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  #31  
Old 06-14-2018, 02:28 AM
scsmith scsmith is offline
 
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Originally Posted by az_gila View Post
No need to be left out. You don't even have to join the secret society.

The color bands are part of the mil-spec and are on the good machined pins/sockets.

There is even no need to remember them though - or buy the secret decoder ring - since the three we use 99.9% of the time are sold by Stein so you can just use the pictures on his web site.

Tooling is also covered by Stein, one low cost tool for regular Dsub pins and a positioner for it (no fancy part number needed) for the Garmin High Density pins.
And just to illustrate my bewilderment, note that Stein shows pictures of the data plates for the various positioners that he supplies to go with the DMC AFM8 crimper. But the Dsub contacts have M-numbers that do not appear on those data plates. So how does one know that that is the correct positioner for that contact, other than because Stein says so?
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  #32  
Old 06-14-2018, 03:48 AM
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snopercod snopercod is offline
 
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(BBROYGBVGW) The mnemonic for remembering this sequence...
I remember two from the olden days. One starts with Bad Boys and the other describes Batman doing something nasty to Robin on Yonder Gotham Building. Giggle...
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  #33  
Old 06-14-2018, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by scsmith View Post
I bet we use 18 gage wire more than 0.1% of the time. Stein doesn't seem to have pins or positioners for those. I agree though, for MOST wiring, what he has is quite helpful.
Try buying Dsub pins for 18g. They seem to only come from Garmin and in very low quantities and high $$$.

Stick to 20g max for Dsub connectors.
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  #34  
Old 06-14-2018, 07:39 AM
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az_gila az_gila is offline
 
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Originally Posted by scsmith View Post
And just to illustrate my bewilderment, note that Stein shows pictures of the data plates for the various positioners that he supplies to go with the DMC AFM8 crimper. But the Dsub contacts have M-numbers that do not appear on those data plates. So how does one know that that is the correct positioner for that contact, other than because Stein says so?
The fancy positioners come into play when you want to crimp other connectors than Dsubs.

Since this thread is for Dsub connectors only, this relatively low cost tool will do the job for one or two RVs...

https://www.steinair.com/product/4-way-indent-crimper/



No need for tool envy over the multi-connector mil-spac crimpers.
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  #35  
Old 06-14-2018, 08:22 AM
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Ironflight Ironflight is offline
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I wanted to use crimps, I really did. I can see how fast it is, how nice to be able to quickly remove the pins to reposition, or to pass the harness through a bulkhead and then re-assemble in the connector. I even had available to borrow from work the expensive crimping tool and an assortment of positoners.

Absent any mentoring from an experienced avionics technician, I confess I could not sort out the bewildering miriad of specifications for what positioner to use with what crimper for what pins. I had no confidence that I could produce quality crimps when I couldn't even sort out which combination of the tools I was supposed to use. Not every avionics device was very clear at all about which tools to use. ( I have to say Garmin does a pretty good job trying to help out with this). I used to say to my self that if a high-school graduate that joins the Air Force and becomes an avionics technician can figure this stuff out, why can't a PhD in Aerodynamics that has done all kinds of sophisticated instrumentation installation for wind tunnel testing figure this out?

So, in the end, I soldered everything. Having heard all the hangar tales, true or not, I was careful to have good strain relief clamping on the backshell of each connector. And yeah, in a few places, forced to apply heat for a long time, some of the plastic bodies of the connectors show a little bit of heat distress. Always tested good. Everything works, and continues to work fine after 500 hrs.

But I really wish I had someone to sit down and say, "use this positioner in this tool with these pins" and I would have crimped everything. And if/when I redo my panel, I will scream for help here, and maybe someone can tell me what tools to use.
Oh, you PhD’s can make things so difficult. You were just working for the wrong center, in the wrong program. We got trained on this stuff in order to properly do In-Flight Maintenance (and to understand what we were asking our “meat servos” to do....). Good multi-day class in the labs at JSC. Fortunately, someone wrote this all down in a guide you can find online:

https://workmanship.nasa.gov/lib/ins.../frameset.html

I have re-pinned so many connectors as I do different avionics things to my airplanes, I shudder to think what it would be like to have to de-solder and then resolder all the time. Separate pins, sockets, and connector bodies are your friends!

Paul
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  #36  
Old 06-14-2018, 09:22 AM
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Nice link Paul...thanks.I'm starting to believe that the solder vs. crimp threads should probably be moved to the never ending debates section!
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  #37  
Old 06-14-2018, 12:25 PM
scsmith scsmith is offline
 
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Originally Posted by jjconstant View Post
Nice link Paul...thanks.I'm starting to believe that the solder vs. crimp threads should probably be moved to the never ending debates section!


That was my first thought when I saw the title of the thread! But I resonated with it because of my troubles.
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  #38  
Old 06-14-2018, 12:32 PM
scsmith scsmith is offline
 
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Originally Posted by az_gila View Post
The fancy positioners come into play when you want to crimp other connectors than Dsubs.

Since this thread is for Dsub connectors only, this relatively low cost tool will do the job for one or two RVs...

https://www.steinair.com/product/4-way-indent-crimper/



No need for tool envy over the multi-connector mil-spac crimpers.
I mostly agree Gil, except that the "real" tools have different crimp settings for different gage wire. The cheaper tool just gives one crimp depth, which may be ok on average, but not as good as the proper crimp pressure set for each gage.

So, accept for a moment that I have the expensive tool already (borrowed) and I just want to find which positioner in the bag of assorted positioners is the right one for my pins. The MS number for the pins do not appear on the data plates of any of the positioners, including the ones that Stein says are the right ones. So......I don't know.

Maybe the link that Paul posted will help.

And, good advise on sticking to 20 AWG. Although, most things have a DC power in and a ground that both would like to be a little heavier. Several of my avionics boxes call for it, including the Garmin GDL-82. Yes, the Garmin pins for 18 AWG are SUPER pricey.
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  #39  
Old 06-14-2018, 01:13 PM
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RV6_flyer RV6_flyer is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjconstant View Post
Nice link Paul...thanks.I'm starting to believe that the solder vs. crimp threads should probably be moved to the never ending debates section!
Quote:
Originally Posted by scsmith View Post


That was my first thought when I saw the title of the thread! But I resonated with it because of my troubles.
Agree. No difference than Primer.
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  #40  
Old 06-15-2018, 08:10 AM
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Snowflake Snowflake is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by az_gila View Post
And get the machined barrel crimp pins -



Not the cheaper stamped version -



They will be much easier to work with. Steinair has them.
Except, one of those is a pin, and the other is a socket...
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