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2000 miles cross country in the winter in an RV-12

dmasys

Member
With the grand total of 15 hours of flight time under its belt, it was time to move the RV-12 from Tennessee to Washington state. It's been a pretty fierce winter in the mid latitudes of the northern hemisphere this year, but it looked like the weather gods would provide a 48 hour respite to make the trek. Turns out that wasn't true. ;-)

I did get the -12 the from Tennessee to Sidney, Nebraska, near the border of Wyoming along Interstate 80 in one day, though had to shoot an instrument approach into Sidney to descent through an ice-containing undercast.

Next morning it was clear skies in Nebraska, Wyoming, and eastern Montana and the northern route through the Rockies (basically I-90) looked better than the I-80 route. Got about another 500 miles along the route toward Seattle but had to put the bird down in Missoula, Montana due to mountain obscuration and blowing snow showers in the mountain valleys. The forecast was for five more days of winter snow in Montana, so it seemed like a good idea to get out of town soon.

Much to my delight, I discovered that a 17 foot U-Haul truck (model code = EL) appears to have been custom designed for RV-12 hauling. Stopped at Home Depot and picked up a couple of 14 foot 2x6s and 4 14 foot 2x4s, some nails and hammer, and built some ramps to roll the -12 up into the truck. Wings stored neatly under the fuselage, encased in bubble wrap and furniture pads, and everything was roped down so it wouldn't move. 12 hours of driving later the -12 arrived at its destination northwest of Seattle, none the worse for having traversed 600 miles of not so good road and two mountain ranges (Grand Tetons and Cascades).

Once again my wife made a photoshow of the trip (though I flew it alone -- she was already out there awaiting my arrival). It's available online at:

http://www.photoshow.com/touch/Dj7DU7qA?language=enu?source=em_ps_show_recipient

Quite an adventure! Overall impression: RV-12 is a great cross country traveler, but it can't compete with the other RVs for leaping over mountain ranges by flying in the upper teens. The I Follow Roads version of IFR also has its limits, particularly during a snowy winter. Good news is that if your -12 gets grounded by weather, you're only a U-Haul truck rental away from getting back underway. :)

-Dan Masys
 
Great job Dan (and Linda Suzanne)! 810 nm westbound in the wintertime in one day... not bad at all. What does your strip in Washington look like?
 
That U-Haul with the tail sticking out has got to be the best fodder for a caption contest that I have seen in a long time! You must have gotten some GREAT looks from folks along the way.

This is a superb example of thinking outside the box to complete a trip with uncooperative weather - it sure helps that the wings come off!
 
Quite a story! Thanks for sharing that with us. Just curious, on a cross country, what RPM/speed did you find comfortable?
 
"had to shoot an instrument approach into Sidney"

Have you added/replaced anything in the standard avionics package to enable that? That seems a nice capability to have!
 
Next morning it was clear skies in Nebraska, Wyoming, and eastern Montana and the northern route through the Rockies (basically I-90) looked better than the I-80 route. Got about another 500 miles along the route toward Seattle but had to put the bird down in Missoula, Montana ...

Sydney to Missoula looks to be over 650 miles straight shot. I'm curious where you gased up along that route. Also, how much more elevation do you think you would have needed to get over the weather and avoid trailering the plane?
 
Phase I?

Nice write-up and photos. Not sure I'd make that trip this time of year. I don't like the cold. :)

Just out of curiosity, if the plane only had 15 hours on it, how could you fly it across the country like that? I was restricted to a 25- x 100-mile corridor for flight testing. Do light sport aircraft not have a Phase I?
 
Answers to questions:
1. Strip in Washington is Blue Ribbon Farms in Sequim (WN29). 2300 foot turf strip.

2. Cross country setting averaged 5200 rpm for TAS of 124 kts. (A little fast, I know. Credit light weight, wheel fairings, and a bit of a cruise pitched prop.)

3. For added equipment, have a Sporty's SP400 VOR/ILS/Glideslope receiver to give the airplane "ground based navigation capability" required by IFR FARs. Also second GPS and ForeFlight geolocated charts running on iPad.

-Dan
 
More answers:

Route from Sidney to Missoula went like this: Sidney - Sheridan WY (280 nm direct); Sheridan WY to Bozeman MT, drive around the north end of the Bighorn Mts, intercepting I-90 at Livingston MT. Bozeman to Missoula, follow I-90 through the passes. Was intending to stay with I-90 to Spokane, then intercept V2 across the Cascades, which has a 10000 foot MEA westbound.

I had a southern route planned also, which on day 1 went from Tennessee to Rawlins, WY. Then over Bear Lake and into the Snake River Valley in ID, picking up V-2 into Washington State. That route has lower MEA's but had a turbulence SIGMET from 18K to surface, and IFR with ice fog the morning I wanted to go that way.

With respect to hours on the meter, the RV-12 has only a 5 hour phase I requirement if licensed as E-LSA.

-Dan
 
...With respect to hours on the meter, the RV-12 has only a 5 hour phase I requirement if licensed as E-LSA.

-Dan

Got it. Thanks for the clarification. Glad you had fun. I think I'd have been much more worried about the tail of the plane hanging out of the U-Haul than the flying part.
 
Ah, the IFR question. It is true that S-LSA's cannot fly IFR. Your E-LSA RV-12 will have an operating limitations issued by your DAR. My operating limitations restrict the plane to VFR during phase 1 testing, and thereafter "unless equipped for night and/or instrument flight conditions" per applicable FARs.

That said, this airplane is nobody's idea of an IFR capable cross country platform like my RV-10 is, and I would not knowingly plan a flight into IMC conditions with it. I am instrumented rated and more importantly current and comfortable in IMC operations, so having to get a pop-up clearance while flying in the clear blue sky to shoot an approach to get through an undercast, with easy IFR conditions (800 ft overcast at Sidney, for example, with 10 mi vis underneath) was a low risk proposition for me. Your mileage may vary...

-Dan
 
IFR approved?

For added equipment, have a Sporty's SP400 VOR/ILS/Glideslope receiver to give the airplane "ground based navigation capability" required by IFR FARs.
Practically speaking and common sense says that you had ample avionics to make that IFR approach. And you felt comfortable with your equipment. I have read reviews that Sporty's SP-400 is more accurate than many panel mounted VOR/ILS/Glideslope receivers. But don't the regulations say that IFR navigation avionics have to be panel mounted? Or do I have that wrong? Regardless of the rules, I am sure that your avionics provide much better situational awareness than most approved IFR panels of yesteryear.
Joe
 
Not aware of any FARs for Experimentals that say avionics functionality has to be built in the panel to be considered available, but I might have missed it. The SP-400 has a goose neck mount that secures it to the plane.

And you are right about the SP-400. It acquires, holds and displays both localizer and glideslope with the same sensitivity and accuracy as the $10K GNS-480 that is panel mounted in my RV-10. And actually has a larger, easier to read needles display than the GRT EFIS in the -10.

-Dan
 
Oh, I didn't answer the question:

"Also, how much more elevation do you think you would have needed to get over the weather and avoid trailering the plane?"

The IFR MEA's in that area of Montana are 13K to 15K.

On Monday, Feb 20 there were lots of sucker holes with bright blue sky above, in the clouds obscuring the mountain tops, so one might have been able to climb to VFR on top, but unfortunately the tops were at 16,000. Since I had a portable O2 bottle with me I might have given it a try, especially since it was so cold that the density altitudes were about 3K lower than actual. But westbound against the winds that prevail at 16K in the winter would have been a pretty dicey proposition. Put 65 kts of headwind on the nose of an RV-12 and you'd be watching the U-Haul trucks move ahead smartly below you. ;-) If I had been going Eastbound, I probably would have climbed up there and given it a look.

-Dan
 
Dan, thanks for posting the follow-up comments about filing IFR with your -12 as it's something I've been trying to research lately. At Sebring's LSA Expo I asked the local FSDO 'experiemental expert' this same question. Altho' his answer was a bit more general in nature (essentially 'if properly equipped per the FARs), he stated that an experimental - even one meeting the LSA standards - could file & fly in the system.

But could you perhaps post a bit more about the DAR's role in this (and perhaps Mel could comment as well)? You stated: "Your E-LSA RV-12 will have an operating limitations issued by your DAR. My operating limitations restrict the plane to VFR during phase 1 testing, and thereafter "unless equipped for night and/or instrument flight conditions" per applicable FARs."

Is this 'operating limitations' language standard stuff and straight from the regs? Is this at the discretion of the DAR? Should an owner be prepared to offer the language to the DAR at the time of the sign-off, somewhat like a request? How the op limits actually come to be set for a given completed a/c is, I suppose, what I'm trying to better understand. As your trip illustrates, I think there are times when it could be safe (in fact, even safer in some circumstances) to file for an approach while enroute VFR. Thus, my curiosity...

Perhaps those of you reading this thread who've already been thru the sign-off process could also comment on the language of your op limits. Perhaps Dan's experience is the norm...?

Thanks, everyone.

Jack
 
With respect to the language enabling IFR operation if appropriately equipped, I only know of three RV-12's in the region: mine, Marty Keller's, and Ron Edmark's. We all got the same language in our operating limitations document. Don't know if this is unique to FSDO's in our area, or a general phenomenon.

-Dan
 
That U-Haul with the tail sticking out has got to be the best fodder for a caption contest that I have seen in a long time! You must have gotten some GREAT looks from folks along the way.

Cross country setting averaged 5200 rpm for TAS of 124 kts. (A little fast, I know. Credit light weight, wheel fairings, and a bit of a cruise pitched prop.)

Something like "Mom! Did you see that truck? It was flying!" ;) I know I know....stop it. :D
 
There was a funny moment when I finally got the truck with plane to Sequim, WA, and stopped in the parking lot of the Home Depot there. When I stepped out of the truck, an elderly man and his wife were staring at the empennage sticking out the back. As I walked by, he just said "Seems like a good idea." Took a minute for me to realize that he meant it was a good modification for a U-Haul. :)

-Dan
 
I thought you might have gotten a comment like "Somebody's a good pilot to land a plane in the back of a truck like that!"
 
"Sporty's SP400 VOR/ILS/Glideslope receiver"

Thanks for the heads-up. I took a look at the SP400 (which to date had completely escaped my notice) and I think it would make a great capability enhancement even if I do let my lapsed IFR rating stay lapsed.

This is what happens when you stop paying attention to Sporty's for everything except free hot dogs on Saturdays.
 
But his lets the extended spar rest on a wood beam, and the other end on a carpet. I think I like that system more.

Like just about everything else on the RV-12, my wife made a little photoshow of the wing cradle construction. : )

See: http://www.photoshow.com/touch/vW7iz9mV?language=enu?source=em_ps_show_recipient

Don't have formal plans for it, but the key dimensions are that the thing is 8 feet long (made with plain old 8 foot 2x4s), the shelf that the spars get clamped to needs to provide at least 26 inches of clearance for the leading edge, and the rig is about 30 inches wide.

Works well for cross town transport when the casters are removed and the bottom rails are screwed to a utility trailer bed.

-Dan
 
But could you perhaps post a bit more about the DAR's role in this (and perhaps Mel could comment as well)? You stated: "Your E-LSA RV-12 will have an operating limitations issued by your DAR. My operating limitations restrict the plane to VFR during phase 1 testing, and thereafter "unless equipped for night and/or instrument flight conditions" per applicable FARs."

Is this 'operating limitations' language standard stuff and straight from the regs? Is this at the discretion of the DAR?

This is not the exact verbage but basically, Daytime VFR during phase I, and must be properly equipped during phase II. right out of 8130.2 and should be included in all operating limitations. DARs are allowed to add more restrictions if they feel it is necessary in the name of safety, but we can't take anything away from the original language as stated in 8130.2.
 
Not necessarily;

Ah, the IFR question. It is true that S-LSA's cannot fly IFR.

From SLSA operating limitations:

(5) This aircraft is to be operated under VFR, day only, unless appropriately equipped for night and/or instrument flight in accordance with ? 91.205, and when allowed by the manufacturer?s operating instructions.
 
From SLSA operating limitations:

(5) This aircraft is to be operated under VFR, day only, unless appropriately equipped for night and/or instrument flight in accordance with ? 91.205, and when allowed by the manufacturer?s operating instructions.

Owning only an E-LSA, I find the S-LSA story on this topic a little confusing. EAA's website has an FAQ on LSA's that includes (at http://www.sportpilot.org/questions/afmviewfaq.asp?faqid=235):

Question :
Which of the S-LSA are certified for IFR flight?

Answer :
At the present time we don't know of any SLSA that are approved by the manufacturer for flight under IFR. You may want to check with the manufacturers of aircraft you are interested in and see if they may be considering approval for IFR.

Also, there was an EAA News release in September 2010 that seemed to make it look pretty dismal (see http://www.eaa.org/news/2010/2010-09-02_astm.asp). The key text seemed to be:
"A subcommittee for ASTM International, which administers the consensus standards for light-sport aircraft, has taken action that would provide better notification to LSA buyers and owners regarding use of the aircraft in instrument conditions. It requires consumer notification that S-LSA do not comply with any design standard for instrument flight operations.

At this time, no Instrument Meteorological Conditions (IMC) design standards have been developed by the ASTM subcommittee. Thus, S-LSA would carry a placard indicating that flight into IMC is prohibited. The placard would not be required or could be removed of the aircraft complied with FAA or ASTM design standards that allowed it to be operated in IMC."

Dunno. Just happy to have an E-LSA and not an S-LSA, even more glad it is and flies like an RV. :)

-Dan
 
Dunno. Just happy to have an E-LSA and not an S-LSA, even more glad it is and flies like an RV. :)

But then you could always "re-certificate" your S-LSA as an E-LSA under 21.191(i)(3). Then you could equip it per 91.205 and operate it IFR. Of course, you would have to be flying as private pilot or above with a current medical.
 
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