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Push Button Start

jeffwhip

Well Known Member
I'm at that stage where I'm designing my panel and am considering a push button start. I'd like to get your opinion because I am torn...let me explain.

1. If I were to use a simple push button start (keyless) then it would make it much easier for someone to steal the airplane. I've read enough here to know that the most likely scenario is that someone breaks in and steals the avionics.

2. If I go this route, I also have a safety concern. Last summer I watched some kids pulling on the propeller of a friends plane after he had stepped away to take a phone call. I immediately intervened! I realize the likelihood of a plane starting from a child turning the propeller is slim, but If I go with a push button start I'm there seems to be a greater risk to this happening.

3. If I were to hide a ground switch that had to be down in order for the push button start to be hot, then I feel like I'm introducing another way for this to fail when I might need it the most (inflight engine failure).

4. Perhaps there is a way to program the Vertical Power Pro so that the CB to the start button is always popped on powerup, meaning I would have to manually "reset" it on every start up?

Well, those are my thoughts and would love to get your input. Has anyone else went this route and what did you do?
 
I have a key that has ON/OFF positions. ON - makes the push button Hot. OFF - makes the push button Cold. Take the key with you for added security. After start, I immediately move the key back to off in case of an inadvertent button push.
 
My decision to use a push button start is simple: We lost the key. Took an hour...off-station!...to find the key and proceed. Yes, I know, I could carry a spare key, but this made that particular risk go away for me.

Stolen aircraft? Insurance.
 
I owned an FBO that had a maintenance shop years ago. Someone just barely touched a prop while the airplane was in the maintenance hangar and the engine tried to turn over. No one, fortunately, was hurt. Just wanted to point out that it can and has happened. When I see children and non aviators around airplanes I give them the speech about touching any propeller. I don?t point out the difference between piston and turbine aircraft because I doubt a non aviator could tell the difference.
 
Using the Vertical Power system you have to power it up before the starter button will engage. At least that was the way I wired the system. So there is no accidental starting the motor.
 
Push Button

Push button inside a guard for start - master switch has to be on to provide power to the start switch and starter circuit. Ignition is controlled through a pair of locking toggle switches. Doesn't really protect against theft (but I wasn't really worried about that). You would have to leave a bunch of stuff on before it was a real safety issue.
FWIW - that's what I did.
 
Mine is a simple three position honeywell switch....off/master on/momentary start. I may end up incorporating a hidden toggle switch somewhere under the dash that I'll run the small solenoid engage wire through that I can turn off when I'm parked in an unfamiliar location. This would prevent accidental starts...and "maybe" prevent theft.

Mark
 
Safety switch

I wired a guarded cut-out switch inside my forward baggage compartment...which is lockable. Lets me leave the canopy open without fear of someone pushing a hot starter button.
 
i have two aircraft, both with push-button start and toggle switches for the ignition. The Start button is under a guard. After the first airplane I changed approach and put the ignition switches in the Space Shuttle guards from Perihelion Designs.

Now for some reasoning...
How Do I Address Safety Concerns?
1) the START switch is NOT labelled, quite intentionally, and under a standard MS-style red toggle switch cover. One can't touch it by accident - it takes a conscious flipping up of the cover before the push button is exposed.

2) the START circuit breaker is secured with a Boeing CB collar when the aircraft is in a location where it may be touched by others or is out of my sight. The collar is a tough devil to get off, so a kid would have to have some pretty strong fingers to get it to work.

3) the ignition switches are in those fancy Space Shuttle guards from Perihelion Designs. They are straight AN toggle switches. The Space Shuttle guards allow a cable lock to be slid through them above the toggle switch levers. The only way one can get the toggle to flip to the "live" position is to remove the cable lock.

I'm sure somebody is going to ask why toggles for the ignition. That's because I've seen too many failed key switches. One of them I got to see up close, as our floatplane was being driven onto the rocks by a strong wind while the @#$%ing ignition key switch wouldn't allow the starter to engage!

I know you have a VPX which either complicates things further or gives you an easier solution to deactivate the start circuit, depending on how you want to approach it. I'm sure you'll scratch your head for a bit and come up with an excellent solution.
 
I just wired up my starter switch last week. The starter switch isn't hot until the position lights are on, even with the master on.

The mags are 2 separate switches.

My thought behind the position switch is, should an emergency happen in flight and I need to try a restart I wanted it to be natural, and not some odd combination to make the starter active again. On the flip side, when I park the airplane, and turn everything off, should a thief or innocent child be inside flipping switches they would have to first turn on the master, then then position lights, then starter. A sequence neither the kid or thief would probably think to do, but as the owner something that will become normal for me without thinking.

I hope it works and if someone sees a flaw in my idea I am all ears.
 
I am interested in this one as well having just wired my starter switch, exactly the same set up as Jeff in the above post except I used the strobe circuit to enable the start button.
 
Using the Vertical Power system you have to power it up before the starter button will engage. At least that was the way I wired the system. So there is no accidental starting the motor.

Dave,
Can you give me any guidance on how to set that up?
 
I wired a guarded cut-out switch inside my forward baggage compartment...which is lockable. Lets me leave the canopy open without fear of someone pushing a hot starter button.

I thought about doing something like this, but should the switch in the baggage compartment fail inflight and you subsequently had an engine failure, the engine would not start. Hence, I'm trying to find a way to balance safety yet keep the start sequence simple. I'm not throwing stones at anyone who has done this, simply trying to figure this out!
 
I do push button start switches on 90% of my panel installs, on a few occasions customers wanted a way to kill the start circuit so I will mount the start CB on the lower bent edge of the panel or somewhere out of the way but easily reachable, so the breaker can be pulled to disable the system if desired.
 
I thought about doing something like this, but should the switch in the baggage compartment fail inflight and you subsequently had an engine failure, the engine would not start. Hence, I'm trying to find a way to balance safety yet keep the start sequence simple. I'm not throwing stones at anyone who has done this, simply trying to figure this out!

Just realize that in most cases, when teh engine quits, the poropellor keeps windmilling - you have to fly very, very slowly (and intentionally) to get it to stop. Bottom line - you don?t need a starter to restart in the air. Just restore fuel and/or spark.
 
Just realize that in most cases, when teh engine quits, the poropellor keeps windmilling - you have to fly very, very slowly (and intentionally) to get it to stop. Bottom line - you don?t need a starter to restart in the air. Just restore fuel and/or spark.

Just to add to what Ironflight says, If the failure is such that the prop isn't windmilling, you probably shouldn't use the starter anyway.
 
I too am thinking of a push button start switch.

My concerns are not accidentally hitting the starter or a stolen airplane. No, My concern is leaving the mags hot while I'm outside the airplane.

For over 40 years, when I'm not in the airplane (ie preflight), if I'm going to touch the propeller, I look up to see if the keys are on the glare shield. If not, I check the mag switch and/or check my pockets for the keys. I haven't got beyond how to remedy that with a keyless system except maybe with dual P-mags that's not an issue.
 
I use a push button starter and two switches for the two mags. The right mag has a double pole double throw switch, If the switch is off, then the P lead is not grounded and the starter solenoid is not powered. If the switch is on, then the P lead is grounded and the starter solenoid is live, just waiting for the button to be pushed. Works well and starting I turn R mag off, press the button and when it fires turn the right mag on, which kills power to the start button.
 
I don't have anything against keyed ignition and have flown a ton of them, but it's mostly a modern Cessna singe engine thing isn't it? (By modern, I mean anything since about 1970).

-Lots of old Piper singles are keyless start
-The C170 that I fly is a keyless start
-The A36 Bonanza that I fly has a keyless start
-Every prop twin and turboprop that I've ever flown has been keyless start.

It's not like those airplanes are extremely hazardous or more likely to be stolen than anything else. As far as accidentally leaving the mags hot, you're supposed to be using a shutdown checklist so that doesn't happen, regardless of what you fly.

I'm a big talker since I haven't even started building and RV yet, but when I do it will likely have a couple of guarded toggles for the ignitions and a simple guarded pushbutton for the starter, based on my theory that simpler is almost always better.
 
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