manuals.

The latest Rev. of the document can be found HERE
 
The RV9 builder I know said the plans were much better than the ones he had so I guess they improve each new model.

By the time they get to the RV 50 there will be one line in them ...

To assemble your RV50, simply pull the cord and stand well back :D
 
You should feel fortunate that you got these from the outset. My wing kit came with the style shown in your plans, but my recently-received fuselage kit had the style you have photographed. I can't even begin to describe how much this bothers my OCD. I even separated the "new" nutplates from the "old" ones in my hardware bin!

:p
 
Corrected my details now, it should have been Bournemouth but somehow got shortened to Bou lol.

After the tips on these forums I also tried an old tap washer for holding the pieces together while squeezing those rib rivets (something I have seen others say they had issues with).

After using this I didn't have any other rivets expand between the joints :D

rivet%20saver-s_zpsycg5fem7.jpg
 
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