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Tsam gets the Angles?.

Ironflight

VAF Moderator / Line Boy
Mentor
Last Oshkosh we got a deal from a fellow builder on a new-in-the-box AFS AoA Pro system. Having flown the system in the RV-8 for a year or more, both Louise and I have grown to really like the added insight into the lift margin that you get, and decided that having it in the RV-3 would be a big plus. Moves and life changes being what they are, this week was the first opportunity I have had to get it installed ? during Tsamisyu?s condition inspection. Heck ? the tips and covers are off ? why not run something through the openings? Installation was actually quite straightforward ? building a flap limit switch was the most difficult fabrication job, and then running wires took a couple of hours. The finished product looks like it belongs there!

P1000839.JPG

(BTW, that picture was taken inside a fully closed hangar- all three GPS?s locked on with lightning speed ? I guess having a wood-decked, asphalt-shingled hangar roof has advantages!)

I took the plane up for calibration runs today and boy, was that fun. Basically, you do a flaps up and flaps down run, and in each run, you have to establish Zero-G and push a button while you?re there, and then establish Stall+15% and do another button push there. The instructions do say ?have a co-pilot (with a barf bag handy) and let them do the button pushing?. Easier said than done in a single-place airplane?.:p

The flaps-up run was simple, with the zero-G run quite enjoyable ? climb at a steep angle, push over and get five or six seconds in which to push the button, then recover. Just like the vomit comet, only slower. The flaps down run was just about as challenging of a flight test maneuver as I have done in a long time. The flap speed on a -3 is pretty low (87 knots), so establishing the speed below that limit, then pushing over (without a lot of energy) puts you about 45 degrees nose low when you establish a steady zero-G, then when you have finished releasing the button, given reaction time, you are pointed straight down ? and accelerating?with the flaps still down! So you have to be really quick, and really precise. A wonderful challenge, and no metal was bent.

P1000841.JPG


Why not just use the AoA on the G3X? Because I like Tsam?s blade pitot tube, and don?t want to change it?.besides, I really like a glareshield mount for the AoA indicator.

The only thing about adding an AoA? You find out just how much ?too fast? you have been flying your normal approaches?.:rolleyes:

Paul
 
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Sweet installation, Paul. I too have a blade pitot , and an AoA would be very nice to have. I missed what you used as an air pressure sensor. Leading edge?
 
I already made a decision that I will have a glare shield mounted AoA display.
When you need the information an AoA display gives the most is when you should be looking inside the cockpit the least.
 
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Blade pitot?

Why not just use the AoA on the G3X? Because I like Tsam?s blade pitot tube, and don?t want to change it?.besides, I really like a glareshield mount for the AoA indicator.

Sweet installation, Paul. I too have a blade pitot , and an AoA would be very nice to have. I missed what you used as an air pressure sensor. Leading edge?


I have a blade pitot too, and will probably be to the point of fitting it in a couple months. My first thought is to use the "static" port on the blade for AOA sensing and use the standard blind rivet static ports on the fuselage, but that might not work. Anyone know if it's been tried?

If it doesn't work, I'll probably do another pop rivet on the underside of the leading edge like some of the -12 guys have done.
 
Those of you that might be on the fence regarding AOA.

I recently had to make the impossible turn back to the runway or try landing in some very steep rocky and cactus strewn terrain, (no need to go into that debate). I cannot credit the AOA for making the impossible turn possible, but I sure do remember watching those lights out of the corner of my eye as I took it nearly knife edge on the way around.

It was very comforting to know that even if I was not watching out the corner of my eye, Betty was ready to say the magic words, "angle angle push push", if I got to close to the stall point.

In my view an AOA is mandatory safety equipment and puts the old stall warning used on Cessnas etc. in the dark ages.

It is also very nice to have on "normal" approaches:)

Randall
 
Those of you that might be on the fence regarding AOA.

In my view an AOA is mandatory safety equipment and puts the old stall warning used on Cessnas etc. in the dark ages.

It is also very nice to have on "normal" approaches:)

Randall

I coudn't agree more!
 
I operate an RV12 out of a home 1260 foot strip. LOVE the AOA but can't be looking at it on final! My Skyview makes an increasing-frequency beeping noise as the AOA increases (besides and matching the indicator on the display.) For me, that is the ideal interface - I never have to look down. I can ride the proper beeping all the way down. Do other brands of AOA have similar audio output?

Note, the Tsam mounting location also eliminates the look-down problem. But at the cost of always taking up some of your field of view even when not really needed. But the Skyview has no remote indicator unless you created one yourself somehow and interfaced it.
 
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I operate an RV12 out of a home 1260 foot strip. LOVE the AOA but can't be looking at it on final! My Skyview makes an increasing-frequency beeping noise as the AOA increases (besides and matching the indicator on the display.) For me, that is the ideal interface - I never have to look down. I can ride the proper beeping all the way down. Do other brands of AOA have similar audio output?

Note, the Tsam mounting location also eliminates the look-down problem. But at the cost of always taking up some of your field of view even when not really needed. But the Skyview has no remote indicator unless you created one yourself somehow and interfaced it.

Anyone who has read my writing on AoA knows that I am a strong proponent of an audio AoA Bill, but even a visual indicator is better than having nothing - and having one in the field of view is far better than having it on the panel. I have also written about that - EFIS display AoA's, without audio, are of little use to me in the pattern.

And actually, the AFS Pro display takes away no field of view in either the -8 or the -3. If you draw a line from your eyeballs to the top of the spinner that you see from the pilot's seat, the AoA indicator is beneath that line - so all it blocks is a view of the top cowl. The AoA Pro has a large enough display that you can see and interpret it out of the corner of your eye - an advantage of the simple "string of LED" type displays.
 
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Angels?

When I first saw this thread, I thought it said "Tsam gets the Angels" and I envisioned Paul having an angel strike at extremely high altitude!
 
Ironflight wrote
.....besides, I really like a glareshield mount for the AoA indicator.

I asked the Garmin team in this forum about a glare-shield AoA display for their G3X AoA when it first came out and they responded they are considering it. This was nearly a year ago.
Not sure whether that means it is actively under consideration, or that it is not a high priority but maybe in the future.
I hope it is the former, as in the line of sight is where AoA becomes more useful.
John
 
Totally agree any AOA is better than no AOA!!!
The sight line that you have resolves that issue. On some planes I have seen an indicator tucked to the side, not blocking view, but still in peripheral vision. Or mounted horizontally to minimize blocking. Or for an RV slider with a center post, it could be mounted at the bottom of the post, not sacrificing any view.

I don't know how many separate segments are on the AFS indicator but I bet someone with electronics capability could take that signal and map them to a sound producing chip. Or imagine those segments repeated to a low-profile set of LEDS mounted on the top arc of the instrument panel, taking up no frontal view. For some planes that would be better than a vertical-format indicator device.
 
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